Another insurance thread

It's insurance renewal time and since I won't be going to the Bahamas this year I"m shopping for the best deal.
Progressive is ton's cheaper than Boat US but their fuel and other spill liability coverage is about a third of BoatUS's.

Does anyone have any experience with this type of coverage? Progressive includes it in their comprehensive coverage not as a separate coverage as BoatUS does. So with BoatUS they cover comprehensive if there is a claim and if there is a fuel spill, cover that up the limit of the fuel spill coverage. With Progressive since Fuel Spill is included in comprehensive, their is a lot less coverage, but only if you are charged a fuel spill fee.

What do you guys think?

timjet said:

What do you guys think?

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Don't spill fuel

timjet said:

It's insurance renewal time and since I won't be going to the Bahamas this year I"m shopping for the best deal.
Progressive is ton's cheaper than Boat US but their fuel and other spill liability coverage is about a third of BoatUS's.

Does anyone have any experience with this type of coverage? Progressive includes it in their comprehensive coverage not as a separate coverage as BoatUS does. So with BoatUS they cover comprehensive if there is a claim and if there is a fuel spill, cover that up the limit of the fuel spill coverage. With Progressive since Fuel Spill is included in comprehensive, their is a lot less coverage, but only if you are charged a fuel spill fee.

What do you guys think?

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I hate it when automotive terms and definitions are used in marine insurance

For your vessel policy, you want to have a separate sublimit for pollution coverage; that limit should (at the least), match your liability (P&I) coverage. The USCG statutory maximum limit on pollution damages for uninspected passenger vessels is $854,400, and some marine policies automatically cover to that limit.

If you are tapped for pollution damages, be mindful that the costs to you will include:

• costs to boom your boat to control the spill
• costs to clean up the spill
• costs of all environmental impact assessments (to ascertain the amount of damage your spill has or MAY do to the flora and fauna in the affected area)
• spill disposal costs
• etc, etc, etc

More is better- you don't want your pollution coverage tied in as a part of the P&I (Protection and Indemnity) coverage.

On my opening comment- "Comprehensive" coverage is an automotive coverage. Marine coverages are defined as "partial" or "total" loss scenarios.

In my opinion, Progressive is a terrible choice for large vessels such as we have. The policy wording is weak, and Progressive sells the lowest pricing to the retail customer vice the correct coverages for the client. We had a Progressive appointment for many years, and quickly found it paled in comparison to other carrier- we still have a few on the books, but ceased offering Progressive years ago.

sunchaser said:

Don't spill fuel

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Why didn't I think of that

Thanks Peter, I also read your sticky on the bayliner forum, very informative.

I also have an umbrella policy, so perhaps that will make up the difference.

timjet said:

Thanks Peter, I also read your sticky on the bayliner forum, very informative.

I also have an umbrella policy, so perhaps that will make up the difference.

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Tim, check the wording on your umbrella policy; 99% of the time they will cover only general liability concerns. Specialty marine concerns like pollution or wreck removal are usually not covered/excluded from umbrella coverages.

timjet said:

It's insurance renewal time and since I won't be going to the Bahamas this year I"m shopping for the best deal.
Progressive is ton's cheaper than Boat US but their fuel and other spill liability coverage is about a third of BoatUS's.

Does anyone have any experience with this type of coverage? Progressive includes it in their comprehensive coverage not as a separate coverage as BoatUS does. So with BoatUS they cover comprehensive if there is a claim and if there is a fuel spill, cover that up the limit of the fuel spill coverage. With Progressive since Fuel Spill is included in comprehensive, their is a lot less coverage, but only if you are charged a fuel spill fee.

What do you guys think?

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I am more concerned about Liability insurance than coverage of the boat. 1 million liability and appraised value of the boat with a 10 grand deductible. If you bundle your insurance, boat, house, vehicle etc the over all rate is usually cheaper as they get more premium to spread the risk. Our insurance is 1 mil Liability and 1 mil uninsured.

Is the Progressive policy a Yacht Policy? That may be part of the reason for the difference. Personally, I wouldn't want a policy that (a) has less than the statutory limit for oil polution and/or (b) does't break that coverage out from the rest of the coverage limits. We had Boat US for years and recently switched to ACE. ACE gave us pretty much the same coverage for much less on the Tug. BoatUS was much better on the sailboat. We have friends who like Travelers. Just make sure it is a yacht policy. Also, we like to make sure that any salavage coverage has a separate limit from the comprehensive part of the policy.

I was with ACE but switched to Foremost two years ago. Tow Boat was always the most expensive by far for us. Not sure why.

Tim--- You might want to talk to Anchor Marine about what kind of policy will best suit your requirements. They are a broker so will shop around to find you the best policy for your needs at the best price. We have been with them since we bought our GB in 1998 and have been very happy with the policies they've gotten us. So far we've not had to make a claim but the yacht policies we've had and have now covered every contingency I think we're likely to encounter.

While Anchor Marine's offices are in Seattle and Anchorage it's my understanding that they will work with boaters and shipping companies all over the US and I believe even internationally.

We have no connection with the company other than being a customer. Might be worth a phone call or an e-mail......

Marin said:

Tim--- You might want to talk to Anchor Marine about what kind of policy will best suit your requirements. They are a broker so will shop around to find you the best policy for your needs at the best price.

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I'll second Marin's suggestion. I have a relatively difficult boat ton insure (50 years old, wood) and they have been very accommodating.

Scott Welch
Island Eagle

Phil Fill said:

I am more concerned about Liability insurance than coverage of the boat. 1 million liability and appraised value of the boat with a 10 grand deductible. Our insurance is 1 mil Liability and 1 mil uninsured.

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I don`t understand insurance including " 1 mil uninsured".
I think you are right to be concerned and we are less litigious than USA.1 million Liability cover sounds woefully inadequate, my policy equivalent is 10 million. In the Policy it is called "3rd party", I`d call it Public Liability, I think they are the same,different names.

You get what you pay for. My brother had a terrible experience with ACE. BoatUS is hands down the best marine insurance policy written available.

albin43 said:

You get what you pay for. My brother had a terrible experience with ACE. BoatUS is hands down the best marine insurance policy written available.

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Indeed, you are correct- caveat emptor is the rule all of us should strive to remember.

You also make a very subjective statement. The ACE yacht policy is very strong and comprehensive. However, ACE, Travelers, Markel, and other insuring companies offer both the Yacht (agreed value/all risk) and Boat (Actual Cash Valuation/named perils) policies.

How your brother's claim was handled is impacted by which policy type he had, as well as the type of loss, deductible chosen, and more. If you brother expected the policy to handle everything, and didn't bother to read his policy to ascertain the exclusions, I can understand his grumpiness.

Obviously there is a ton of info I don't know about the situation, and my comments are more general in nature. I'm not trying to make light of the situation- but I run into this on a regular basis, and have to gently explain that there are situations where the policy will not cover the insured.

albin43 said:

You get what you pay for. My brother had a terrible experience with ACE. BoatUS is hands down the best marine insurance policy written available.

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Also, the Boat US policy is decent, but easy to poke holes in. It's no better that ACE, Travelers, Markel, One Beacon, or American Reliable. The best policy on the market is the Travelers Luxury Yacht form, with excludes only; wear and tear, electrolysis, lack of maintenance, mysterious disappearance, corrosion, deterioration, mold, and fiberglass blistering. That's it. Even manufacturer's defect is covered- which no other policy does.