Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 02-28-2016, 09:56 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
jimL's Avatar
 
City: New Baltimore, NY
Country: USA
Vessel Name: General's Quarters
Vessel Model: 2005 Mainship 430 Aft Cabin Trawler
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 109
Financing and Insurance for a 10 YO trawler

Hi,

We’re about to decide on our next boat purchase and may be in need of financing and insurance. Short of looking blindly at the regional companies, we’re looking for a referral based on past performance.

We’re located in upstate NY and are looking at purchasing a trawler that’s about ten years old. Does anyone have any recommendations of who to reach out to?

Thanks,

JimL
__________________
Advertisement

jimL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2016, 11:48 PM   #2
Guru
 
kthoennes's Avatar
 
City: Sioux Falls, South Dakota
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Xanadu
Vessel Model: Mainship 37 Motor Yacht
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 857
We went with our local credit union, the same we've used for our cars and they handle a 401k investment rollover for us lately -- in other words we had a relationship with them already so that definitely helped. They didn't even have a loan category for large boats so they classified it as they would an RV/motorhome/recreational vehicle loan and gave us a great rate (5 yr term, 4.87% or something like that). Maybe we just got lucky, but I wouldn't overlook your current bank or CU, they may surprise you (or tell you to take a hike). Doesn't cost anything to give them a call and ask.

Our new-to-us boat was 18 years old at the time, and blue book was somewhere around $68-$72K for what that's worth. We only financed about a third of that book value which also helped. NADA is a terrible gauge of boat prices with tiny sample sizes but that's what a lot of banks and CU's use whether the numbers are nonsense or not.
__________________

kthoennes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2016, 02:14 AM   #3
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,141
Some go local and then there are several national boat finance specialists. Financing depends on the same factors as other financing except with boats they will expect to finance a smaller percentage of it's value. Insurance, I recommend you find a broker specializing in marine insurance only. You can check multiple places on insurance. Your home and auto insurer may be good. Some like Boat US. But you need to look at more than the simple coverage as there are a lot of exclusions in many policies and the amounts they'll pay on issues such as salvage and environmental is important.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2016, 01:40 PM   #4
Guru
 
alormaria's Avatar
 
City: Trenton
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 902
BoatUS is good for finding financing. Not impressed with them for insurance.

Try IMIS in Maryland for insurance.

International Marine Insurance Services
110 Channel Marker Way #200
Grasonville, MD 21638

mail@imis.pro

No connection except a happy client for 23 years.
__________________
Al Johnson
34' Marine Trader
"Angelina"
alormaria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-29-2016, 08:46 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
City: Punta Gorda, Florida
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Salty
Vessel Model: Fu Hwa 34 Europa
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 112
also contact our own Pau Hana member here that was very helpful with coverage on our 1984 trawler.

John
Capt Jack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2016, 11:47 PM   #6
TF Site Team
 
Pau Hana's Avatar


 
City: Seattle, WA
Country: Good Ol' US of A!
Vessel Name: Pau Hana
Vessel Model: 1989 PT52 Overseas Yachtfisher
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,647
Always rely on a marine insurance specialist for your vessel. Your home/auto carrier generally won't have coverage for some marine specific areas of concern including:
  • pollution/oil spill
  • marine salvage
  • wreck removal

And more. Further, the home/auto carrier's policy is generally an Actual Cash Value policy, which means the value of the vessel is determined at time of loss (like an auto policy). You should have an Agreed Value policy, which is a policy that sets the value of the vessel at policy inception.
__________________
Peter- Marine Insurance Guru & tuna fishing addict!

1989 52' PT Overseas yachtfisher
Pau Hana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2016, 12:23 AM   #7
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pau Hana View Post
. Further, the home/auto carrier's policy is generally an Actual Cash Value policy, which means the value of the vessel is determined at time of loss (like an auto policy).You should have an Agreed Value policy, which is a policy that sets the value of the vessel at policy inception.
Unfortunately, those in Portland and Urbanna will find those differences quickly. Actual Cash Value on a car isn't so bad as you can easily look at a book and come up with it. The only books on boats are horribly inadequate so without an Agreed Value, finding agreement on value can be terribly difficult.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2016, 12:44 AM   #8
TF Site Team
 
Pau Hana's Avatar


 
City: Seattle, WA
Country: Good Ol' US of A!
Vessel Name: Pau Hana
Vessel Model: 1989 PT52 Overseas Yachtfisher
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,647
BUC valuation is decent, and adjusted for specific regions. Survey valuations that reflect the regional market, as well as the soldboats database are a good indication of vessel value.

ACV policies are not good for the policyholder in most instances.
__________________
Peter- Marine Insurance Guru & tuna fishing addict!

1989 52' PT Overseas yachtfisher
Pau Hana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2016, 01:54 PM   #9
Guru
 
City: Hampton, va
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Didi Mau
Vessel Model: 2003 Ocean Alexander 456
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 609
Boat US offered us 4.12%, based on the age of the boat, a 2003, the amount of the loan, greater than $100K and our credit score.

Gordon
Gordon J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2016, 09:21 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
jimL's Avatar
 
City: New Baltimore, NY
Country: USA
Vessel Name: General's Quarters
Vessel Model: 2005 Mainship 430 Aft Cabin Trawler
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 109
Thanks everybody. I appreciate the assistance.

JimL
jimL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2016, 01:57 AM   #11
Veteran Member
 
Tacomasailor's Avatar
 
City: San Diego
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 39
I've been working with Essex Credit and with Intercoastal Financial Group on a 10-year old 50' trawler located in Florida.

They are both offering 4.44% to 4.94% loan rates with 20% or 25% down (rate and down depending on whether or not we are full time liveaboards) with 15 or 20 years to repay the loan.

Essex will do a 4.24% (non liveaboard with established shore side residence) 20-year loan on any boat built in 2006 or newer (as of March 7, 2016 here in San Diego)

We've had prior dealings with Essex Credit. They get the job done but are very demanding when verifying assets and income - as they should be.
Tacomasailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2016, 11:27 PM   #12
Veteran Member
 
Oldersalt's Avatar
 
City: San francisco
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Pacific Star
Vessel Model: 1990 Grand Banks 32 #834
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 84
Insurance.
I like Boatus, but on a 1990 grand banks I'm looking at, they would only write an agreed value policy up to the BUC value, several thousand less than the actual price (which I believe the boat is worth, based on above-average condition).

Geico agreed to insure at my value and premium is lower than the Bostus quote at the lower value. I don't know anything about how Geico handles claims but hope I never have one!
Good luck,
Oldersalt
Oldersalt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-15-2016, 11:37 PM   #13
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldersalt View Post
Insurance.
I like Boatus, but on a 1990 grand banks I'm looking at, they would only write an agreed value policy up to the BUC value, several thousand less than the actual price (which I believe the boat is worth, based on above-average condition).

Geico agreed to insure at my value and premium is lower than the Bostus quote at the lower value. I don't know anything about how Geico handles claims but hope I never have one!
Good luck,
Oldersalt
So, you have Geico vs. Geico since that's who owns BoatUS.

Just compare the detail of the policies. There's far more important stuff than just the hull value.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2016, 08:34 AM   #14
Veteran Member
 
NightCrawler's Avatar
 
City: Southport, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Shangri-La
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 42 Classic
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 71
We just went through the same drill. Bought a 90 trawler then ran into a number of roadblocks on insurance. Boat US/GEICO wouldn't touch it (incredible shape and surveyed very well) due to age. Progressive, whom I've been with for years - Nope. Ended up with Markel. Marine Boat Insurance Company | Markel Marine. Great local rep and they took everything very seriously. Lots of hoops, but we got coverage.
__________________
Jan & Lee

Eat Life -
www.grandpapickers.com
NightCrawler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2016, 12:06 PM   #15
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightCrawler;
We just went through the same drill. Bought a 90 trawler then ran into a number of roadblocks on insurance.
A claimed to be "incredible shape and surveyed very well" 1990 model year running into insurance roadblocks based on age alone?

I'm wondering if "age" is a smoke screen and if underwriters are concerned about the explosion of untrained, unskilled new owners on the water.

Anyone familiar with motorcycles knows what happened to insurance when kids started riding Ninjas instead of playing with them.
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2016, 12:30 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
City: New Orleans
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Scot Free
Vessel Model: Cheoy Lee 53' Efficient
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 445
Geico wrote my 1988 52' Cheoy Lee. Not the cheapest quote I got (Lloyds syndicate was) but it was better coverage.


Sent from my iPad using Trawler Forum
McGillicuddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2016, 12:33 PM   #17
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawgwash View Post

I'm wondering if "age" is a smoke screen
No, age isn't a smokescreen but comes about two ways. First, some insurers have consistently had age limitations. However, the other thing that happens is that statistical algorithms and they look at the demographics of their insured and then decide to put a hold on age or location or size to bring them back to a balance they're comfortable with.
__________________

BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012