Anchor size, big is better?

manyboats said:

The main reason I avoid too much chain is to keep my ground tackle light, simple and inexpensive. I now have a system that works very well but I'd rather have one a bit more convenient. Standing on the bow and pulling hard on the drum winch is bad (a bit) for my back. When I get to be 80 I'll probably go all chain ... or do a splice and a combo rode.

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Eric, sorry, do you have to haul up your winch manually. I thought you had a hydraulic powered one now. No wonder you want to keep things light.
C'mon my man, at your age - at any age - with any boat over 30 feet, you need a powered anchor winch. It's one unwritten rule of the sea, didn't yah know...?

IN Florida most folks that are here during the summer will be exposed to thunderstorms , frequently more than one a day.

A CB can have 40K-50K of breeze with a few puffs that are 50% harder .

Since there is loads of sand , anchoring is less of a hassle than the rain.

In the Carib one cure to leaving hatches open, and going ashore was the

Automatic Hatch Closing System.

Not at all pricy it consists of a small triangle of wood glued into a corner of a hatch. The wood would have about a 1/4 inch tapered hole drilled from the top.

To arm the system an aspirin would be placed on the hole , a chop stick put on the aspirin propping the hatch open.

Not perfect , but the price is right for thunderstorm anchoring.

Peter,
Here is my foredeck. Last year I bought and installed the drum winch and 3 cleats on the foredeck mounted on a piece of 1 1/8th" plywood. The large center cleat is dedicated for holding the anchor rode. The other two cleats are for mooring lines.

That little winch is very small and makes an awful racket when running w or w/o a load on it. It's got planetary gears. It does not lack power. I hauled up a small tree sized tree branch while anchoring near a river and the little winch operated and sounded like it always does. My line wants to creep to port "Rode Creep" a little too much but I'm apprehensive about disturbing the deck seal to adjust it. My hard pulling is mostly from trying to keep the line from running off the end of the drum to port. I'm hoping to get a saddle shaped drum and that that should solve the problem.

And if you've been following along lately you know I'm not keen on unwritten rules or even some written rules. I like to prove things to myself before I spend the rest of my life doing X when I could be doing Y. I do, however probably accept many more rules than I reject. To put your mind at ease of course.

See that little line below? My name is below it to use. Many usernames are like a foreign language and difficult to copy. It's going to be there so you needn't refer to me as manyboats.

Pleased you are not hauling it all up by hand, I am.
Yes, understand your name is Eric, I do. To me Eric of Nomadwilly you will always be.

Yoda

Sorry...something came over me there....

Eric, for some months now I've thought of you as "Many-Anchors Eric."

Peter,
Peter ... You mean you haul a 30# anchor and 20 or more feet of chain by HAND??? You're a good anchor winch.
Yes I was sorry I changed my username to Manyboats not long after I'd done it. I know we learn to associate certain things w other things and people are no exception. But when I wanted to change it back there were a lot of new people on the forum and I had come to dislike others changing their avatars frequently. When there's people on the forum changing their identity things regularly it becomes hard to tell who's who. This is a bigger issue on Face Book. Anyway I don't think I should change it back. Yoda? ... is that your new avatar?

Mark,
Guilty. I've only got 6 now. I parted w one of my babies.

manyboats said:

First of all I doubt that many boaters have an accurate account of how much line/rode they actually have out there

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We and the boaters we know know exactly how much rode we have out a any given time because we have our chains marked. Some do it with paint. We do it with plastic wire ties every ten feet. The few boaters we know with combination rodes (sailboaters) have color tapes woven into the strands of their nylon rodes to mark off lengths.

My rode is marked. As I recal, the marks are every thirty feet. It's the markers sold at West Marine.

Marin said:

We and the boaters we know know exactly how much rode we have out a any given time because we have our chains marked. Some do it with paint. We do it with plastic wire ties every ten feet. The few boaters we know with combination rodes (sailboaters) have color tapes woven into the strands of their nylon rodes to mark off lengths.

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I agree that most of the cruisers I know have their ground tackle marked/maintained......but many of the day trippers/weekenders around here barely know what they have for anchor/rode or even how to anchor...

psneeld said:

but many of the day trippers/weekenders around here barely know what they have for anchor/rode or even how to anchor...

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That's the metal thingy tied to the rope, right?

Tie a knot in it and toss it off the front of the boat when ya wanna stop

Did I mention any names guys? I said "many boaters". Sometimes I may have too much line out there to because when I'm in doubt I'll put out some more.

rwidman said:

My rode is marked. As I recal, the marks are every thirty feet. It's the markers sold at West Marine.

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Hey guys, here's my one chance to skite with a bit of one-up-man-ship. My little old 1975 vintage CHB 34 sports a chain counter. I love it. Quite cheap and easy to mount and wire in, if you're interested in DYI. Bugger messing about tying on all those various coloured thingies, then having to remember to count them up and down...'sides, they always kept coming off...

Our boat has a chain counter, too. And you're right, absolutely brilliant device. What's cool is that ours requires no power--- batteries or otherwise. These two devices in my head--- "eyes" I think they're called but I could be wrong---- pick up unique shapes on the chain called "wire ties." Then as each "wire tie" is registered by the "eyes" a counter, also mounted in my head, records the event by counting off, "one," "two," "three" and so forth.

I wouldn't be without one for anchoring and anyone who doesn't have one should get one. They're cheap.

I'm with you Peter, I love having a AutoAnchor 560.

Marin....good one

Chain counters.Do they work with a chain/rope combination?

Peter, did you get yours locally?

rochepoint said:

I'm with you Peter, I love having a AutoAnchor 560.

Marin....good one

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Seriously I can see how a chain or rode counter (a real one) could be a useful thing to have.

Yes Andy it/they would work with any type of rode, because they all work on a magnetic pulse picked up by sensos as the gypsy rotates past them, so you basically have a magnet mounted in/on the gypsy, and sensors on/in the housing. Once calibrated, it is the complete rotations that are counted, so the type of rode is immaterial.
The unit (CruzPro) I picked up in Auckland and fitted is available world wide I believe, and Maxwell and Muir have their (more expensive) version, as do other makers.
I bought the CH55, so it's not an automatic one, I have to actually do the hard job of watching the counter, and glancing at the chain coming on board when recovering to spot my painted last 2 metres of chain. When it's all in, it reads 0000, funny that.
CruzPro Marine Instruments

Found this chart for Bruce anchors. What do you think?

MurrayM said:

Found this chart for Bruce anchors. What do you think?

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Visual poetry. Others will disagree.

OK except to use one size larger anchor size/weight.

I found it 'disturbing' to find our new to us boat came with a 7.5kg Bruce and 15' of chain, when 10kg and 30' of chain is recommended. (note to self - check chain / rode size).

Sundowner Tugs present a pretty broad face to the wind and a pretty broad bow to the waves, so I think we'll go to 15kg with 30' of chain, and get a better nights sleep.

Peter B said:

Yes Andy it/they would work with any type of rode, because they all work on a magnetic pulse picked up by sensos as the gypsy rotates past them... Once calibrated, it is the complete rotations that are counted, so the type of rode is immaterial.
The unit (CruzPro) I picked up in Auckland and fitted is available world wide.. Maxwell and Muir have their (more expensive) version, as do other makers.
I have to actually do the hard job of watching the counter, and glancing at the chain coming on board when recovering to spot my painted last 2 metres of chain. When it's all in, it reads 0000, funny that.
CruzPro Marine Instruments

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My Muir Carnivore(a Cheetah or Cougar) retrieves at a leisurely 46ft per minute. Any slower I`d be timing it with a calendar. With no counter and the crew checking colored cable ties coming back onboard, it is a bit of a guess. One of the best uses of a counter must be knowing you hit bottom to begin paying out. Easier with a rope rode which helpfully coils on the surface when you hit bottom.

MurrayM said:

I found it 'disturbing' to find our new to us boat came with a 7.5kg Bruce and 15' of chain, when 10kg and 30' of chain is recommended. (note to self - check chain / rode size).

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I minor impediment; readily corrected.

Found this chart for Bruce anchors. What do you think?

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Looks like a formation of DC-3s. Aesthetic, historical, and of absolutely no use whatsoever in today's world.

Marin said:

Looks like a formation of DC-3s. Aesthetic, historical, and of absolutely no use whatsoever in today's world.

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Easy Marin, you could've broken it to him a bit more gently.....
Actually, seriously now...the thing that has always worried me about that type, (assuming it has set and dug well in), is the huge amount of force all concentrated on that quite thin neck of the right angled part of the shank that is all that connects it to the flukes.
I'd be interested in your view on that aspect Eric...

MurrayM said:

Found this chart for Bruce anchors. What do you think?

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My experience using either a Bruce or a Claw for 30 years is that the chart is off by two sizes in the lighter weights and one size in the heavier, if you want the anchor to be 100% effective 100% of the time. The Bruce design will always land with the tip and one fluke on the sea bed - it is completely unstable in any other position. The question then becomes how deep will it dig, and that is a function of weight, so heavier is better.

Anchors like the Rocna depend on a sharp tip to perform well, which is why the original owner of the company insisted on never letting a stock Rocna be used for testing - it always had to be one with the tip sharpened.

Either style will keep your boat in place if sized right, although as noted elsewhere, I think the roll bar on the Rocna type is as much an impediment as a design feature.

Peter B said:

Easy Marin, you could've broken it to him a bit more gently.....
Actually, seriously now...the thing that has always worried me about that type, (assuming it has set and dug well in), is the huge amount of force all concentrated on that quite thin neck of the right angled part of the shank that is all that connects it to the flukes.
I'd be interested in your view on that aspect Eric...

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Peter, you didn't ask me, but all of these are cast, and they are quite thick where the stock attaches. I think on mine, it must be 2 inches thick or so. Not likely to break there, and whatever force was required to do so would turn the shank of a Rocna (especially the new, improved ones made out of sub standard steel) into art deco.

Marin said:

Looks like a formation of DC-3s. Aesthetic, historical, and of absolutely no use whatsoever in today's world.

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Ahhh, but are you not aware that it was I who began the Sarca Excel thread

MurrayM said:

Found this chart for Bruce anchors. What do you think?

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I think it's good information. It never hurts to use a larger anchor or more chain if your boat can handle it.

My boat came with the 22 lb claw but I upsized to the 33 lb just for peace of mind. The original was a bit rusty and slightly bent anyway.

A claw anchor works well in my area but may not be the best everywhere. Look around the local marinas and/or talk to other boaters about what works best in your area. Some cruisers carry multiple anchors just for different bottoms.

Peter B said:

...the thing that has always worried me about that type, (assuming it has set and dug well in), is the huge amount of force all concentrated on that quite thin neck of the right angled part of the shank that is all that connects it to the flukes.
I'd be interested in your view on that aspect Eric...

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Not Eric, but these anchors have been around for a long time and apparently that has not been a problem so while it might look like a weak spot, it apparently isn't..