Bad Day

Bad luck yesterday, I fouled my anchor just south of the state park near Rio Vista. I had stopped to let the dogs run on the beach on my way home to Locke ca when my 75lb plow anchor fouled on what turned out to be a 1-1/2 inch steel cable buried in the river sand. I have never liked the feel of setting an all chain anchor rode as it is harder for me to feel when it's hooked up and set solid than nylon and chain. Well this time it felt real solid when I backed down. I had been down in the salt of the SF bay so I thought I would let out 200' or so and rinse off the salt from the chain. When I weighed anchor I couldn't break the anchor free of the bottom so I set up my anchor bridle with a hook and secured the 1"nylon rope to my front bow cleats and proceeded to try and horse out my anchor with all 66tons of Hatteras. It took a while nudging from different angles to finally pull the anchor free. To my surprise I pulled up a 1-1/2" steel cable on the flukes of my anchor. I had to tie it off lower the anchor to free it and release the cable. In the process the bridle slipped off my anchor chain and I ended up bending the hell out of my anchor roller bracket. In the scheme of things it might have been cheaper to have cut the chain and left the anchor on the bottom. The location of the cable is about midway between bouy 23 and 25 on the west side of the Sacramento River just downstream from the State park ramp.

Underwater is scary. Congratulations for getting out of the tangle. Stuff happens, and that's part of the adventure. No?

Do you carry bolt cutters aboard? I crewed on a friend's Defever once and he had an all chain rode. I asked what happens if the windlass breaks or you hang the anchor? His answer was that he has a hacksaw (somewhere down in the ER)!! Sure that will work when everything is hunky-dory. I tend to prepare for the doo-doo on the air circulator moments (seems like that is when you get to try to find all those what if items anyway).

Boaters with all-chain rodes should always secure the bitter end of the chain to a stout ring or hook in the chain locker with a line long enough to appear on deck when all the chain is let out. The line should be strong enough to absorb the shock of stopping the chain should it all run out for some reason. If there is a need to cut loose or cut loose from the anchor it's a simple job to let all the chain run out and cut the line with the line cutting blade on a Leatherman Wave or whatever.

I came within about five seconds of doing this once as we were dragging into a railroad trestle on a lee shore early one morning. I like to think I'd have had the presence of mind to tie a large fender to the end of the chain before cutting it free so we could come back later and retrieve the chain and anchor but I wasn't thinking about that at the time so I probably would't have.

Marin said:

Boaters with all-chain rodes should always secure the bitter end of the chain to a stout ring or hook in the chain locker with a line long enough to appear on deck when all the chain is let out. The line should be strong enough to absorb the shock of stopping the chain should it all run out for some reason. If there is a need to cut loose or cut loose from the anchor it's a simple job to let all the chain run out and cut the line with the line cutting blade on a Leatherman Wave or whatever.

I came within about five seconds of doing this once as we were dragging into a railroad trestle on a lee shore early one morning. I like to think I'd have had the presence of mind to tie a large fender to the end of the chain before cutting it free so we could come back later and retrieve the chain and anchor but I wasn't thinking about that at the time so I probably would't have.

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I'm leaning towards about 75 feet of 1/2-5/8 poly line...so it will float when cut and I don't get a fender/float on it.

Good idea. Then you don't have to remember something under the pressure of the moment.

I have 300' of 5/8 chain and one of my to do list items is remove 200' of it and go with poly line. We haven't anchored in over 50' in 7 years. I like the safety factor of all that scope, but not the weight.

A few years back, friends grabbed a underwater power cable (unmarked) running from Lopez to a small island North of it (can't remember name) and wonder what would have happened if the insulation of the cable broke and the anchor came in contact with the conductors...

Sailing yachts commonly carry bolt-cutters to cut away rigging etc in a dismasting, I thought about it but carry a hacksaw, bolt-cutters could be fairly rusty when you finally need them 10years on. Adding poly line at the inboard end of the rode makes sense. We`ve anchored in 120ft starting/finishing a race on the harbour, puts a lot of chain out; what`s down there, apart from bull sharks, is anyone`s guess. BruceK

Up Date

After talking with a knowledgeable local it turns out that the area along the west side of the Sacramento river between buoy 23 and 24 is foul with cables and other debris. This apparently is where sand barges had been moored for years for loading with sand. So word to the wise, as inviting a spot as these beaches are, probably better to anchor elsewhere. The bent anchor bracket as is usual for most boat repairs will require more than just unbolting and straightening the bracket. It seems that the Ideal windless will have to be removed to access the the though bolts on the bracket. I'm sure at this point that it would be far better to cut the chain and replace the anchor. Another option for cutting the chain is a 4" grinder with a cut off wheel. These are so handy that I can't believe I hadn't learned about them years ago. I discovered how handy these are while building a school playground. These cut stainless like butter and are much faster than a saw. The battery versions are plenty adequate for cutting chain. The idea of struggling with a set of bolt cutters large enough to cut 3/8 chain, while far better than a hacksaw, is no where near as easy as a small 4" grinder.

psneeld said:

I'm leaning towards about 75 feet of 1/2-5/8 poly line...so it will float when cut and I don't get a fender/float on it.

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Outstanding idea!

At least it was not conducting electricity!! We actually ended up with a similar size power cable over our Rocna in the Bahamas. Kind of scary especially when you are not wearing rubber boots!! Managed to drop it off with no harm to man nor island power supply.

BaltimoreLurker said:

Outstanding idea!

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Something I picked up along the way on one of these boards...we all pick up and pass on the kernels along the way of cruis'n life..

Thanks for the heads up, Scary. I never knew there were cables lurking there. I'll file this away for future reference! Now that I'm looking at my Navionics app, it shows a "pipeline area' opposite Delta Marina/The Point Restaurant, a submerged pipeline just north of buoys 25/26 and a magenta 'caution area' line just north of 23/24. I'll be paying them more more heed thanks to your warning.

That area called "The West Bank" by local anglers is a popular striper trolling area during the fall and winter months...south of Sandy Beach park, along the old red barn and toward the powerlines to the south. I have seen a few guys anchored there bait fishing, but normally it's an area dominated by multitudes of trolling anglers.

Since the waters run a fairly consistent 7-10 ft deep close to shore, the trollers run shallow divers 140-175 ft back from the boat at a fair clip of 3-5 Kt. When maneuvering around an anchored vessel, the trolled lures often become snagged on the anchor rodes. Maybe not a bad way to pick up a few extra trolling lures in your spare time to offset the anchor hardware costs.

" I'm sure at this point that it would be far better to cut the chain and replace the anchor. Another option for cutting the chain is a 4" grinder with a cut off wheel. These are so handy that I can't believe I hadn't learned about them years ago. I discovered how handy these are while building a school playground. These cut stainless like butter and are much faster than a saw. The battery versions are plenty adequate for cutting chain. The idea of struggling with a set of bolt cutters large enough to cut 3/8 chain, while far better than a hacksaw, is no where near as easy as a small 4" grinder."

When we were living aboard our Hylas 49' sailboat we had to deal with the potential requirement to cut away the rigging, as well as terminal anchoring solutions. We bought, and still have, a right angle drill with a massive battery pack and several sets of grinding wheels. The right angle drill was useful to have on board regardless of its safety role and consequently was regularly charged and available for emergency use. It now resides in a locker on my much tamer Salish Sea Bayliner.

If you cut with a grinder watch the hot sparks, they can make a mess of gel coat or paint, not to mention gasoline.
Steve W

Good advice Steve. The grinding wheels were only for use in emergency on board. In the circumstances (loss of mast and rigging) the gelcoat would have been low on my list of priorities. I was once moored next to a boat that was having some grinding work done while overwintering in Turkey and within two days my gelcoat had developed hundreds if not thousands of tiny rust stains from the grind waste. I do not know what they were grinding at since I was not on the boat at the time, but it took a heckofalot of work to clean up.

Couple of years ago, we had some Wounded Warriors aboard to watch the Red Bull air races in San Diego harbor. When I pulled up the all-chain rode a 5/8" steel cable came up with it, complete with dead-eyes. I could not lift the cable off the anchor but a nearby Navy Security boat showed up and the crew helped me release the cable. This ol' dogface soldier sure thanked the swabbies for their help. They in turn thanked me for being part of the Wounded Warriors project.

ancora said:

Couple of years ago, we had some Wounded Warriors aboard to watch the Red Bull air races in San Diego harbor. When I pulled up the all-chain rode a 5/8" steel cable came up with it, complete with dead-eyes. I could not lift the cable off the anchor but a nearby Navy Security boat showed up and the crew helped me release the cable. This ol' dogface soldier sure thanked the swabbies for their help. They in turn thanked me for being part of the Wounded Warriors project.

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Cool story ancora!

Besides gel coat and paint abrasive cut off wheel sparks will wreak havoc on stainless steel. Don't ask how I know

After several close calls with other dragging boats in nasty weather, I no longer make the bitter end of my rode fast. When I want to turn it loose, I want it loose NOW.

I do use the poly even tho I don't use any chain. If you plan on poly to save your anchor/rode, don't just assume it will work...test it first.

And for you techies, there's another way to open a chain link.
How to Freeze & Shatter Steel | eHow.com

jeffnick said:

After several close calls with other dragging boats in nasty weather, I no longer make the bitter end of my rode fast. When I want to turn it loose, I want it loose NOW.

I do use the poly even tho I don't use any chain. If you plan on poly to save your anchor/rode, don't just assume it will work...test it first.

And for you techies, there's another way to open a chain link.
How to Freeze & Shatter Steel | eHow.com

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Why don't you use chain? What anchor do you use? I know of no anchor manufacturers who recommend no chain with their anchors. Maybe this contributed to your close calls.

FlyWright said:

Why don't you use chain? What anchor do you use? I know of no anchor manufacturers who recommend no chain with their anchors. Maybe this contributed to your close calls.

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My close calls were due to OTHER boats dragging.

I've spent over 1,000 nights on the hook. It's my belief that when things are at their worst, it's the anchor that does the holding as any rode can be totally off the bottom and a straight line to the bow. How much good is chain doing then?

Why does every anchor manufacturer recommend chain? Because it aids in setting and in average conditions gives one a sense of security. I like to think about the holding of an all chain rode when the wind/sea take out the catenary and the rubber bands that are used as snubbers only complicate one's ability to GET THE ANCHOR UP in an emergency.

Why don't I like chain? Chain comes up dirty and cones in the chain locker. It can complicate the job of the windlass due to a chain to nylon splice. Chain adds weight to the bow -- to name a few.

I'm not trying to convince anyone to go chainless, just letting you know that it works for me. Weigh a boat length of chain and get an anchor that weighs that much more. For me, chain will never be a substitute for scope.

jeffnick said:

For me, chain will never be a substitute for scope.

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It is when you can't let out much scope which is often the case in this area. When the water is 100' and going down fast three or four boat lengths from shore, all-chain can be a real benefit. Other times bays and harbors can be too crowded or too small or both to let out much scope. We typically anchor with a 5:1 scope and even that can sometimes be hard to achieve. So the catenary you get with all-chain can play a pretty significant role in how much rode you have to let out and how well your anchor stays set.

What you use depends on a whole lot of variables and there is no one-size-fits-all solution.

Marin said:

What you use depends on a whole lot of variables and there is no one-size-fits-all solution.

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My point exactly. Also depends on what you want to rig for...are you lunch-hooking or ashore overnight? But I still feel that in the severest conditions it's the anchor that
ultimately does the holding, and if there's the slightest chance that those conditions might come to pass, relying on your chain catenary vs scope and anchor size can be a mistake.

Our 275ft of chain is securely bolted to lower end of the Samson post, I like the idea of a line warning when the chain is running out, although I hope not to see it. Would a anchor and rode left with a fender to mark it be considered salvage ? I'm just curious, it would be a low blow to take it knowing the owner already had some bad luck.

I don't remember where we got the idea to attach the all-chain rode to the securing ring in the top of the chain locker with a length of line that appears on deck when the chain is run all the way out so you can cut it in seconds with a blade. I think it might have been in Earl Hinz's book but someone may have told us about it, too.

I have no idea if I'd have the presence of mind to tie a large fender on the end of the chain before I cut the line. The one time I came within seconds of cutting the line I know I did not think of the fender. We just wanted to get the hell away from what we were being blown into.

However--- and I learned this from a member of our club who's done it at least once for someone--- if you're dragging into a lee shore and are out of time and have to cut the line the chain will be laid out in a pretty straight line across the bottom. So the chances are pretty good that if you come back later to the same location and drag the bottom with a grappling hook you'll snag the chain so you can haul it up. If the problem is the anchor is fouled on something that is preventing you from hauling it up and the conditions are such that you need to leave you can do the same thing--- let the boat drift back to the end of the rode and then cut the line.

If your fenders are marked with the name of the boat and a phone number it might at least prompt someone who hauled it and your anchor rode and anchor in to let you know they have it. And of course it should be covered by your insurance.

If you are dragging anchor and in danger of being blown onto rocks or something. Just go.
Put her in gear and drive away from danger. Chances are the anchor will come with you and if she catches you still are out of danger and can deal with the anchor in a more calm manner.

SD

skipperdude said:

If you are dragging anchor and in danger of being blown onto rocks or something. Just go.
Put her in gear and drive away from danger. Chances are the anchor will come with you and if she catches you still are out of danger and can deal with the anchor in a more calm manner.

SD

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Not a good idea in our boat. The chain will go up against the hull and the angle will put it right back where the prop(s) and rudder(s) are. Letting the chain run out takes a few seconds and cutting the line at the end of the rode takes a few more. That's it, you're done, and you can be safely on your way without the worry of this thing dragging behind you and potentially chewing up your hull and running gear.

I understand but better a few scratches than a hole in the hull from rocks.
Just saying.

It happened to me and a friend on his boat.
The windless jammed and we were heading for the rocks.
I told him just go.
We did.
It worked.

Sd

I don't think polypropylene line has much stretch at all so I'm very surprised to hear of anyone using it for anchor line. I would think that ther'e would be no substitute for nylon. To experience the wonderful stretch of nylon tie off 30 or 40' of nylon line and pull hard on it. You'll be amazed at how much it stretches.

As for chain the only reason it's used is to keep the anchor shank low so the anchor has an better chance to set. The catenary close to the anchor reduces the angle of pull ... closer to horizontal and helps to set the anchor. What else could it possibly do to help anchoring?? If one anchored at 20-1 scope in 10' of water chain would be absolutely worthless.

wet nylon in the anchor locker can easily weigh equal to a great portion of chain depending what you have in the way of chain...

never connect chain directly to the boat...use about 50-100 feet of poly...if you need to release in a hurry...you don't even have to attach a buoy....the poly will float fro a later recovery.

And no....salvage rights don't exist unless you abandoned it forever...