To varnish or paint? There in lies the question

Peter B · Feb 17, 2013

Daddyo said:
Well it turns out I didn't have the choice. Some paint and discoloration was just too deep to get out So epoxy and paint it is. First coat of epoxy is on and yeah it looks like almost good brightwork.

Daddy's, if this is in time, you might still be able to cetol the cockpit door, as in my previous post. It will then look nearly as good as varnish, but it is more forgiving of imperfect paint removal....and, as others mentioned, a helluva lot more forgiving when it comes to re-coating. Just a thought. If it sucks, then not hard to paint over like the pilot doors, but I think you might enjoy one "almost varnished" door..?
I know I do.

BruceK · Feb 17, 2013

Daddyo said:
.. turns out I didn't have the choice. Some paint and discoloration was just too deep to get out...

I would have liked to take my painted transom back to teak, but knew it would not be a success. Someone else`s shortcut can be permanent.

Marin · Feb 17, 2013

This is why if one decides to paint raw or stripped teak instead of finishing it bright the wood should be sealed with CPES or even varnish before being painted. Then if it's decided later by the owner or the next owner to refinish the wood bright, the paint will not have been able to get down into the grain and the wood can be taken back to raw and a good-looking bright finish applied.

Daddyo · Feb 18, 2013

Marin said:
This is why if one decides to paint raw or stripped teak instead of finishing it bright the wood should be sealed with CPES or even varnish before being painted. Then if it's decided later by the owner or the next owner to refinish the wood bright, the paint will not have been able to get down into the grain and the wood can be taken back to raw and a good-looking bright finish applied.

This is what I have always done in the past for two reasons. One, it leaves the door open for the next owner to varnish. Two, thinned epoxy or varnish is an excellent primer/sealer for the oily teak.

Daddyo · Feb 18, 2013

Peter B said:
Daddy's, if this is in time, you might still be able to cetol the cockpit door, as in my previous post. It will then look nearly as good as varnish, but it is more forgiving of imperfect paint removal....and, as others mentioned, a helluva lot more forgiving when it comes to re-coating. Just a thought. If it sucks, then not hard to paint over like the pilot doors, but I think you might enjoy one "almost varnished" door..?
I know I do.

Thanks but I do not have a cockpit door. Three doors all leading to the side decks.

Daddyo · Feb 18, 2013

Delfin said:
DO, Cetol is nice, and it should adhere fine to a properly applied penetrating epoxy substrate, but it is no where near as pretty as a varnished surface, IMO. Paint teak? I believe that would be the recommendation of the person who restored the artwork, below.

If you want the perfect look, do a good job of sanding, or removing all the paint using chemical stripper or heat gun and a pull scraper. Sand well, apply thinned epoxy to saturate the wood, wet sand to smooth, slop on a few coats of Interprime sealer to fill the grain, quick sand flat, then apply about 8 coats of Flagship varnish. Don't bother sanding between all coats, just the 4th and 7th. This may sound like overkill, but when you have the piece off the boat and on the bench, the difference between 3 coats of Cetol and 8 coats of varnish is about an hour and a half extra work. The difference in appearance, however, is well worth the effort.

After applying the epoxy, wait at least 3 days before applying anything else - this is important.

Just one man's opinion.

The art restoration equivalent of painting teak:

Awesome!!

Nomad Willy · Feb 18, 2013

Ron, rwidman wrote that it's a crime to paint teak because it costs so much.
he's right BUT ...

I feel it has mostly to do w how beautiful it is when well finished clear.
I'm always amazed how my teak cap rail can look so old and forgotten only to quickly become stunningly beautiful. The wood is just too beautiful to cover up.

Like many/most others I think the problem that makes teak so troublesome is it's oil. The natural oil in the wood. If you've ever sanded teak the oil is very apparent as the "sand dust" sticks together somewhat as though it had oil in it (haha) and the wood itself is a bit greasy feeling like some plastic. For this reason I've decided to use oil based products on teak and quit fighting the un-winnable battle between oily teak and un-oily finishes. My primers are made up of heavy oil products like linseed oil, tung oil, pine tar, and also kerosene and turpentine to help keep the water from getting under the top coat. It's been very successful on a piece of plywood on my fore deck for several years. And I've been using only the oils on my teak cap rail for about 5 years so a full blown test is in order.

Codger2 · Feb 18, 2013

Delfin said:
Paint teak? I believe that would be the recommendation of the person who restored the artwork, below.

The art restoration equivalent of painting teak:

Don't be shy! Tell us what you really think! (I love this!)

Phil Fill · Feb 18, 2013

Daddyo said:
Thanks but I do not have a cockpit door. Three doors all leading to the side decks.

If multi coats of epoxy/varnish is applied it might cover the remaining paint. Teak has alot of grain and some imperfection, so it should not be admired from nose length. Beside no body is going to be as critical as you.

Codger2 · Feb 18, 2013

Delfin said:
DO, Cetol is nice, and it should adhere fine to a properly applied penetrating epoxy substrate, but it is no where near as pretty as a varnished surface, IMO.

I agree but I will admit to hiring my varnish jobs out. I have neither the patience or the expertise to apply varnish properly.

CPseudonym · Feb 18, 2013

Walt, how is your swimboard finished? My natural teak looks hideous.

Codger2 · Feb 18, 2013

CPseudonym said:
Walt, how is your swimboard finished? .

Craig: I use Starbrite Golden Teak on the swim step. I tried just about everything else but they didn't last more than 2 or 3 outings and they were gone. Keep in mind that I started with a brand new swim step a few years ago. All the other exterior teak is Epithane.

CPseudonym · Feb 18, 2013

Thanks Walt. I don't expect my old girls swimboard to look as good but anything should be an improvement.

RT Firefly · Feb 18, 2013

Greetings,
MSDS for Starbrite Teak Oil lists 2 components. Linseed oil (boiled I assume) and kerosene (what hydrotreated is I don't know). That's not to say there aren't trace amounts of UV protectants or hardeners in the Starbrite product but most, if not all, teak oils are basically the same thing.
http://www.starbrite.com/msdssheets/81616-msds-6-18-05.pdf

healhustler · Feb 21, 2013

I'm guilty. I've painted all but the veranda area of my exterior teak. Inside, I'm adding more natural teak to window trim and valences. When I get my boat under control, I may go back to natural on the outside too. But I doing my veranda cap rail, transom frame, ladder steps, engine vents, etc., and I don't kid myself about how much time it takes from other things I need to do on the boat. Still, doing the woodwork is my way of caressing my precious boat. It deserves it.

Pineapple Girl · Feb 21, 2013

rwidman said:
Ever priced teak lumber? I didn't think so.

YES. No way would I paint it. :nonono:

I'm so sorry Daddyo that you were left with no choice. You tried! :banghead:

Pineapple Girl · Feb 21, 2013

Sailor of Fortune said:
Nothing looks worse than "almost there" when stripping/sanding previously painted brightwork. I know the costs involved but, I stand by my observations that almost good brightwork just plain sucks.
Sorry if I offended any yacht club commodores.

LOL that is an excellent point re "almost good" looking BAD, especially when critiquing one's own work. We are not that great at brightwork so we have a guy keep up the exterior teak for us (luckily there isn't much, we keep it covered with Sunbrella most of the time AND we are in a covered slip). Our doors are painted and gel coated on the outside and only varnished on the inside. So it really isn't fair for me to say that teak shouldn't be painted. I guess I turned into a snob from being a yacht club commodore. :facepalm:

windmill29130 · Feb 26, 2013

rwidman said:
But more people see them at the dock than at sea.

Ever priced teak lumber? I didn't think so.

If you knew how much it cost you would understand why people say its a crime to paint it.

Quit hanging out at the dock, you might as well buy a condo overlooking the water!

To varnish or paint? There in lies the question

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