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Old 09-16-2019, 01:37 PM   #21
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I have seen a few different options in the PNW.
A few local places in Everett are 10%
If you need a slip its another 550 a month
A local place with a yard in Everett is 10% and 250.00 a month for on the hard storage to show your boat.
Up North its 10-15% and 250-500 a month to store it on the hard for viewing.
And there is one place that's a flat 20% includes storage on the hard for viewing for 12 months, I think they also have a bottom listing price. If the boat does not sell within the 12 months... you owe them 500.00 per month. (helps keep owners in line of what the boat is really going to sell for).


For boats over 50k I would use a agent, for boats under I would list myself for the first 2-4 months. A lot of the boats we were really interested in were just over priced in my mind. I feel the owners priced them high on the average, and then tacked on the 10% commission and added in say 2-6 months of storage fees. And now you have a boat that's 15-20% over its true value. And then you get some cheap ass like myself that will come in and take 25-30% off the asking price (10% commission, 10% over value and 5-10% to give back to make a deal).

But if you list with a broker, go in and talk to them. We hit 4 different places up North. Only one of the places knew anything about boats, (I'm no expert) about what they had to show, and what the owners were wanting out of the deal. Most were just people wanting a part time job and happen to like boats but know nothing about them.

Make a fair market price, see what's listed and what sells in your area. We had been looking for about a year, several of the boats that we were interested in are still for sale. Good boats, just over priced, I am not sure if the owners are really wanting to sell them, or if they are just willing to sell if the price point is met.
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Old 09-16-2019, 01:46 PM   #22
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Brokerage commissions have been 10% for 100+ years but the cost of living has gone up 10+ times. You get what you pay for. Cut a brokers commission and you will get half ass service and the broker will hold the listing in house only and not cobroker it. They won't tell you that, but that's what 90% of them will do. And your boat will just sit because when a cobroker who has a buyer calls on it, the listing broker will just tell him it's a 6-7-8% deal and that broker will just move his client on to the next boat that is paying a full commission.

The only way to negotiate a commission is to set a net price agreement of dollars. If you want 200K and it's a reasonable number then the broker needs to sell the boat for 222K to make 10%. If your number is not reasonable just expect the boat to take forever to sell either way.

Guys, a lot more to selling a boat than selling a house. Anyone can buy a house and real estate agents sell 100s a year per sales person or they aren't very good. A good broker might sell 10-30 boats a year.

Boats require real expertise in not just one boat but a lot of models and takes years to develop. We also we get every tom, dick and harry wanna be yacht owner to deal with. Most sellers never know how many phone calls, showings and other time we spend on a listing.

Just my two cents but I've been selling boats professionally for 36+ years.
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Old 09-16-2019, 02:12 PM   #23
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I was on commission in the insurance industry and of course experienced negativity to commissions. The nice thing about a commission is it is paid on successful completion of the job or product or service.

Remember the broker may have to do foolish things like purchase food for his/her family, pay the mortgage, pay for the car and insurance and all the other expenses related to living and a family. And also realize that in recreational markets economic slumps can hit hard so the broker making lots of money now won't be in the next downturn financially.

Many decades ago I was an orderly at a large Vancouver Hospital earning my way through university. I was dating the daughter of a high placed health care executive during a particularly intense strike which involved me at the low end and him at the high end. He asked me - "Rick, honestly how do you feel about your pay as an orderly?" I said: "For me, it's more than adequate but I don't want to speak for the orderlies who are raising a family and paying a mortgage, for them I don't know."

And I was a bus boy in Madison Wisconsin even further back in time at a Ramada Inn. As you can imagine I and the waiters and waitresses were dependent on tips. So we would feel it if we ran into a herd of cheapskates.

If you don't feel the broker's fee is fair, market the boat yourself.
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Old 09-16-2019, 02:24 PM   #24
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I was on commission in the insurance industry and of course experienced negativity to commissions. The nice thing about a commission is it is paid on successful completion of the job or product or service.

Remember the broker may have to do foolish things like purchase food for his/her family, pay the mortgage, pay for the car and insurance and all the other expenses related to living and a family. And also realize that in recreational markets economic slumps can hit hard so the broker making lots of money now won't be in the next downturn financially.

Many decades ago I was an orderly at a large Vancouver Hospital earning my way through university. I was dating the daughter of a high placed health care executive during a particularly intense strike which involved me at the low end and him at the high end. He asked me - "Rick, honestly how do you feel about your pay as an orderly?" I said: "For me, it's more than adequate but I don't want to speak for the orderlies who are raising a family and paying a mortgage, for them I don't know."

And I was a bus boy in Madison Wisconsin even further back in time at a Ramada Inn. As you can imagine I and the waiters and waitresses were dependent on tips. So we would feel it if we ran into a herd of cheapskates.

If you don't feel the broker's fee is fair, market the boat yourself.
Each of your examples is excellent. It just always seems that so many are concerned that others are making too much. We see it in concerns about tipping, concerns about broker's commissions, concerns about West Marine prices. Yes, one should be fiscally responsible, but be careful when it comes to providing others a decent living.

We're all linked. Every dollar you spend, someone is depending on you spending it. They're just like you are or you were, working to make a living. There are families at home depending on it too.
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Old 10-23-2019, 08:21 PM   #25
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First thing: Let me know by private message the details and price for your boat.

As a 40 year real estate broker and a potential boat buyer I would suspect there are a number of high $ brokers who move in a circle for those listings.

A large percentage of the boat brokers are going to be retired professionals or marine personnel selling. May be knowledgeable.

An average of $150,000 could well be on the high side. I have tied to limit my search to boats I could purchase out of pocket without financing or making a material shift in investments. I am amazed at how poorly boats are presented; particularly on the cheaper boats. It's hard to make a decent living selling $100,000 houses and I think it would be equally hard to do selling boats for one of the national firms.
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Old 10-24-2019, 01:34 PM   #26
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Wifey B: Neighbors visiting during open houses are a very good part of it. Neighbors have friends. Some may be looking. Neighbors will let them know if they find the house to be nice. I was told by a successful realtor that she targeted three groups with open houses-potential buyers, other realtors, and neighbors who know potential buyers. She also said that open houses often lead to very quick sales on reasonably priced moderately priced homes. She does not hold them on extremely high priced homes as they attract sightseers and curiosity seekers.
Good point. I recently sold a house in the hot SW Ontario market. We had multiple offers, five above the asking price. Of those five, one was from a neighbor I didn't know, and one was from friends of my next door neighbor. Every market is different of course, but the open house was a key component of the sales strategy that our broker orchestrated, and in my view it was very effective.
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Old 10-24-2019, 02:48 PM   #27
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F
An average of $150,000 could well be on the high side. I have tied to limit my search to boats I could purchase out of pocket without financing or making a material shift in investments. I am amazed at how poorly boats are presented; particularly on the cheaper boats. It's hard to make a decent living selling $100,000 houses and I think it would be equally hard to do selling boats for one of the national firms.
Average first year real estate salesperson earns commissions of under $10,000. That's why so many start with rentals, just to have income while getting started. Now, the better firms do supplement the new realtor which is a very new trend and largely to comply with labor laws as they are employees rather than contractors. That increases them to $17-18,000 or so a year but puts them in the whole on draw vs. commission. New car and boat salesmen normally get a draw, typically anything from $1500 to $2000 per month. Most don't start out earning that in commissions and dig a hole. A lot of times, you'll see something after six months like Draw of $12,000, Earned commissions $8,000, Negative $4,000 Net. That means even if they double sales the next 6 months, they still will only get paid their draw. Now, some dealers have gotten to where at some point they'll wipe out the old negative situation.

If one sold six $100,000 homes and listed two more that sold, they'd earn 1.5% x $800,000 or $12,000 for the year. For boats it would be 2.5% or $20,000 but a new salesperson isn't likely to hit those numbers.

There are exceptions and companies are looking for the super stars. I had a cousin who made $90,000 his first year as a car salesman. He had lived in the city his whole life, knew everyone in town it seemed, and had the perfect outgoing personality that everyone liked him.
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Old 10-24-2019, 04:22 PM   #28
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Hmm! I spent a short year as a boat broker in Annapolis. I didn't get a draw and don't know of any that did. I made about $25,000 in a bit less than a year. My long term colleagues made $50K or more and it was an average if not slow year, right after 9/11.


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Old 10-24-2019, 06:56 PM   #29
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Hmm! I spent a short year as a boat broker in Annapolis. I didn't get a draw and don't know of any that did. I made about $25,000 in a bit less than a year. My long term colleagues made $50K or more and it was an average if not slow year, right after 9/11.


David
You did well. Most at the brokerages do not get draws. Most at dealers do. However, it varies widely and it continues to change as both Federal and States get more serious about employees vs. contractors and pay.
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Old 10-25-2019, 08:25 AM   #30
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There's a BIG spread in what brokers (salespeople) make and charge. Real Estate or Boats. While 10% might be somewhat typical, you can negotiate whatever you want.



Putting enough for a co broker does make some sense. (5% boats 3% real estate), but I could argue for a more expensive property, put a dollar amount. I don't feel it takes a lot more effort to sell or list a cheap property or and expensive one.



When I get properties that push a bunch over the $150 boats or $300 houses it's hard to spend a lot of dollars on commissions. The average Joe that owns property in that range averages about $100K in income, so he's spending 2 to 3 months of of work time to make the money to pay the commissions. And it wont take that long. Now, get more expensive stuff, even more compelling.


But here's the hitch. Access to the MLS and Yachtworld is a BIG help. And a lot of brokers have buyers in their pocket, especially when someone calls a broker for an ABC boat, and the broker only has an XYZ boat, and you have the ABC one. So, brokers, for sure have some advantages.... especially good ones.



And, FWIW, boats are harder to sell than houses, especially big ones. And house will always sell in any market, if priced right and look good. Boats won't.



As a rule, I usually do my own thing... buy and sell. But do use brokers. I have a real estate broker that will list it for cost, and I do all the work, which isn't hard, but still faced with a 3% split fee (or dollar amount), unless I sell it, and that works. It's a real hot market right now, but the vast majority of buyers use the MLS. Recently sold a house that way and only 1 response was not represented by a realtor, 15 offers were, so I had my pick of a buyer.



For boats, I just pick a broker that I know, and deals with the kind of boat I have. A few years back, sold a Formula, so I used the Formula dealer. He stored it for me as I had different plans for my lift and did a great job of selling it which worked out well. Last year I sold my Sundancer, did it with Boattrader and Craigs list, sold in two weeks. But, it was cream puff and priced right.



So, it all depends.
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Old 10-25-2019, 08:35 AM   #31
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Good points about brokers (salespersons) income. Seems like most of them are starving, but I find them lazy and not self starters. The sales game requires a self starter, and aggressive person. Getting good info timely to the buyer, returning calls and getting the buyer to see the property are necessary. The very best ones I know have an assistant (real estate). Of the real estate agents I deal with, I find only about 5% are worth their salt. There's several "average" ones, and about half are worthless.


I had my license for about 10 years when I was doing a lot of buying, selling and renting houses (on my own account). I never earned a dime in commission, but took the ones the broker didn't want and gave him ones that made good listings for him. We had 15 sales people and I out produced all of them in revenue for the company.... because I aggressively worked my arse off. Our sales agents paid a monthly "desk" fee and got 100% of the commissions. However, most could get their backside out of bed in the morning. Loved it, but the license turned into more of a liability than an asset so I dropped it.
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