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Old 01-24-2014, 12:26 AM   #21
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I find this thread somewhat disturbing. The first part of minimizing taxes by knowing what the laws and rules are and complying in the least punitive manner possible I have no issue at all with. One of the reasons I live in Florida is no state income tax.

However, the talk of not paying a tax that one knows is required because enforcement is weak or because one can probably get by with it is most disturbing to me. Especially the fact one would openly discuss and even encourage such on a public forum. I guess I just feel a certain obligation to comply with laws and to pay the taxes I'm required to. I'm proud to say I don't cheat on taxes in any manner. That's not being holier than thou, it's just being honest and fulfilling my obligation.

Now for getting accurate information as to paying sales and use taxes on a boat purchased in one state and moved to another, I'd go to the state tax departments web site of each state and I think you'll find it clearly spelled out.
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Old 01-24-2014, 12:52 AM   #22
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I find this thread somewhat disturbing. The first part of minimizing taxes by knowing what the laws and rules are and complying in the least punitive manner possible I have no issue at all with...However, the talk of not paying a tax that one knows is required because enforcement is weak or because one can probably get by with it is most disturbing to me.
B & B, you well identify the difference between lawful tax avoidance or minimization, and out and out evasion. Whether a tax is adequately enforced or not cannot affect the liability to pay the tax.
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Old 01-24-2014, 02:02 AM   #23
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I find this thread somewhat disturbing. The first part of minimizing taxes by knowing what the laws and rules are and complying in the least punitive manner possible I have no issue at all with. One of the reasons I live in Florida is no state income tax.

However, the talk of not paying a tax that one knows is required because enforcement is weak or because one can probably get by with it is most disturbing to me. Especially the fact one would openly discuss and even encourage such on a public forum. I guess I just feel a certain obligation to comply with laws and to pay the taxes I'm required to. I'm proud to say I don't cheat on taxes in any manner. That's not being holier than thou, it's just being honest and fulfilling my obligation.

Now for getting accurate information as to paying sales and use taxes on a boat purchased in one state and moved to another, I'd go to the state tax departments web site of each state and I think you'll find it clearly spelled out.
I recommend you do as I have, and contact Governor Rick Scott and request he crack down on these scofflaws. It's not right nor fair to us Floridians. The yacht brokers had to lobby him not to eliminate licensing too. It's quite frustrating to witness and report a crime to be told by the authorities "sorry, nothing we can do". You don't even want to know about public corruption down here or DEA. You don't know "disturbing" yet.
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Old 01-24-2014, 03:21 AM   #24
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My wife and I are about to purchase a $175,000 boat in Florida. We recently became legal residents of Florida using a St. Brendan's address as we will soon be "homeless", that is, we will be full-time liveaboards with no land-based home ownership. I refuse as a matter of legal and moral principle to evade taxes and I will willingly pay the Florida sales tax on my purchase. Tax avoidance is quite different and quite legal. The SCOTUS many years ago recognized the difference between evasion (a crime) and avoidance (good tax planning). I don't like paying taxes any less than anyone else but if one is to take advantage of all that is the United States, I believe that we should pay all that is due and owing, but not a penny more. Yes, I don't like paying for much of what is spent in my name but it goes with the deal, that is, living in the best there is in this world. I have no patience for those who rationalize cheating on their taxes especially those who are "devoutly" religious except when it comes to a "buck". My grandmother had a saying: Money will make the blind see!
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Old 01-24-2014, 04:58 AM   #25
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Greetings,
Mr. catalinajack. Welcome aboard.
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Old 01-24-2014, 08:35 AM   #26
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...use tax may be due upon importation into Florida, under either of the following conditions:
The boat belongs to a Florida resident...
This refers to someone who was a Florida resident at the time they bought the boat. So, if you are a Florida resident, you can't buy a boat in Kentucky, leave it there for a year or so, bring it to Florida, and avoid paying tax on it. As a Florida resident, the 6-months rule does not apply.

In your case you were not a Florida resident when you bought the boat. You were not a Florida resident for all of the time (more than 6 months, I gather) that you were using it in Kentucky. You can now bring the boat to Florida, and become a Florida resident, and you will not owe use tax on it. You will only have to register it with the state, and the fee for that should be no more than about $200.

I also feel compelled to weigh in on the discussion of tax evasion. Suggesting to others, in a public forum, that they should violate the law is just lame. That's the nicest way that I can put it. Trust me, if you happen to be the one in a million who gets caught, fined, and whatever for your tax evasion, saying "but the guy on the internet told me it would be okay!" is not going to impress the judge.
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Old 01-24-2014, 11:45 AM   #27
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Who suggested that anyone evade the law? All I see is how things work in real life re paying boat taxes in Florida.
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Old 01-24-2014, 02:06 PM   #28
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Who suggested that anyone evade the law?
Someone posted that the OP should just bring his boat to Florida and not pay the taxes. That same poster has gone on to explain at great length why anyone who did this would not be likely to get caught. That certainly sounds to me like a suggestion to evade taxes.

Irrelevant anyway, I guess, since it is pretty clear that the OP will not owe any use tax.
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Old 01-24-2014, 02:11 PM   #29
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Who suggested that anyone evade the law? All I see is how things work in real life re paying boat taxes in Florida.
Exactly. Reporting what's common knowledge of a long time problem well known by the people responsible for enforcement isn't going to make someone honest all of a sudden become a scofflaw, anymore than telling you that the border between Miami and the Bahamas is porous- is going to make you become a smuggler.

What I AM advocating though is that Florida residents contact our Governor and request that he start allowing the tax agents we have-to have access to the Internet so they can start collecting tax from all those people who boldly advertise boats and cars on Craig's List and Ebay, who aren't dealers- can't give any exemptions and are supposed to immediately collect tax. The millions of dollars missed in tax revenue VASTLY overwhelms the meager amount licensed brokers collect.

Florida legally allows SO many exemptions from paying our meager 6% sales tax that it's amazing that so many people don't avail themselves of the legal options.
As a Licensed Broker who's required (and has since it started in 1988) to pay a Brokers License fee of $500.00, plus provide a bond, every two years, PLUS is required to maintain a office with annual local City and County business licenses ($550.00 a year) hanging on the wall, AND is required to file monthly sales tax reports with the Dept of Revenue- it burns my ass to see so many people NOT bothering to do any of this, and THEY'RE being rewarded with economic bounty with impunity. Many don't even live in our State- they "fish" here-but take their booty back home. They're quite blatant about this too. Not talking just boats, but car's and motorhomes too. LOT'S of cars!!!


It's wrong. It's illegal and it's solely the Governor who's stopped what little enforcement we had. We need MORE, and he made it less.
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Old 01-24-2014, 06:25 PM   #30
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The OP`s question was about mail services. Try helping him with that.
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Old 01-24-2014, 08:29 PM   #31
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I guess a little background is in order first. My wife and I plan to retire this year and sell off everything. We will be cruising full time for a couple of years before deciding on a land base somewhere in warmer climes. We're both getting tired of these polar vortexes (vortices?) We will be doing the loop slowly, north in the summer south in the winter...farther north the next year etc.

My plan has been to use the St. Brendan's Isle mail service to establish some sort of residency. Florida seemed a good choice with no state income tax. The problem is our boat is currently registered in KY. as they have no sales tax requirement. In reading an earlier post and the state of FL tax page I assume I will be responsible to register the boat and pay the full tax the moment we reach Florida in the boat. Not a huge amount or a real turn off but something I'd like to avoid if possible.

I guess the real question here is, does anyone know of another similar mail service that does the same thing as St. B's that's not in Florida? A service somewhere land-locked maybe? If the state has an income tax we may be better to stick with FL and take the hit once. I've been looking on the web without much luck.
Not sure where you got your information but KY does have a sales and/or use tax on boats unless you qualify for a valid waiver as authorized by the KY Department of Revenue (DOR) and specified in the state statutes.

Dont listen to advice on a public forum contact a KY CPA with your questions or the DOR directly.
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Old 01-25-2014, 10:15 PM   #32
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As a securities broker for 18 years I observed a similar problem. The regulators dogged the people who complied with the law and registered. They have no interest in going after the licensed people who were operating until the frauds were already committeed.
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Old 01-25-2014, 11:02 PM   #33
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Bought the boat in MD, while an MD resident, but immediately moved to FL, to good old Green Cove Springs. Signed a pice of paper in MD and was exempted from MD sales tax. Went to the court house in Green Cove, and ponied up the cash, got my orange sticker for both boat and dink, drivers license, license plates etc and am now a FL resident as of Dec 16th.

So now when I filled out the USCG documentation, it asked if the boat was registered, so I said yes.

Don't you need to have the boat registered to document it?

Regardless it is the contract that we have with our government, and I am the first to hate paying taxes, I think, the whole thing stinks, and I despise free loaders....I could digress.....gov waste....UGH I am seeing red just thinking about it.

The folks in green cove rock, and really helped me escape MD, for that I a thankful and would recommend their services.

Make a plan, and budget accordingly, I have done the move for tax relief thing several times......in my experience, one way or another the money still goes out the door, if you look at the entire tax burden. This time I wanted license plates that said "In God We Trust" so it was worth it.
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Old 01-26-2014, 01:09 AM   #34
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...

Don't you need to have the boat registered to document it?

...
No, however, some states require a boat be registered even if it is documented. In California, documented boats needn't be registered with the state, but they're nevertheless subject to state taxes (sales/use/property taxes).
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Old 01-26-2014, 10:26 AM   #35
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I guess the real question here is, does anyone know of another similar mail service that does the same thing as St. B's that's not in Florida? A service somewhere land-locked maybe? If the state has an income tax we may be better to stick with FL and take the hit once. I've been looking on the web without much luck.
Since you do not have a land based home you can become a resident of a state by documenting and registering your boat in that state and considering the documented address to be your legal address. This requires that you become a resident, subject to any tax that applies. Two states come to mind on the East Coast, Delaware and New Hampshire. Neither has a sales tax. You need to check on the effect on you of the other taxes for that state.

A UPS store physical address should work for your legal address, what you are looking for in terms of service is a PMB, a private mail box.

I you need the services provided by St. Brendan's in terms of scanning the mail you can have the UPS store forward your mail to St. Brendan's.

This is addressed solely with respect to the sales tax. After the legally required period of time as a resident of another state you can move your boat to Florida. This will not work for those states such as Maryland that subject you to a use tax but credit past paid taxes as you have paid no sales or use tax.
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Old 01-26-2014, 10:50 AM   #36
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Taking advantage of legal ways to avoid paying taxes has been done for a long time. Buying your multi-million dollar motorhome in Montana which is one of five states with no sales tax is a no brainer for full time rv'ers. This money saving stragey is also done by yacht buyers all the time. Check out John Kerry's 7 million dollar yacht that is not bearthed in the bay state to save paying $4oo,ooo+ taxes, as if he doesn't have the money to pay the tax man. Best advise would be check out each state, they all have different rules and take advantage of six month rules and sales tax amount for each state. The real kicker is why sale tax needs to be payed over and over on each sale, it would be interesting reading to compile the sale tax that has been payed on an individual yacht over it's lifetime.
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Old 01-26-2014, 11:12 AM   #37
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This is the mail service we use every summer while we're out cruising/working:

http://www.dockside-solutions.com/#2719

Based in Seattle and owned by a liveaboard and friend of ours. Excellent service!
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Old 01-26-2014, 11:37 AM   #38
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I'm not clear if the boat is currently kept in Kentucky or Ohio.
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Old 01-26-2014, 02:20 PM   #39
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.... Two states come to mind on the East Coast, Delaware and New Hampshire. Neither has a sales tax.
Ah yes, the Delaware dodge...

By the way, the subject boat appears to have been in Ohio since its purchase in Kentucky last summer. Both are sales tax states.
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Old 01-26-2014, 08:43 PM   #40
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Thanks all for the replys. I will try and clear up a few of the questions.

My main point was, if we use the St. Brendans service would we be required to pay the FL. tax once we get the boat there. I don't have a problem paying the tax if required, just wondered if another similar service might be a better choice. It looks like Denverd0n cleared that one up. I have no intention of trying to hide from the tax man (who apparently doesn't exist in FL.) I still like to sleep at night.

We will have owned the boat for over a year before we get there so the 6 month rule isn't an issue.

Now to really confuse you...we live in Ohio but also own property in KY. According to the state of KY. we don't owe any sales tax or need to register a documented vessel so we used the KY address to document it. The boat is also berthed in KY so that just seemed to make sense. We now do our boating on the Ohio river which is owned by KY....and bought the boat in TN! Head spinning yet?

Thanks again for all the help. I still plan to find a registration office and see what their answer is if I can get to the keys in a couple of weeks.
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