Rust stains at base of railings

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MichaelB1969

Guru
Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
679
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Speedy Charlotte
Vessel Make
Beneteau Swift Trawler 44
On my ST44 I occasionally get rust stains around the base of the railings at the point they meet the fiberglass. This has happened on the upper deck, as well as around the short railings around the cockpit. I'll take a pic next time I'm on the boat, but wondering if this happens to others.

The railing is stainless, so not sure what exactly is rusting. And I'm assuming it's rust.

Thanks,
Mike
 
Yep and I use FSR to take it off. Interested in other comments and different way....
 
Seems like the Star Brite Rust Stain Remover gets good reviews. Love the thought of spray on spray off or just a light scrub. This chemical approach is likely much easier than trying to get it off using a mild polish.

Just ordered some on Amazon. Will let you know how it works.
 
MichaelB1969 said:
Seems like the Star Brite Rust Stain Remover gets good reviews. Love the thought of spray on spray off or just a light scrub. This chemical approach is likely much easier than trying to get it off using a mild polish.

Just ordered some on Amazon. Will let you know how it works.
Click to expand...



I’ve used this and was surprised at how well it worked. Cheers!
 
It it a reflection(no pun intended) of using 304 rather than 316 s/steel? Or can it happen with 316?
 
Does it appear to be leaking from inside the stanchion or is it surface rust? S/S can get corrosion when there is not enough oxygen. May be water is inside and then leaking out and carrying the rust out of the stanchion base.
 
Comodave said:
Does it appear to be leaking from inside the stanchion or is it surface rust? S/S can get corrosion when there is not enough oxygen. May be water is inside and then leaking out and carrying the rust out of the stanchion base.
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Hard to say. I'll have to take a closer look next time I'm on the boat. Will let you know!
 
It is very common for stainless to surface rust on boats. I suspect it is 304 not 316 stainless.

It is very easy to clean if you don’t let it go too long. Any of the oxalic acid based rust stain removers will work.

The best rust stain removers are hydrofloric acid based. Look for Whink or Erusticator in the laundry aisle in your grocery store. They are marketed to remove rust stains from clothing but they actually work much faster than oxalic acid cleaners on stainless and gel coat. Don’t let it sit on glass. I’m told that hydrofloric acid will etch glass.

I just squirt it on the stain and most of the stain just disappears. I rub what ever remains with my finger and then rinse my finger before it starts to sting. Girly men might want to wear gloves. Do keep it out of your eyes.
Rust Stain Remover | Rust Stain | Whink Products Company - America's #1 Specialty Cleaner Company, Eldora, IA
 

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Hopcar, Google what hydrofluoric acid does to your body - it may not burn your skin but it penetrates your skin and dissolves the calcium. First thing that happens is your nails fall out because the nailbed is gone. Then it starts working on your bones. There is no antidote once it gets inside you, only before, and it is cumulative. I believe they cut off the parts with acid in them. So "girly men" is a stupid thing to say; if I were the King I would ban Hydrofluoric acid everywhere and in everything as I think it is worse than plutonium.
 
RT you beat me to it. Its nasty, nasty stuff and keeping it in your house or boat is stupidly reckless. Live with a little surface rust or damage yourself? Good choice. Fluorosis - look that one up too!

The whink company should be shot and p*ssed on!
 
The cause of thIS rust are small iron particleS which are carried by the wind or rain or snow.. The particles fall down on the stainless steel and will make an connection with the chromium parts in the stainless steel. When your boat is is the vicinity of a dockyard or metal factory you have more chance to develop this kind of rust than when you are on the open sea. In the end this superficial rust can also contaminate your SS so cleaning the object is required. Most of the time it is very easy to clean the SS.
 
Mr. Blu said:
The cause of thIS rust are small iron particleS which are carried by the wind or rain or snow.. The particles fall down on the stainless steel and will make an connection with the chromium parts in the stainless steel. When your boat is is the vicinity of a dockyard or metal factory you have more chance to develop this kind of rust than when you are on the open sea. In the end this superficial rust can also contaminate your SS so cleaning the object is required. Most of the time it is very easy to clean the SS.
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Actually, I think you're on to something as this has only happened when my boat has been at the boat yard - which is where it's been for the 3 weeks prior to me posting this.
 
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Mr. Blu said:
The cause of thIS rust are small iron particleS which are carried by the wind or rain or snow.. The particles fall down on the stainless steel and will make an connection with the chromium parts in the stainless steel. When your boat is is the vicinity of a dockyard or metal factory you have more chance to develop this kind of rust than when you are on the open sea. In the end this superficial rust can also contaminate your SS so cleaning the object is required. Most of the time it is very easy to clean the SS.
Click to expand...
It may be iron contamination or organic contamination...

But it is likely the loss of the passivation layer of the stainless steel. Pretty common with lower grades of stainless steel; particularly near surface defects or heat tint and oxide scale from welding.

The worse case scenario would be that the fabricator chose the wrong filler material when making the weld. I.e. 304 or 309 on 316, creating a chromium depleted zone.

The advice you've gotten so far, is pretty accurate. Use an oxalic or citric based cleaner polisher.

If you see tinting of the metal from welding, consider nitric acid.

Do not use hydrochloric acid, as it contains chlorides.

Hydrofluoric acid is indeed dangerous to humans and pretty much every material it touches. (Breaking Bad, early episode, bathtub). Very regulated in industry, because of that.
 
It could be the fasteners.
 
DO NOT....DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT USING HF ACID.
OTHER WARNINGS ARE CORRECT AND SHOULD BE HEEDED.
This not a macho thing and it is irresponsible to recommend anyone consider using it

Ocalic acid based cleaners are plenty strong enough to do the job

Sorry Hopcar.... don't remember disagreeing with you in the past...respect your contributions and all you have done for TFrs... Couldn't let this go w/o a response
 
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You can als find it also on the polyester where the stanchions are mounted. It is not the stainless steel or the polyester that is rusting but the very small particles of iron. The quality of the SS doesnot have anything to do with it. The particles stick to the SS because there is a difference in voltage between the SS and the iron particles. (Like a magnet although SS is not magnetic itself because of the chromium in the alloy). But the same applies for the polyester next to the stainless steel. In Dutch you have a special name for it : " vliegroest" literally translated in English: flying rust. It is a well known phenonomen in industrialized areas. It is superficial (you can feel some roughness when you touch the SS. You should polish it because otherwise it will "infiltrate"the SS. (How quick that happens depends of the quality of the SS).
When we had a chartercompany for Sailing yachts in the Netherlands nearly all the boats in the marina suffered from it because the air in the Netherlands gets polluted by industries more than 200 miles away. AnD especially in a salty environment near the sea.
 
RT Firefly said:
Greetings,
Mr. MB. I've had VERY good success with: Spotless Stainless Home
I had some SS turnbuckles that were slightly rusted. Brush on, wait (but keep moist in hotter weather) rinse off with hose. The website states the product leaves a protective coating. It must because after 1.5 years, not a speck of rust. YMMV.
Click to expand...

I have used the product as well and it works as claimed.

If your stainless steel hardware is fastened to the boat with screws (usually Phillips screws) and you use a steel screwdriver to tighten them, small amounts of steel from the screwdriver will rub off and remain in the screw heads and rust. The rust can wash down onto the deck.
 
Xsbank said:
Hopcar, Google what hydrofluoric acid does to your body - it may not burn your skin but it penetrates your skin and dissolves the calcium. First thing that happens is your nails fall out because the nailbed is gone. Then it starts working on your bones. There is no antidote once it gets inside you, only before, and it is cumulative. I believe they cut off the parts with acid in them. So "girly men" is a stupid thing to say; if I were the King I would ban Hydrofluoric acid everywhere and in everything as I think it is worse than plutonium.
Click to expand...

I apologize for the girly man comment. Yes you should follow the safety directions on the package. I appreciate you pointing out the dangers and I’ll be more careful handling it in the future.

That said I have been using Whink to remove rust stains for about forty years with no problems. Nail beds are all intact. It has been sold in grocery stores for seventy years. If it was as dangerous as you say, it would have been sued out of business by now. I suspect it’s a pretty dilute solution of the acid, but it is a more effective rust remover than the oxalic acid based removers.

I also think your statement that it “is worse than plutonium” is a pretty stupid thing to say.
 
MichaelB1969 said:
On my ST44 I occasionally get rust stains around the base of the railings at the point they meet the fiberglass. This has happened on the upper deck, as well as around the short railings around the cockpit. I'll take a pic next time I'm on the boat, but wondering if this happens to others.

The railing is stainless, so not sure what exactly is rusting. And I'm assuming it's rust.

Thanks,
Mike
Click to expand...



Simple. Bar keepers friend and a tooth brush. It is oxalic acid. Get the sift scrub formula, not the liquid spray. Beneteau rails are 316-L stainless, I have a 34. If it was 304 the rails would surface rust with salt. These don’t. Salt water gets under the stansions and rusts. After you are done with the rust spray with WD 40 and get it under the pads and wipe it off that helps a lot. Do that monthly or after every washing.
 
I will keep this one short. I am a welding engineer. The cause is from the free iron in the SS. (304 and 316 and any other "IRON bearing SS) Passivation or electropolishing prevents this from occurring. After welding, most processors do not passivate the weld bead, so the iron oxide forms on the weld surface and also the end cuts.
The mills that manufacture the tubing passivate upon completion, then the tubing gets cut, bent, welded and shipped. That is why the straight runs of tubing show no signs. Just the ends and welded flanges.
Even the 304L or 316L alloys which are low carbon (<.3%) will show signs of iron oxide staining on the surface if they are not passivated or electropolished.
 
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TJM said:
I will keep this one short. I am a welding engineer. The cause is from the free iron in the SS. (304 and 316 and any other "IRON bearing SS) Passivation or electropolishing prevents this from occurring. After welding, most processors do not passivate so the iron oxide forms in the weld and also the end cuts that are not passivated.
Click to expand...

TJM, how do you passivate the welds and cuts?

I think that Spotless Stainless, recommended by Rufus T., claims to passivate. Suncor Stainless also sells a liquid that claims to passivate. My understanding is that they are acids that remove the surface iron which leaves a high nickel content surface. Is this correct?
 
If you really want to educate yourself about passivating stainless steel, you could Google search ASTM A380, and might find an old copy of it. I have a copy, but it is licensed to my name, so cannot share.

Otherwise, Avesta has some decent handbooks available. Probably online.

It's not rocket science. Was a maintenance engineer in a plant constructed of all sorts of SS and alloys. Passivation and pickling was a normal day to day function.
 
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Calling all ST 44 owners... has anyone re-bedded their railings yet? either the ones going through the teak caprail, ones up on the fly bridge, or in the cockpit? I am trying to understand how they are mounted and what hardware is used. Had a yard come to estimate and they said its not apparent and they'd had to have to tear apart to figure out. If no owners have had their railings re-bedded yet, I will reach out to Beneteau to see if they can shed some light. Thanks!
 
Northern Spy said:
Lepke said:
It could be the fasteners.
Click to expand...

D'oh. Yes. That is very likely as well.
Click to expand...

This is what I suspect as well. Surface rust on SS shows up like freckles or spots all over the surface.

The OP is reporting staining on the fiberglass around the base of the stanchion.

My experience has been the stanchion bedding has failed. Water is wicking underneath the stanchion. The water and lack of oxygen is causing the SS bolts to begin to rust. eventually, water wicks in and out and creates a rust water mixture, which then evaporates and leaves a small rust stain around the stanchion that looks like a coffee ring around a cup.

The resolution is to unbolt the stanchion, clean the area, replace the bolts, and then re-bed the stanchion.
 
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