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Old 01-07-2016, 11:58 AM   #21
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Ok, I think you just might be really mixing up the numbers here.
If this is the boat you are talking about it is $68,000 to you, not $95 or $89. Also a $6k Canadian jump is really only about $4k (6%) to you.

1993 Camano Troll Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

On the surface, this thing looks like a pretty good deal and I shouldn't even be encouraging you guys.
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Old 01-07-2016, 12:12 PM   #22
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I noticed the same thing with this 71 Ta Chiao Pilot House. I looked at it when it was for sale by owner a 49,000 and past on it. Guy had it on the market for over a year then he go's with a broker, now its on yacht would for 59,950. That's brokers for you
I''m guessing He'll still take $49 (net) or less. Just wanted to price it to get his broker fees back. Not uncommon.
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Old 01-07-2016, 12:15 PM   #23
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...Great Lakes boats are more than Florida...
That's not a recent or new market trend though, pretty much always been that way, hasn't it? Freshwater/saltwater, FL is the biggest (therefore most competitive) boat market in the country...
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Old 01-07-2016, 12:22 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Hawgwash View Post
Ok, I think you just might be really mixing up the numbers here.
If this is the boat you are talking about it is $68,000 to you, not $95 or $89. Also a $6k Canadian jump is really only about $4k (6%) to you.

1993 Camano Troll Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

On the surface, this thing looks like a pretty good deal and I shouldn't even be encouraging you guys.

Yeah...from the listing:

Current Price:
Can$ 95,000 (US$ 68,144)


This does look like a good deal..
The OP is overthinking this IMO..
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Old 01-07-2016, 01:22 PM   #25
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Yeah...from the listing:

Current Price:
Can$ 95,000 (US$ 68,144)


This does look like a good deal..
The OP is overthinking this IMO..


Ditto that and thanks to this thread many more sets of eyes are aware of that too....
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Old 01-07-2016, 01:32 PM   #26
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Ditto that and thanks to this thread many more sets of eyes are aware of that too....
Yeah, better snatch 'em all up now before Trump builds The Wall between us.
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Old 01-07-2016, 02:23 PM   #27
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Yeah, better snatch 'em all up now before Trump builds The Wall between us.
No no, it's just a south wall -- everybody likes the Canucks. Well, you know, when (US) Americans travel to dangerous areas we lie and say we're Canadians, sew maple leaves to our backpacks and just add "eh?" to the end of our sentences. Nobody doesn't like Canadians, eh.
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Old 01-07-2016, 04:14 PM   #28
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I tried to post this earlier, but had to wait for some account restrictions to be removed.

Thanks for the info guys. It's helpful.

Hawgwash,
That is the boat. The prior listing is here. Photo 8 of 8 identified the phone number for the Nanaimo location of the same brokerage company. Other prior listings I found were were slightly different, such as having an 89.5K asking and not including that photo.

One boat I am comparing this one with for value guestimation purposes is this 1995 Camano Gnome in Anacortes. This boat is two years newer, but does not have the flybridge. The hours on the Gnome are just a bit less, 1930 vs 2006 Without the flybridge, I would expect the Gnome to have a lower valuation than a Troll even though it is a bit newer. If the asks are near value and exchange rate is reflected in that value, that would mean the Troll has a value $20+K less than the Gnome. If accurate, that would seem to indicate some serious problem with the Troll that may not be obvious from an initial inspection.

Written later...

It turns out there were a few additions to justify at least some increase other than just supply vs demand. There is new windless, canvas, etc. (Edit: comparing with prior listing pictures, that may not all be new.)

It might be a really good boat for someone. That still could be me. In the mean time, I have no objection to someone else using this thread to investigate this boat. It might save me from myself. While I would like the boat, my primary goal with this thread is to gain some more education I can apply to any boat.

Something else to keep in mind is potential financing issues in the US. Some of the US lenders I have spoken with will not do a first loan on a Canadian boat. In order to finance through them, you first need to complete the entire purchase of the boat in Canada and the registration in the US. After having paid for the entirety of that yourself, you can then re-finance with the lender to recover some of that equity. I am not sure yet if some US lenders will do a first loan on a Canadian boat. I'm still investigating that.

So, this is still a possible for me, though maybe no longer a probable. More education is always welcome. I prefer soft knocks to hard knocks.
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Old 01-07-2016, 04:55 PM   #29
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If the asks are near value and exchange rate is reflected in that value, that would mean the Troll has a value $20+K less than the Gnome. If accurate, that would seem to indicate some serious problem with the Troll that may not be obvious from an initial inspection.
Not necessarily. In some instances the Canadian Market has not caught up to the US yet and it may well be a great deal.
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In the mean time, I have no objection to someone else using this thread to investigate this boat. It might save me from myself.
I'm going to be in the area end of next week and could possibly have a quick look. Always like looking anyway. I'm not going to BS anyone though and I might get the cold shoulder if they haven't heard from you.
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Something else to keep in mind is potential financing issues in the US.
This is why you might want to think about a Bellingham broker to assist you. The good BC and WA brokers are working together frequently, especially right now and there are a lot of boats that don't even reach the open market. Even if you are only lukewarm now, establishing a relationship could help later. The Bellingham guys are about an hour away from this boat and travel across the fence all the time. They also might have funding sources and other pothole fillers you can't get in Texas. Some bankers know squat about the boat game.
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Old 01-07-2016, 05:35 PM   #30
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Listing price increase?

Hawgwash,
I really appreciate the offer though I'm not sure it is necessary. If I cannot find an acceptable source of financing, being a really good deal wouldn't help me. Finding this one was a bit unexpected, not to mention a bit premature. It may be possible, but with some sacrifices. Delaying somewhat would let me firm up my financial situation more before going after the next one.

As for the Bellingham brokers, how would I find the good ones? Do you have recommendations? I should update my profile. I'm full time in Anacortes now.

Thanks.

Tim
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Old 01-07-2016, 06:18 PM   #31
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Have you seen this thread yet? Boat Search 101
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Old 01-07-2016, 07:09 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by TimButterfield
As for the Bellingham brokers, how would I find the good ones?
You post that very question on here, in a new thread.
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I should update my profile. I'm full time in Anacortes now.
Just a heads up here Tim and some will say I'm being harsh but...full disclosure is really helpful all around; brokers, bankers and just as importantly, the crowd here that jumps at the chance to help.This is a fantastic site. Read. Ask. Have fun.

That this is a Canadian boat didn't emerge until post #11 and at post #30, I learn you are in Anacortes not Livingston Texas. Guy, you're closer to the damn boat than I am.

Get out and walk some docks. Anacortes dockage is huge and there are as many boats out of the water as in. Go walk the hard on T Ave. It will be crawling with boaters soon. Ask about boats, surveyors, financing, bla , bla

Bellingham 45 minutes.
Everett 60 minutes.
Vancouver 90 minutes.
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Old 01-07-2016, 10:24 PM   #33
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Where your whole concern falls apart is in any way associating listing price with what a survey might say. Listing price is top end for what the seller thinks the market might bear but in reality has no expectation of receiving. If you go to ten brokers and tell them you must have a minimum of $90k for your boat after their commission, you'd see nine different listing prices probably from $99,950 to $140k. There is nothing necessarily consistent about listing prices. Season of the year can impact it, mood of the broker, market turns, location, broker's experience with similar boats. Don't be offended or bothered by listing prices nor assume they have any relevance to value. Evaluate on your own and if interested offer what you're willing to pay.
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Old 01-07-2016, 11:11 PM   #34
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Have you seen this thread yet? Boat Search 101
I've been lurking for a while and had probably read it before. I'll read through it again as a refresher. Thanks.
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Old 01-07-2016, 11:49 PM   #35
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You post that very question on here, in a new thread.
Okay. Thanks. I'll try that once this settles and my nerves have recovered.

Quote:
Just a heads up here Tim and some will say I'm being harsh but...full disclosure is really helpful all around; brokers, bankers and just as importantly, the crowd here that jumps at the chance to help.This is a fantastic site. Read. Ask. Have fun.

That this is a Canadian boat didn't emerge until post #11 and at post #30, I learn you are in Anacortes not Livingston Texas. Guy, you're closer to the damn boat than I am.
I'm here to learn. So, inform away. I appreciate this also. I have been accused, at work, of my emails being too long, didn't read. Even though I work remotely and email is a main communication mechanism, this has been told to me by a boss. So, I've been trying to be more concise. You're right. I could have written a very long article post including everything I have posted in this thread all in the first post. But, doing that requires a lot more time for me to compose as I like to proof read everything (and I still miss some things). Instead, I post what I think of at the time. Later, when I think of more that might be relevant, I post more. That should be clear from my post that included this text: "I was thinking on this further last night." Some people work from the specific to the general. I often work from the general to the specific. Until I know information may be necessary or critical, I may not think to include it. That may be due to my software development background. Maybe I need to improve on knowing when to do which. But, then again, while I have lurked here quite a bit, I have not analyzed the posts for predominant verbiage tendencies.

Another part of this was not wanting to say anything that might disparage the brokerage or sales person. So, when necessary, I have to work at coming up with different ways of expressing myself or asking questions to avoid coming across too harshly.

Quote:
Get out and walk some docks. Anacortes dockage is huge and there are as many boats out of the water as in. Go walk the hard on T Ave. It will be crawling with boaters soon. Ask about boats, surveyors, financing, bla , bla
Yep. Been doing that, especially on T and at Cap Sante.

More on that full disclosure thing... I'll be taking at look at the boat this Saturday to take some hi-res pictures. I heard back from Horizon Credit Union. Even knowing it was a Canadian boat, they wanted them to show to a marine surveyor for a valuation estimate. So, it's still a possible.

Thanks again.

Tim
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