Documentation Dysfunction – Serious Issue for Buyers and Sellers
- Thread starter Roger Long
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If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
VagabondLRT
Veteran Member
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I didn't get a temporary! I can't get anyone there to even respond.
kthoennes
Guru
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To the posters in this thread who think compliance is important, eventually the bureaucracy will wear you down. It takes lots of energy to be persistent, you can't keep it up forever. Kind of like Winston in 1984. 2 + 2 =5 Winston, or sometimes 4, sometimes 3. Eventually you'll be like the humans in The Matrix, in a docile, semi-comatose state, dreaming of running your boats somewhere in your heads, while the Ministry of Information sits on all your submissions and paperwork and emails and phone messages...quietly laughing at you.
www.kafka-online.info/before-the-law.html
www.kafka-online.info/before-the-law.html
Cottontop
Senior Member
Might be time to call your representative in Congress. That's one thing they're there for, and sometimes it works. And if enough people call, they might actually do something about the problem.
OP
OP
Roger Long
Senior Member
Have you checked this link on the NVDC site?
USCG CGMIX National Vessel Documentation Center Documentation Status Search Page
If you don't get something soon, it will be a while. From the NVDC site:
VagabondLRT
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I watch the site. Unfortunately I did see the downtime. Ridiculous. Thinking the same about Reps and or Senate. I just don't want to be a target. Thanks.
Cottontop
Senior Member
On the cruisersforum site there's a thread on documentation in which people are describing an "expedite" capability the USCG offers that is getting people their permanent certificate in just a few days.
Long ago in this thread I spoke of it, I believe. We've used it three times. It's available if you have immediate plans to leave the country, which is the only circumstance where you'd really need it. Works well. Just don't abuse it, people. Use it only if you fit the requirements. And, no, we haven't abused it as each of the boats I referred to did quickly leave the country. One to Canada. One to the Bahamas. One to Mexico.
Just wondering - a lot of fear mongering about what the worst case COULD be...
Has anyone here ACTUALLY been cited and FINED when they applied but haven't rec'd their documentation yet???
Has anyone here ACTUALLY been cited and FINED when they applied but haven't rec'd their documentation yet???
It is fear mongering without basis in my opinion unless you're leaving the country. Then, if you have a state registration you could be ok, but then the question will be why aren't the numbers on the side. For the states with no registrations you'd definitely have an issue. So expedite when you fit the circumstances they offer it for. Otherwise just relax.
Wifey B: Ok, I will guarantee a good many people here have performed sexual acts that were illegal in one or more states. People on this documentation issue stand about the same risk as they do.
SCOTTEDAVIS
Guru
Britannia
Wannabe
As I mentioned previously, I have entered Canada and the US without "proper documentation". Just a bill of sale and copy of an application for docn by a Marine Title company. No problems at all. Only one data point admittedly - but it's actual experience compared with pure speculation.
Richard
Richard
what_barnacles
Guru
I dont believe even that is a reason.
Recreational boats DO NOT need to be documented. Thus no fines or levies for not having the documentation papers. It's strictly voluntary.
All that is required is the state registration. The state numbers must be displayed unless documentation papers are used to supersede that requirement.
It generally isn't but there are times it may be, not so much as a matter of law, but due to the specific customs official. Regardless, the USCG considers it to be a matter worthy of urgency.
kthoennes
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Urgency? I don't see how that's possible when they still report processing times for some transactions (like mortgage satisfactions) in years. So glad our $26 annual renewal fees fixed this situation as they promised (that was sarcasm in case I was too subtle).
Urgency as in priority processing which takes less that two weeks when you submit the forms necessary for it. You submit your plans to leave the country and they'll turn it right around.
I'm not talking about anything else as they're obviously not making the progress then need to.
what_barnacles
Guru
docs is at 5/18/2015 but mortgage docs is 10/27/14. glad I paid cash.
I got logged as submitting june 9 so I figure by xmas hopefully.
I got logged as submitting june 9 so I figure by xmas hopefully.
O C Diver
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Great news, NVDC is currently working on paperwork from 05/18/15. Should have documentation reflecting the name change of my boat some time in January.
Ted
You've got to love this. The government sends messages in their own mysterious ways. No record yet of the NVDC having received my paperwork......unless you count them cashing my check.
Must be pretty tough to scan those 3 pages and enter my official number.
On another note, SARSAT Beacon Registration (NOAA) took 6 hours to research and release my epirb number and MMSI number from the previous owner. Was able to re-register it online in my name that night and received conformation email with registration document the next day.......at no charge.
Ted
kthoennes
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Same experience here with the FCC when we were gearing up our new boat for our East Coast trip. FCC, another massive, complex govt bureaucracy, but somehow they issued all our licenses in a few days. CG took around eight months for the boat doc, and nearly two years for the previous owner's loan satisfaction.
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Britannia
Wannabe
Likewise - had many dealings with the FCC over MMSI, Ship's Callsign and Amateur Radio. As clunky as the user interface may be, their computer system works and they're able to process requests in hours and days rather than weeks and months.
Contrast that with NVDC where I had received my paper COD and it was still 2 weeks before the entry showed up in their online database search. Now what is wrong with that picture?
Richard
Britannia
Wannabe
Ah ok. The FCC updates nightly I believe.
OP
OP
Roger Long
Senior Member
Our TCOD, dated September 17, arrived yesterday. The official and hull numbers are correct but no boat name or hailing port is listed. Since our application for exchange includes changing those, I called and asked which we operate under until we receive the COD. They said to go ahead and change the name and hailing port.
I put a deposit on a boat not knowing about CG undocument process
Iniitially seller assured me that I'll be able to regiester the boat in NY state, even though it's been documented. But after 3 days, seller tells me that I can't regiester the boat until the boat gets un documented and it's going to take 3weeks! Now this process can take longer and can even get complicated, if the right paper work is not submitted! I agree with the gentleman who started this thread.
So, I backed out of the deal and the seller got mad at me and he's refusing to return my $1000 deposit! I mean if the guy knew he's going to put his boat up for sale then why wait until the last minute to un document it! I don't know what to do. This is first time ever buying a boat! What can I do to recover my deposit form the seller?
Thanks,
Lias
Iniitially seller assured me that I'll be able to regiester the boat in NY state, even though it's been documented. But after 3 days, seller tells me that I can't regiester the boat until the boat gets un documented and it's going to take 3weeks! Now this process can take longer and can even get complicated, if the right paper work is not submitted! I agree with the gentleman who started this thread.
So, I backed out of the deal and the seller got mad at me and he's refusing to return my $1000 deposit! I mean if the guy knew he's going to put his boat up for sale then why wait until the last minute to un document it! I don't know what to do. This is first time ever buying a boat! What can I do to recover my deposit form the seller?
Thanks,
Lias
guy with a boat
Guru
guy with a boat
Guru
For what its worth, my documentation hadn't worked its way through the system when it was time to take the new boat on a trip to the Bahamas. With my purchase paperwork and copies of my application for USCG documentation, I cleared into Bahamas and then back into the U.S. and nobody batted an eye.
There are enough real problems in life that may need my attention that I try to not sweat the small stuff.
There are enough real problems in life that may need my attention that I try to not sweat the small stuff.
twistedtree
Guru
I you still want the boat, I don't think this is a big deal. Just file the paperwork to undocument, and keep a copy with the boat. When that's completed, go register it in NYS. Everyone buying a documented boat has to deal with the Coast Guard turn around time, which can literally be months. It doesn't matter whether you are undocumenting, or transferring the documentation.
If you don't want the boat, then your contract should be clear on whether the seller gets to keep the deposit.
psneeld
Guru
Why can't you register it in NYS?
No matter what is going on, I would think you should be able to register it as long as you have a bill of sale and a clean HIN number.
Undocumenting and transfer of ownership are 2 different things...no need to "undocument"...unless you have to.
