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Old 05-25-2015, 11:52 PM   #21
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You all might be surprised at how many boats have title issues. For my peace of mind my money as the buyer would go to the title agent or broker. When the seller provides title and the title agent says the seller actually owns the boat then the seller gets my money. Simple process, does not cost much and gives me peace of mind and no ugly surprises later.
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Old 05-26-2015, 01:41 AM   #22
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You all might be surprised at how many boats have title issues. For my peace of mind my money as the buyer would go to the title agent or broker. When the seller provides title and the title agent says the seller actually owns the boat then the seller gets my money. Simple process, does not cost much and gives me peace of mind and no ugly surprises later.
Very high number of boats have liens too that are not filed with the USCG, just UCC filings. Plus many cases of dealers/brokers (this also happens on cars) where the boat is on consignment but for ease they have the owner go on and sign the title. They sell the boat but don't pay the previous owner. Oh, and don't assume new boats are free from all this.
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Old 05-26-2015, 02:29 AM   #23
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When I bought Cheers, the PO had a loan from an east coast bank. My broker contacted them, got the payoff amount and wired the money. After two weeks I hadn't received the title, so my broker called them. Well, uh, er we lost the title. They sent a notarized release on the lien, seller filled out and notarized a DMV form to request a duplicate title and release it to me. Went to AAA with the paperwork, gave them a check for DMV. Title in our names arrived two weeks later.

Piece o' cake. Glad I had a broker.

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Old 05-26-2015, 06:41 AM   #24
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"Title in our names arrived two weeks later."

A title is NOT a USCG doc.
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Old 05-26-2015, 09:05 AM   #25
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What barnacles. May I suggest you give Martha a call (licensed/insured title company), she is right there in Kemah and she will explain the whole process to you, free of charge. If you then elect to use her services, she does ALL the paperwork, clears titles, pays off loans, temp cruising permits, (if required), pays both sellers and buyers brokers etc etc. Best $500, I have spent and have used her twice. A phone call is free, kinds cheap for peace of mind. PM me for her number if interested. Incidentally, on one occasion, she saved me more than her fee when a broker was charging some "fees" that were not applicable.
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Old 05-26-2015, 02:47 PM   #26
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From the original question it sounds like no broker is involved to hold deposits or answer questions.
Anyone can get an abstract of title from the National Vessel Documentation Center, just supply a document number and a credit card. The fee had been only $25 and it takes 3-5 days.
I use documentation agents all the time and use them not for escrow of funds but for escrow of paperwork. They write up Bills of Sale and the seller sends them to the doc agent by FedEx. When the agent sees that they are signed correctly with three original copies then funds are sent by wire from the buyer.
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Old 05-26-2015, 08:18 PM   #27
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thanks for all the input everyone. I enlisted a local title agent today to handle the work. About a week to do the title search, and then we close. After that I get to wait months for the documents from the CG.

So as one last question, can I change the name on the boat itself (the paperwork will be filed with the new name and port of call) and secure at least liability insurance before I get the CG doc's?

Thanks again.
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Old 05-26-2015, 08:32 PM   #28
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thanks for all the input everyone. I enlisted a local title agent today to handle the work. About a week to do the title search, and then we close. After that I get to wait months for the documents from the CG.

So as one last question, can I change the name on the boat itself (the paperwork will be filed with the new name and port of call) and secure at least liability insurance before I get the CG doc's?

Thanks again.
You can and must secure all insurance before you take ownership. You don't need the Documentation for insurance. You are fine to operate without the final documents. Only if you're leaving the country is it an issue and you can get expedited service if that's your situation. It's actually referred to by them as Priority Handling. However, highly illegal to falsify a document to get it.

As to waiting for months, it's just over three months at the moment for initial applications. They are currently on February 15 receipts.
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Old 05-26-2015, 09:30 PM   #29
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And yes, you can put the new name on the boat before you get the final docs....and by all means, secure insurance before you take possession. Not sure if you're aware of this, a lot of insurance companies require a full survey before they'll bind coverage. Also, you need to look into register and pay sales tax to the state of Tx..I can give you links explaining what you need for tx if you want. You can pm me. In Tx, you have 20 days after closing to register the boat in Tx and pay the taxes. Tx is one of the states that requires state registration even on a USCG documented vessel. Only difference is you don't have to put the reg numbers on the outside of the hull, just the current registration sticker.
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Old 05-28-2015, 04:29 PM   #30
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When we bought our boat, we were unaware it had been USCG documented.

Over the weekend, when I was climbing around in the ER, I noticed a USCG number hidden away on the hull.

Today, I looked up the documentation number in the vessel documentation database and it was there but stated "Data found in historical database no longer in Documentation."

No owner is listed although a vessel name, previous owner and previous vessel name is. So, what does that mean to us? If we went to document it would we get a new documentation number?
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Old 05-28-2015, 05:18 PM   #31
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When we bought our boat, we were unaware it had been USCG documented.

Over the weekend, when I was climbing around in the ER, I noticed a USCG number hidden away on the hull.

Today, I looked up the documentation number in the vessel documentation database and it was there but stated "Data found in historical database no longer in Documentation."

No owner is listed although a vessel name, previous owner and previous vessel name is. So, what does that mean to us? If we went to document it would we get a new documentation number?
You complete the same form, initial or redocumentation and indicate the old documentation number.

http://www.uscg.mil/nvdc/instr/inst%20replace.pdf

I would confirm with them by phone that it was a correct documentation number for your boat.
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Old 05-28-2015, 06:47 PM   #32
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You complete the same form, initial or redocumentation and indicate the old documentation number.

http://www.uscg.mil/nvdc/instr/inst%20replace.pdf

I would confirm with them by phone that it was a correct documentation number for your boat.
Funny but I don't see anywhere on the CG-1258 form to report the previous documentation.

Confirm by phone....really??? Does anyone at the USCG answer questions like this and do they even answer the phone? There is a USCG station just down the road. Maybe some one there can enlighten us.
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Old 05-28-2015, 06:53 PM   #33
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Funny but I don't see anywhere on the CG-1258 form to report the previous documentation.

Confirm by phone....really??? Does anyone at the USCG answer questions like this and do they even answer the phone? There is a USCG station just down the road. Maybe some one there can enlighten us.
The local station isn't the best source of info sometimes...

Yes the NVDC does answer the phone and in my experiences (all but one) have been very pleasant and cooperative.
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Old 05-28-2015, 09:09 PM   #34
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The local station isn't the best source of info sometimes...

Yes the NVDC does answer the phone and in my experiences (all but one) have been very pleasant and cooperative.
I second that plus with their systems upgrades just made their access to information is improving significantly.
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Old 05-28-2015, 09:12 PM   #35
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Funny but I don't see anywhere on the CG-1258 form to report the previous documentation.

.
Item B on the form. Official # (if awarded).

First line on the form.

Then under purpose of application you select "Return to documentation following deletion."

Funny, I see those things. Are we looking at the same form?
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Old 05-28-2015, 09:24 PM   #36
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Item B on the form. Official # (if awarded).

First line on the form.

Then under purpose of application you select "Return to documentation following deletion."

Funny, I see those things. Are we looking at the same form?
Yep, we are looking at same form but I was looking for something like documentation number. My bad.
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Old 05-28-2015, 10:00 PM   #37
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Yep, we are looking at same form but I was looking for something like documentation number. My bad.
No problem. I often look at something and can't see something and my wife sees it instantly.
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Old 05-28-2015, 10:29 PM   #38
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You can and must secure all insurance before you take ownership. You don't need the Documentation for insurance. You are fine to operate without the final documents. Only if you're leaving the country is it an issue and you can get expedited service if that's your situation. It's actually referred to by them as Priority Handling. However, highly illegal to falsify a document to get it.

As to waiting for months, it's just over three months at the moment for initial applications. They are currently on February 15 receipts.
I bought my boat in Alaska and had to transit Canada to bring her to California. I did not have documentation on board but I did have the bill of sale and a letter from the title company indicating that USCG documentation had been applied for and fees paid. These docs were accepted without issue when I cleared customs and immigration in Anarcortes, WA.

I just received a temporary documentation from NVDC that says they still haven't processed the change, but that this document will stand in its place for up to a year or until the real documentation is completed. My forms were sent in around March 15. The letter does indicate that it does not indicate that title is held. It doesn't even include the name and hailing port, just the HIN and Documentation Number.

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Old 05-28-2015, 10:38 PM   #39
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I bought my boat in Alaska and had to transit Canada to bring her to California. I did not have documentation on board but I did have the bill of sale and a letter from the title company indicating that USCG documentation had been applied for and fees paid. These docs were accepted without issue when I cleared customs and immigration in Anarcortes, WA.
Not a problem in the US or Canada. May be in other areas which is the reason they offer priority processing if you're leaving the country.
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Old 05-29-2015, 03:17 AM   #40
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"Title in our names arrived two weeks later."

A title is NOT a USCG doc.
Yup. My point was that I would have had a lot more hassle if I hadn't used a broker. The broker suggested using a local agency if I wanted to document but I decided to do state registration instead, hence the DMV title. My opinion is that in either case (state or CG) using an agent/broker is worth the expense.
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