Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 06-04-2015, 08:52 AM   #1
Guru
 
SCOTTEDAVIS's Avatar
 
City: Vero Beach, FL.
Country: US
Vessel Name: FIREFLY
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 913
Question Water flow alarm, needed?

Firefly has only the engine temperature gauge and buzzer. I have a Ford Sabre 120 and as this is the same base engine as the Lehman 120 marinized by Sabre, it must have the same cooling weakness inherent to the Ford Dorset as the Lehman.

I am considering adding a raw water flow and wet exhaust warning system to monitor both the raw water flow into the engine an the water flow through the exhaust for cooling.

This is the system I am thinking about...

20358 Water Flow and Exhaust Panel, 12v [] - $46.00 : AQUALARM, Warning Systems For Land And Sea


Does anyone else have this system and how is it?
What does your boat have in the way of water flow indicators?
Overkill, unnecessary, waste of money?
Thoughts, ideas, comments?

Thanks in advance for your input.


__________________
Advertisement

SCOTTEDAVIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 09:05 AM   #2
Enigma
 
RT Firefly's Avatar
 
City: Slicker?
Country: Bumpkin?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 9,994
Greetings,
Mr. F. Isn't this unit performing the same task as an exhaust temperature sensor? 20245 Exhaust Alarm Kit. Single Engine [] - $73.00 : AQUALARM, Warning Systems For Land And Sea
I wonder which "system" would give you the best (quickest) response? It seems the unit I cited has fewer moving parts and might be less prone to gumming/jamming up and require less servicing. A more passive system if you will. Good question.
__________________

__________________
RTF
RT Firefly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 09:27 AM   #3
Guru
 
N4712's Avatar
 
City: South FL
Country: U.S.A
Vessel Name: Oliver
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 47 Hull# 12
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,613
I think its worth it for $46.
__________________
Thanks, Oliver
M/V Oliver
Nordhavn 47 Hull #12
N4712 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 09:56 AM   #4
TF Site Team
 
Larry M's Avatar
 
City: JAX, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hobo
Vessel Model: Krogen 42-120
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,725
We have an older Aqualarm Five System Monitoring Kit. I've never had the exhaust temperature go off but we did lose our water flow and the sensor did it's job. We shut the engine down immediately. The response was quick enough that we did not damage the impellor. All our sensors are tied to a bell that gets your attention on or off the boat. I think they are a good idea.

There are other good systems out there. Maybe someone can suggest an other manufacturer.

20001 Five Systems Monitoring Kit Single [] - $349.00 : AQUALARM, Warning Systems For Land And Sea
Larry M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:08 AM   #5
Guru
 
SCOTTEDAVIS's Avatar
 
City: Vero Beach, FL.
Country: US
Vessel Name: FIREFLY
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 913
Quote:
Originally Posted by RT Firefly View Post
Greetings,
Mr. F. Isn't this unit performing the same task as an exhaust temperature sensor? 20245 Exhaust Alarm Kit. Single Engine [] - $73.00 : AQUALARM, Warning Systems For Land And Sea
I wonder which "system" would give you the best (quickest) response? It seems the unit I cited has fewer moving parts and might be less prone to gumming/jamming up and require less servicing. A more passive system if you will. Good question.

Thanks for the response, the kit I am looking at has the exhaust input (I will need to add the sensor band) for overheating exhaust. It also has the raw water inflow warning (I will also need the flow-sensor inline with the flow from the strainer to the impeller) to show a lack of water into the engine.



My thoughts are if I start up with a closed sea-valve or if weeds or a plastic bag block the water flow the alarm will go off even before there is time for a temperature increase anywhere in the engine. Seem right?

The exhaust temperature may just be belts and suspenders.

It seem the entire setup can be in my hand for a bit under $200.

What am I missing?
SCOTTEDAVIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:18 AM   #6
TF Site Team
 
Larry M's Avatar
 
City: JAX, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hobo
Vessel Model: Krogen 42-120
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,725
I don't think your missing anything but for a $150 more you could add low oil pressure, fire and high bilge. Just an idea.
Larry M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:29 AM   #7
Guru
 
SCOTTEDAVIS's Avatar
 
City: Vero Beach, FL.
Country: US
Vessel Name: FIREFLY
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post
I don't think your missing anything but for a $150 more you could add low oil pressure, fire and high bilge. Just an idea.
Interesting!

You gave me a thought, if the panel is just an indicator light and alarm responding to a closed circuit.

I could substitute other items for say the high water (I already have) and say the fire (Fireboy system with indicator on board).

I would like a exhaust temp. sensor and water flow on the gen-set and perhaps with a relabeling of these two items and the purchase of a flow sensor and exhaust temp sensor for the gen-set I could have both covered on one panel.

Hmmm Thanks for the food for thought.
SCOTTEDAVIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:40 AM   #8
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,784
Yes, you want both water flow and exhaust temp sensors. You can have flow, but still be in an overheat situation for a variety of reasons. Some folks think the Borel exhaust temp sensor is the best, but I've had good luck with most Aqualarm products (except their bilge pump switch). Defender has the Aqualarm on sale right now:

Marine Engine Overheat Detectors on Sale

If you want to go deluxe, add a pyrometer gauge to get a baseline and detect emerging issues before they hit the alarm stage:

http://www.sbmar.com/smx-marine-pyro-egt-gauge-kit.php
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:52 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
obthomas's Avatar
 
City: Seabrook Texas
Country: USA
Vessel Name: TheVenture
Vessel Model: 1985 Bestway Labelle Sundeck 40ft
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 462
I have the twin engine six systems Aqualarm. Very good system. Much more trustworthy than volvo penta panel alarms.
obthomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 10:55 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
obthomas's Avatar
 
City: Seabrook Texas
Country: USA
Vessel Name: TheVenture
Vessel Model: 1985 Bestway Labelle Sundeck 40ft
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 462
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTTEDAVIS View Post
Interesting!

You gave me a thought, if the panel is just an indicator light and alarm responding to a closed circuit.

I could substitute other items for say the high water (I already have) and say the fire (Fireboy system with indicator on board).

I would like a exhaust temp. sensor and water flow on the gen-set and perhaps with a relabeling of these two items and the purchase of a flow sensor and exhaust temp sensor for the gen-set I could have both covered on one panel.

Hmmm Thanks for the food for thought.
Just be aware that some of the circuits alarm when broken and some alarm when made.
obthomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 11:02 AM   #11
Guru
 
Brooksie's Avatar
 
City: Cape Cod, MA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Island Seeker
Vessel Model: Willard 36 Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 954
I have an old Aqualarm sensor w/ a beeper from RadioShack on my downeast boat back from 20 years ago when they only offered one size, 1-1/2NPT. It has worked well all those years and has saved me several times.
Install it in the discharge line into the exhaust, that way it warns of a blown-off engine hose as well as ceased water flow.
That said, I installed a newer 1" one on Island Seeker and it failed in short order. My son installed the same thing on his boat and it failed too, blocking flow to one of his manifolds causing other damage.
Now I see they have abandoned that style. I hope the latest ones are better.
Brooksie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 11:23 AM   #12
Guru
 
SCOTTEDAVIS's Avatar
 
City: Vero Beach, FL.
Country: US
Vessel Name: FIREFLY
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 913
Quote:
Originally Posted by obthomas View Post
Just be aware that some of the circuits alarm when broken and some alarm when made.




{Yes Dear, that alarm means everything is fine, when it stops we have a problem.....what!.... say again!...huhh?.... why are you packing your duffel? }
SCOTTEDAVIS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 12:00 PM   #13
QB
Senior Member
 
QB's Avatar
 
City: San Diego and Gabriola
Country: USA and Canada
Vessel Name: Skookum Maru
Vessel Model: Ed Monk design #1924
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 215
Quote:
Originally Posted by obthomas View Post
Just be aware that some of the circuits alarm when broken and some alarm when made.
Which ones alarm when broken? I'm pretty sure that on the Aqualarm systems, all circuits alarm when made.
QB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 12:41 PM   #14
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,784
On my Hatteras the engine temp alarm was a "normally closed" sender, meaning it alarmed when open.
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 01:56 PM   #15
QB
Senior Member
 
QB's Avatar
 
City: San Diego and Gabriola
Country: USA and Canada
Vessel Name: Skookum Maru
Vessel Model: Ed Monk design #1924
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 215
Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
On my Hatteras the engine temp alarm was a "normally closed" sender, meaning it alarmed when open.
I think that wouldn't work with the Aqualarm panel then.

The Aqualarm water flow and oil pressure switches are normally closed, but "normally" means when there is no flow / no pressure. (So those circuits should only be energized when the engine is running.)
QB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 01:57 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
obthomas's Avatar
 
City: Seabrook Texas
Country: USA
Vessel Name: TheVenture
Vessel Model: 1985 Bestway Labelle Sundeck 40ft
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 462
Quote:
Originally Posted by QB View Post
Which ones alarm when broken? I'm pretty sure that on the Aqualarm systems, all circuits alarm when made.

On my aqualarm system the bell sounds with ignition on because the oil and water switches are closed (made). They open when water flows and oil pressure builds to silence the alarm. My temperature switches provide a ground (make) when overheated. The fire alarm shorts as does the high water alarm (makes) so you are right. I stand corrected.
obthomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 02:43 PM   #17
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,784
Quote:
Originally Posted by QB View Post
I think that wouldn't work with the Aqualarm panel then.

The Aqualarm water flow and oil pressure switches are normally closed, but "normally" means when there is no flow / no pressure. (So those circuits should only be energized when the engine is running.)
Yes, the Hatteras has a proprietary panel of relays. Though I am pretty sure Aqualarm has a replacement for that too. If you have any questions, contact them, they very helpful.
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 02:56 PM   #18
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,157
My theory was to go straight for the "potential overheat" symptom... so replaced our original analog water (coolant) temperature gauges with digital gauges that have built-in programmable alarms.


Our normal engine ranges should be between 160-181F, over 200F would be worrying... so I set the alarms for 185F... on the theory that would get my attention and I could begin troubleshooting (including shutdown) right away.


-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 04:21 PM   #19
Guru
 
fryedaze's Avatar
 
City: Solomons Island Md
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Fryedaze
Vessel Model: MC 42 (Overseas Ltd) Monk 42
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,052
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger42c View Post
My theory was to go straight for the "potential overheat" symptom... so replaced our original analog water (coolant) temperature gauges with digital gauges that have built-in programmable alarms.


Our normal engine ranges should be between 160-181F, over 200F would be worrying... so I set the alarms for 185F... on the theory that would get my attention and I could begin troubleshooting (including shutdown) right away.


-Chris

Chris, do you have a source for those digital temp indicators.
__________________
Dave Frye
Fryedaze, MC 42 (Monk 42') 1989 Overseas Co
http://mvfryedaze.blogspot.com/
fryedaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2015, 04:49 PM   #20
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,784
Saw these on a guy's boat, he says they're pretty slick. Looked cool.

EGT Digital PMDW Series Pyrometer Gauge + Probe Kit - Marine Engines
__________________

__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012