Racor Filters

GonzoF1 said:

Move the fuel filters to more accessible location. Like I did...

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Gosh, you do good work!

Tom,
I like what I see a lot. Looks like you've got a really big transfer pump plumbed for 3 outlets. Two primary Racor's and one secondary. I also like the timer. Great idea. Is that pump motor a very low speed unit? Can't get over it's size. I fairly often unhooked the outlet from my transfer pump to get fuel for samples and priming after filter changes ect but I noticed some black flakes coming out of it at least once. I suspect some got into my electric lift pump and reduced it's delivery rate.
After my Alaska adventure I've got much to do w upgrades and your system and photo is an inspiration.

Close, Eric and thankf for the props from both of you.

What you are seeing is:
Bottom center - input manifold (recently added a non-filtered output for dedicated genset fuel supply)
Top right - output manifold
Left - two-stage primary filtration
Right - single Racor 500 scrubbing filter with 60gph pump and A/C motor with timer

Almost all the parts, short of filters, was from Grainger.

System will also do transfer at 60gph (thru filter) and is easily removed for service and filter rebuilds. Some of the downsides include inability to scrub fuel while underway and no switchable "backup" filter should it clog while underway. I had to make a few compromises to prevent it from being out of control complex and thus, not fit into space allocated. Simple is better.

I thought I had some pics of the system in a more final configuration on that thread, but maybe I started a new thread for it. Not willing to look TOO hard for them at the moment.

manyboats said:

Tom,
I like what I see a lot. Looks like you've got a really big transfer pump plumbed for 3 outlets. Two primary Racor's and one secondary. I also like the timer. Great idea. Is that pump motor a very low speed unit? Can't get over it's size. I fairly often unhooked the outlet from my transfer pump to get fuel for samples and priming after filter changes ect but I noticed some black flakes coming out of it at least once. I suspect some got into my electric lift pump and reduced it's delivery rate.
After my Alaska adventure I've got much to do w upgrades and your system and photo is an inspiration.

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Eric, the pump is a carbonator pump that fits directly on a 48Y/Z 120 vac motor, so no, it is not low speed. It is very quiet, can run indefinitely and is virtually indestructible. Part number and wiring diagrams are below. In the picture, the 24v unit on the right has been replaced with another carbonator motor and pump setup, with the 24v pump now used for engine oil changes.

Polishing system

Delfin said:

It is very quiet, can run indefinitely and is virtually indestructible.

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Ain't that the truth! I can barely here it run and can run it while sleeping. Those 12V motors are VERY loud and have a limited cycle time.

My fuel-polishing pump, pictured on post #43, is pathetic.

We use 2 micron on everything. I believe in stopping contaminants as far from the fuel injection pump as possible.

I'm still amazed that a nearly new boat that's getting clean fuel from the fuel dock (assuming the fuel dock has good fuel) can get that kind of crud in it's filters. A fuel polisher is to treat old fuel, contaminated fuel, or fuel from dirty tanks. I think i would be very pissed if I bought a brand new boat and found it had to have its fuel polished on a regular basis in order to keep the filters from clogging up.

I don't have enough information to point fingers.

Meanwhile, filters and engine continue to work without fail.

Marin said:

A fuel polisher is to treat old fuel, contaminated fuel, or fuel from dirty tanks. I think i would be very pissed if I bought a brand new boat and found it had to have its fuel polished on a regular basis in order to keep the filters from clogging up.

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Well not exactly. A polishing system is used to remove natural condensates from fuel to ensure refinery specs that otherwise settle to the bottom of the tanks, eventually causing problems. The more fuel, the greater the chance for problems.

The fact that Mark has construction crud in his tanks, or took on a load of crappy fuel in China is hardly a reason to condemn the quality of the build. Change the filters a few times and the issue will be a non issue.

Polishing fuel may get the IN the tank clean , but for most folks the tank sidewalls are the problem.

When the boat is in motion the old crud breaks off , mixes with the clean fuel, and shuts down the filter.

So switching filters underway is required, should the boat be in motion

Delfin said:

The fact that Mark has construction crud in his tanks, or took on a load of crappy fuel in China is hardly a reason to condemn the quality of the build. Change the filters a few times and the issue will be a non issue.

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It is the result of failing to clean the tanks after cutting, welding, and grinding. No one told them to do it, no one inspected the tanks before they were closed up. That is a glaring example of no quality control.

That boat already dodged a very big bullet with regard to the improperly installed Cardon shaft. What is next?

With regard to fuel polishing systems, here is a link to an article from PassageMaker Magazine written by Steve D'Antonio on the subject:

The Proliferation Of Fuel Polishing Systems; All Fuel Filtration Is Good

I'm not going to paste the entire article here, it's easy enough to click on the link and read it.

One of the primary points he makes is that many installations that are claimed to be fuel polishing systems are ineffective because of the low volume of fuel treated or more importanly, improper placement of the pickup and return tubes in the tank(s).

FF said:

Polishing fuel may get the IN the tank clean , but for most folks the tank sidewalls are the problem.

When the boat is in motion the old crud breaks off , mixes with the clean fuel, and shuts down the filter.

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With a proper polishing system you never get "old crud" in the first place. Kind of the whole point.

"With a proper polishing system you never get "old crud" in the first place. Kind of the whole point."

Great if you are the first purchaser ,and keep up with the process.

For folks with decades old boats , the tank gunk must be removed FIRST if polishing is to work , or a new fuel tank installed.



For Racor folks National Fisherman had an article on a fuel restriction gauge that does not have to be bled to be accurate .

R2D2

www.racorgauge.com 772-529-0029

FF said:

"With a proper polishing system you never get "old crud" in the first place. Kind of the whole point."

Great if you are the first purchaser ,and keep up with the process.

For folks with decades old boats , the tank gunk must be removed FIRST if polishing is to work , or a new fuel tank installed.

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Sounds like an endorsement of polishing systems for new boats, or old ones who have had to have their tanks cleaned. I agree. I disagree that old boats who haven't had their tanks cleaned don't benefit on the grounds of common sense, simply because if the crud can come loose and plug filters supplying fuel to the engine, it can be polished out by filters that aren't supplying engine fuel. After all, a basic polishing system is all the professional cleaner generally uses anyway. Eventually, no more crud to break loose. The only argument against a properly designed system with adequate flow that makes sense to me is one having small tanks that burn through the fuel so quickly nothing has time to precipitate out of the fuel.

A far simpler system is simply to install a proper tank. not a box of fuel.

With a proper tank the water in fuel is trapped (gravity is your friend) in a sump that is easily emptied.

No ongoing cost (filters hoses motors and power) as with out water IN the fuel there are no bugs , and no tank walls covered with gunk.

In the archives is proper tank design information.

1983 boat with original tanks that hold way too much fuel. Had a problem clogging filters when I bought it. Installed multi stage filtration. No problems since.

FF said:

Fuel with moisture in it qualifies as "bad fuel" in my book.

By your standards there is no place in the world to fuel up , as moisture (WATER) is present in all fuel .

Fuel to be sold must meet a spec on the quantity of water that is permitted , but for sure its in every gallon you purchase.

"Too much" water in the fuel can be prevented with a Baja filter , but its a slow process to load 1/2 ton of fuel.

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I'm sure you are trying to make a point with this post, but I am unable to determine what that point might be.

Care to elaborate?

FF said:

A far simpler system is simply to install a proper tank. not a box of fuel.

With a proper tank the water in fuel is trapped (gravity is your friend) in a sump that is easily emptied.

No ongoing cost (filters hoses motors and power) as with out water IN the fuel there are no bugs , and no tank walls covered with gunk.

In the archives is proper tank design information.

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I have old tanks and replace the dirty Racors every 6 months and they come out black.....similar to the OP. My Racor collects 0 drops of water and i have never experienced a clogged 2 micron filter. So the dirt I am seeing is what?

FF said:

A far simpler system is simply to install a proper tank. not a box of fuel.

With a proper tank the water in fuel is trapped (gravity is your friend) in a sump that is easily emptied.

No ongoing cost (filters hoses motors and power) as with out water IN the fuel there are no bugs , and no tank walls covered with gunk.

In the archives is proper tank design information.

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I agree with you,but some boats don't have the required space to use a sump and slopped bottom type tank.I know you already know this.

Adelaide said:

I have old tanks and replace the dirty Racors every 6 months and they come out black.....similar to the OP. My Racor collects 0 drops of water and i have never experienced a clogged 2 micron filter. So the dirt I am seeing is what?

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My guess would be crud from the tanks. I don't know if you use a biocide in your fuel but if you don't some of the crud could be the bacteria that can grow in the fuel- water interface in the tank. I know you said you don't get water in your Racor bowls but depending on the height of the fuel pickup off the bottom there could be some in there.

Or the crud could be precipitates from the fuel that have collected over time.

If your tanks have inspection ports it might be a good idea when the tanks are empty or nearly so to take a look or have someone experienced in this field take a look. If the tanks have crud buildups the can usually be cleaned using the same inspection ports.

You could polish the fuel and that would probably help reduce the amount of crud that ends up in your filter element but I think the real cure will be to clean the tanks themselves.

The ideal fuel tank would not only have a "sump", it would have a drain in the bottom of the sump so water couls be drained off.

Of course, either of these would be pretty difficult to install in a boat and when we bu a boat, we get whatever the manufacturer chose to install in that boat. It would be far from simple to change a fuel tank and it's doubtfull that it would be cost effective compared to replacing filter elements

On the other hand if a boat's original tanks start to fail it can be a relatively simple matter to design the replacement tanks to incorporate a drainable sump. This was the case with our boat. The previous owner replaced the original three iron tanks with five new tanks-- four saddle tanks and a center day tank. The four saddle tanks feed the day tank (or the engines directly) via gravity from their lowest points. The day tank also feeds from its lowest point. There are no pickup tubes in the system.

Marin said:

On the other hand if a boat's original tanks start to fail it can be a relatively simple matter to design the replacement tanks to incorporate a drainable sump. This was the case with our boat. The previous owner replaced the original three iron tanks with five new tanks-- four saddle tanks and a center day tank. The four saddle tanks feed the day tank (or the engines directly) via gravity from their lowest points. The day tank also feeds from its lowest point. There are no pickup tubes in the system.

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I think you stated before you haven't had any problems....if true I think it's because tanks that draw from the bottom never truly let much settle as with top draw tanks that never really draw from below pickup tubes...so bottom feed tanks allow the filters to get most of the stuff out on a regular basis out.

Most of the bottom feed tanks I've dealt with seem to have the cleanest fuel.

Along the same line of thought Marin seems to take his boat out fairly frequently too. That coupled with bottom feeds on his newer tanks plays a big role as well. Keeping large supplies of fuel aboard without refreshing seems to be a downside of large tank capacities on some folks boats with fuel quality issues.

Our tanks consist of four 85 gallon saddle tank "cubes" and one 60 gallon day tank. Total capacity is 400 gallons. In practice we have one opposing pair of saddle tanks empty unless we are going to embark on a longer cruise. When the pair of tanks with fuel gets down to 1/4 full or less we fill the other pair, finish using the first pair, and then leave them empty until the second pair is nearly empty at which point we fill the first pair again. So we alternate using saddle tank pairs.

The day tank is used to feed the engines and generator so the fuel in it doesn't stay there all that long.

So a guy comes to this forum because his fuel filters are dirty and 85 posts later, the consensus is that he needs to rip out his fuel tanks and replace them with special custom made ones!

My advice to the OP - Take everything you read with a grain of salt. Possibly even the whole shaker.

rwidman said:

So a guy comes to this forum because his fuel filters are dirty and 85 posts later, the consensus is that he needs to rip out his fuel tanks and replace them with special custom made ones!

My advice to the OP - Take everything you read with a grain of salt. Possibly even the whole shaker.

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I guess that's what you get out of all this...there's a lot of good info if you can sort it out...

How about dumping the crud and have it analyzed by one of the oil analysis labs. probably 15-20 buck you'll know just what the crud is.
Steve W

Steve said:

How about dumping the crud and have it analyzed by one of the oil analysis labs. probably 15-20 buck you'll know just what the crud is.
Steve W

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Yep...as i posted back in post #46

"a lot of guessing going on......maybe send a fuel sample out for analysis to see if the fuel is even the problem????

or like I said from the vey beginning...if your fuel is clear and bright and the filter element of the used filter is bright pink...I wouldn't worry and just wipe clean the standby filter clean if it bothers you. "