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Old 03-16-2015, 06:57 PM   #21
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You should also follow your hoses to see if the cooler is cooed with salt water or coolant. On my TAMD41s, the gear cooler is salt water cooled, after the engine HX.
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Old 03-16-2015, 07:36 PM   #22
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It is not hard to remove the cooler on that engine and pressure test it.
Hopefully not thread highjack since discussing oil coolers. I often see references to pressure checking H/E, oil coolers, etc, as above. Is this testing by water hose on intake with outfall closed, at regular water pressure, such as municipal water pressure, or other method ? I am referring to DIY testing, not radiator shop. Thanks.
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Old 03-16-2015, 07:59 PM   #23
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I pressure test coolers by using my well pump pressure which is about 40psig. Rig up garden hoses with adapters to give the cooler a constant supply of water to one water fitting, with the other capped off. Leave it for an hour or whatever with oil ports left open. Any water shows up in oil side means fail.

Some municipal water systems have very high pressure, and those I would be a bit hesitant to test some larger coolers. Little gear coolers should be a non issue due to their small size, small tubes and brazed on end caps.
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Old 03-16-2015, 08:56 PM   #24
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Twin Disc recommends 40 wt. engine oil. There should be a lubricant plate detailing exactly the type and requirements of the lubricant. They do not use ATF Fluid and it voids any warranty on their Gear.
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:10 PM   #25
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What they did with my heat exchanger was to submerge it in water with one of the oil ports caped off and with a compressor attached to the other port. pressurized it with 40 PSI and made sure it held pressure for one hour and no bubbles come up.
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:21 PM   #26
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Today I removed about 2 cups of oil from my Twin Disc into a clear glass jar because I had over filled it initially. Again it looked like water was in the oil in the first amount of oil out of the tranny. However after letting it sit for an hour or so, the oil looks uniformly the same. I use a built in oil change pump that is used for the engine, generator and transmission. Is it possible that the oil change pump could foam up the oil until it gets good flow?


If water is in the oil, wouldn't it be very plain to see in the glass jar?


To answer one of the questions, my transmission plate says use 30 wt engine oil. The previous owner used Delo 100 30 wt. The gear cooler uses sea water for cooling.
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:26 PM   #27
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Today I removed about 2 cups of oil from my Twin Disc into a clear glass jar because I had over filled it initially. Again it looked like water was in the oil in the first amount of oil out of the tranny. However after letting it sit for an hour or so, the oil looks uniformly the same. I use a built in oil change pump that is used for the engine, generator and transmission. Is it possible that the oil change pump could foam up the oil until it gets good flow?

If water is in the oil, wouldn't it be very plain to see in the glass jar?

To answer one of the questions, my transmission plate says use 30 wt engine oil. The previous owner used Delo 100 30 wt. The gear cooler uses sea water for cooling.
If you haven't checked the condition of your transmission heat exchanger, you have not completed your due diligence, especially if your tranny oil has not ben changed. My tranny hx was nearly completely clogged. I had no water in the transmission, but it was not allowing good flow to the coolant hx. Btw waht engine is your transmission coupled to?
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:28 PM   #28
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I had water in my Borg/Warner in Nov. Did the flush 5 times. 3 hours of cruising later and it was time for Towboat US. One day and $3500 later and the rebuilt unit was back in service.
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:40 PM   #29
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I had water in my Borg/Warner in Nov. Did the flush 5 times. 3 hours of cruising later and it was time for Towboat US. One day and $3500 later and the rebuilt unit was back in service.
One day? Wow.
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Old 03-16-2015, 11:47 PM   #30
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Yep, that part was amazing!
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Old 03-17-2015, 08:30 AM   #31
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Sunchaser, you are letting him off way too easy! We want a training session on how to properly identify water in oil please! Pictures and everything!!!

Cheap scotch and cigar would be considered in your sentencing.....

Glad you found it.....
Sometimes the hope is that since it is the internet trouble shooting suggestions are wrong. Here is another thought - engine oil has additives/emulsifiers that help the base stock to entrain moisture. Possibly that is why a clear water oil separation cannot be easily discerned by Windmist. Hopefully whatever goo is or was in the oil was removed via an oil change over a week ago.

No training session required but I can say that I changed my emulsified engine oil 5 times in two days as I was troubleshooting water in the engine oil. It turned out to be a bad after cooler. Bypassing the faulty cooler allowed me to travel another 600 miles without incident to have the new AC installed.

The engine survived unscathed. The curse and blessings of today's emission compliant engines ----
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Old 03-18-2015, 04:26 AM   #32
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Quote:
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Today I removed about 2 cups of oil from my Twin Disc into a clear glass jar because I had over filled it initially. Again it looked like water was in the oil in the first amount of oil out of the tranny. However after letting it sit for an hour or so, the oil looks uniformly the same. I use a built in oil change pump that is used for the engine, generator and transmission. Is it possible that the oil change pump could foam up the oil until it gets good flow?


If water is in the oil, wouldn't it be very plain to see in the glass jar?
An overfilled case may create the condition of foaming oil. It does in many automotive applications. (Transmissions)

Removing oil and letting it settle should give a very clear picture as to if there is oil or was it just foamed oil as a condition. Water will tend to rise to the top as oil is heavier than water.

If you think it is posible there is water in the oil in your mixture, dip a paper towel in it. Many times you can tell just from that if the towel has only oil or a mixture. OR if you are unsure, in an open area, (away from anything that wil burn - like off the dock in the parking lot) hold a flame near that mixture on the paper towel. Water doesn't burn.

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Old 03-18-2015, 06:44 AM   #33
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An overfilled case may create the condition of foaming oil. It does in many automotive applications. (Transmissions)

Removing oil and letting it settle should give a very clear picture as to if there is oil or was it just foamed oil as a condition.]Water will tend to rise to the top as oil is heavier than water.

If you think it is posible there is water in the oil in your mixture, dip a paper towel in it. Many times you can tell just from that if the towel has only oil or a mixture. OR if you are unsure, in an open area, (away from anything that wil burn - like off the dock in the parking lot) hold a flame near that mixture on the paper towel. Water doesn't burn.

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????
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Old 03-18-2015, 09:59 AM   #34
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????

Well if it was true that would solve any future oil spill problems.
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Old 03-18-2015, 11:40 AM   #35
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Sorry I meant the other way around. My insomina was speaking there.

If the oil and water are mised use the paper towel, not cloth rag just paper.

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Old 03-18-2015, 01:10 PM   #36
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Thanks everyone for your comments and help on this non-existent problem. I'm pretty sure I don't have a problem with water in the oil as I never see the slightest evidence of water after letting the oil sit overnight in a glass jar. I just have never seen what foaming oil looks like.


When I thought I had overfilled the transmission that was also wrong. After I started up the engine and checked the oil while in idle, as the manual says to do, I barely had oil on the tip of the dipstick. I had to put all the oil I extracted back in plus some. I think I now know more than I ever wanted to about this Twin Disc transmission.


Again, thanks everyone for your help.
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:03 AM   #37
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water when well mixed with oil forms a suspension that will not "settle out" even if you wait years.
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Old 03-19-2015, 02:01 PM   #38
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water when well mixed with oil forms a suspension that will not "settle out" even if you wait years.
Thanks Bayview. You also posted this earlier in this thread:

Whoh! Tranny oil is not usually visibly dirty unless very high hours or something is wrong. Water in oil will not separate once it is mixed well. The color however is baby $hit brown, sort of dark mustard without any burnt smell.
It is not hard to remove the cooler on that engine and pressure test it.


When I took out a couple of cups of oil, thinking the transmission was overfilled, that oil looked exactly like new oil. No difference in color at all.

This engine only has 1300 hrs on it and it and the transmission has always been well maintained. So I think what I will do is run the boat for a few hours and then pull out a small amount of oil and have it analyzed which probably won't cost anymore than having the gear cooler pressure tested. Also I hate working on engines as I seem to cause more problems than I solve.

As for oil analysis, there is a company called Blackstone Laboratories that has a neat program. They will send you a oil test container at no charge and when you get the sample to send in, that is when they charge you $25 for the analysis. I have the container in hand so will use it for the transmission oil.

Thanks again for the help.
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