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Old 08-01-2019, 09:02 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by mystery View Post
a few thoughts:
1) only 50 hours?! on a 2012 boat? low hours can be a bad thing. i would want to know in writing the boats usage history and why it was used so little. perhaps there is a valid explanation and you have found a hidden gem. i think the average boat gets used 50 hours per year. as a rule of thumb, i usually do not buy boats that have been used less than 25-50 hours per year. i would definitely want a full mechanical inspection and sea trial.
2) i can't believe the surveyor was scraping away bottom paint. i would be furious as a seller! did you have to pay to re-prime and re-paint all areas scraped off?
3) its probably worth separating "hull construction" from "cosmetic" gelcoat issues that are on the surface. the st44 is a solid boat from all reports. worst case, gelcoat gets covered over with paint. i wonder what a paint job costs in the UK?
4) on that note, blue is a very difficult color to maintain on any boat. it will fade, need to be re-done. most will eventually have the boat painted (not gelcoat). if there are significant issues present at this time, then use as leverage to reduce the purchase price. it sounds like there are just a few blisters and you will have to decide if its a big enough deal to worry about now or if that is a sign that there is more to come. i would want to ask the owner if he ever noticed them and if so, when they became apparent (i.e. is it something that just recently happened or has been there since the boat was new). if the blisters are small enough, should be a somewhat easy job for any one who does fiberglass/gelcoat repairs to tackle to fix BUT it needs to be fixed right and understand the color will likely never match.
5) moisture readings are their own topic. many surveyors wave the device over an area and put it in a report without understanding what the heck they are doing. many false positives with moisture meters. a competent surveyor should be able to dig deeper and really ascertain whether or not there is an issue. did the owner consent to the surveyor "opening" up the blisters for further inspection? not many sellers would consent.
Thanks for the comprehensive response. I have known of this boat since new as it is moored on a private house mooring at my marina. It's very much a rich man's toy. For instance the owner has replaced it with a £700,000+ boat. It has been serviced regularly by the engineer who has looked after my Hallberg-Rassy for 12 years and who I have much faith in. And it has had a sea trial and mechanical inspection. It looks and runs like new!

In the UK surveyors will always look inside a moisture bubble. If not they wouldn't be able to express an opinion and the buyer would walk away. The inspection is normally in a tiny area where there is concern.

The repairs are being down at the seller's expense and I don't have to accept the boat unless I'm satisfied.

My interest at the moment is how could I have two coats of gel coat, and you have come up with some interesting ideas. Thanks and regards.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:03 AM   #22
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I'm not in direct contact with the original owner as the broker took this one as a trade-in for a new boat, So I'm actually buying the boat from the broker. The broker did not have a survey done on this boat and the problem has come as a surprise to him. Still, he made so much money on the new boat sale he can probably take a hit on getting my boat fixed up properly.
See your post now about not being in contact with the original owner. Honestly, I would rather negotiate down on purchase price and fix myself or have a pro at my disposal fix. I have seen dealers rush job fixes / take shortcuts. If you do end up having the dealer/broker fix, I'd want it in writing that its done by someone with the proper credentials/experience, you have the right to re-inspect after, and possibly even have the surveyor come back out.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:06 AM   #23
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Thanks for the comprehensive response. I have known of this boat since new as it is moored on a private house mooring at my marina. It's very much a rich man's toy. For instance the owner has replaced it with a £700,000+ boat. It has been serviced regularly by the engineer who has looked after my Hallberg-Rassy for 12 years and who I have much faith in. And it has had a sea trial and mechanical inspection. It looks and runs like new!

In the UK surveyors will always look inside a moisture bubble. If not they wouldn't be able to express an opinion and the buyer would walk away. The inspection is normally in a tiny area where there is concern.

The repairs are being down at the seller's expense and I don't have to accept the boat unless I'm satisfied.

My interest at the moment is how could I have two coats of gel coat, and you have come up with some interesting ideas. Thanks and regards.
That is an awesome find then! Hopefully only these small cosmetic issues are the only findings and you will have a real gem.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:13 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by mystery View Post
See your post now about not being in contact with the original owner. Honestly, I would rather negotiate down on purchase price and fix myself or have a pro at my disposal fix. I have seen dealers rush job fixes / take shortcuts. If you do end up having the dealer/broker fix, I'd want it in writing that its done by someone with the proper credentials/experience, you have the right to re-inspect after, and possibly even have the surveyor come back out.
Yes, the work is being done my my choice of builder, a company who has worked on my boats for 15 years. It is subject to certification by my surveyor, and I can inspect the progress any time. If I was having the work done myself I'd use the same suppliers. Thanks for your ideas.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:16 AM   #25
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that is an awesome find then! Hopefully only these small cosmetic issues are the only findings and you will have a real gem.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:51 AM   #26
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[QUOTE=JeremyK;787340]
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I had a number of areas on my boat where the top gel coat could be flaked off with your fingernail. The boat was built as a number of pieces in separate molds. Once the pieces are removed, they are glassed together. When all the joints are finished and level, the whole boat is sanded and prepped for a final gel coat. On my boat, that final prep was crap. It's labor intensive as there is an awful lot of hand sanding in tight areas. We ended up sanding off the entire final coat and going back with Awlgrip.

I can't guarantee the above happened to your boat, but it sounds like an area with bad prep work.

Ted[/QUOTE

What make of boat is that, Ted?
Cherubini Independence 45, the one in my avatar. There's a thread on the refit of my boat including removing the bad gel coat and painting it.

Ted
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Old 08-01-2019, 10:19 AM   #27
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[QUOTE=O C Diver;787369]
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Originally Posted by JeremyK View Post

Cherubini Independence 45, the one in my avatar. There's a thread on the refit of my boat including removing the bad gel coat and painting it.

Ted
I'll have a look at Ted. Thanks.
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Old 08-02-2019, 07:02 AM   #28
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I have a 2004, it is white, I believe all are white in the mold


Mine is al grip blue in fact it isn't just the top sides it is under the bottom paint.


Few blisters no big deal


I just did the maiden trip yesterday 160 miles handles like dream,
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Old 08-02-2019, 07:28 AM   #29
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I have a 2004, it is white, I believe all are white in the mold


Mine is al grip blue in fact it isn't just the top sides it is under the bottom paint.


Few blisters no big deal


I just did the maiden trip yesterday 160 miles handles like dream,

Good news that you are enjoying your new boat. This is my first move to power after 30+ years of sail. I loved the sea trial, so I really hope we get the hull issue solved. I'll keep the thread updated.
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Old 08-02-2019, 09:02 AM   #30
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I'll have a look at Ted. Thanks.
My Short Haul Refit

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Old 08-09-2019, 01:24 PM   #31
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dumb question

Have you contacted the manufacturer?

I would guess they could give you a detailed account of the boats build. I would also guess this is not the first time they have heard from someone on this issue. If the white surface was in fact "shiny" when painted over, you are going to have more of this to deal with I would guess. Neither Gel coat nor paint will properly bond with a smooth surface unless there is a "dissolving' of the base coat. I have a hard time believing that Benneteau does not have a solid grasp of surface treatment. They could tell you if they applied the blue. If they did they should get involved.
Osmotic blistering on the blue gel, but not the white? Also unusual.
The cynic in me envisions something like this " hey boss, Daddy Warbucks wants that 44 we have been stuck with. Only problem is he wants it in blue". Boss says "so tell him the blue one will be here in two weeks, get a deposit and send it to the paint shop".
On the other hand, maybe Benneteau will tell you (when you call them) that they finish all their boats in white and paint them the color required by each order. In order to keep a level production run, or possibly to switch model production they may "build ahead".
It sounds as though you have a real find. I would not back away from it . I would dig in harder and get some answers. They are there. Good luck! Nice find! Bill
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