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Old 01-22-2015, 08:54 PM   #21
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I use one of these on my Velvet Drive 7000. The small hose gets all the fluid.
This is the same rig we use on our engines (FL120s), transmissions, and generator. It works great. However for the engines and generator, the oil must be pretty warm to hot in order for it to flow up the little suck-out tube in a reasonable amount of time.

We run each engine until the oil filter is quite warm to the touch. Then we shut the engine down, punch a couple of holes in the bottom of the filter (mounted upside down on an FL120) and proceed to suck out the engine oil from the pan through the dipstick tube. It takes about 10 minutes to pull out the 12 quarts, after which we change the filter which by now is almost completely empty of oil.
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Old 01-22-2015, 09:05 PM   #22
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Goes to show you...manual's from the manufacturer disagree and so do in the field experts.

Reality is both work just fine as proven by members here posting their real life experience.
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Old 01-22-2015, 11:13 PM   #23
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Our BW Velvet Drive manual, which dates from 1973 when the boat was built, says to use ATF only unless ATF is not available, in which case it's okay to use the same lube oil as the engine but only until the first available time it can be removed and ATF put in.

When we acquired the boat in 1998 we asked the very experienced diesel shop we use if this was the accepted "rule" and they said yes, follow the manual. They only use ATF in Velvet Drives, never engine lube oil.
The are a lot of folks that use SAE 30 or 40 in Velvet drives because the manual says its acceptable for the low rev high ratio diesel trannys. The previous owner of my boat chose to put SAE 40 motor oil in my BW velvet drive 7000. Probably no harm for a 2.66:1 tranny with a normal cruise at 1600 RPM. Unfortunately the 7000 manual doesn't give the option to run oil. It clearly states that ATF it the correct fluid. The 7000 is rated for 500HP.
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Old 01-22-2015, 11:22 PM   #24
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I think TF needs a new status level. I just notices I am now a GURU. Marin and psneeld are also GURU. I couldn't polish these guys boots!
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Old 01-23-2015, 12:40 AM   #25
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I think TF needs a new status level. I just notices I am now a GURU. Marin and psneeld are also GURU. I couldn't polish these guys boots!
I am about a much a guru when it comes to boats as those ground squirrels in your photo. There are guys (and women if you include Peggy Hall) on the Grand Banks forum who have forgotten more about boats than I will ever know. The ONLY boats I can say I'm pretty familiar with are Grand Banks and Arima. And the ONLY marine diesel engine I can say I'm familiar with is the Ford Lehman 120.

What I am pretty good at (because it's my job, among other things) is listening to someone I respect on some subject, remembering what they say, and communicating it to someone else.

At work, I listen to engineers and mechanics and machinists and tool designers and pilots and airline CEOs, COOs and CFOs and airline operations, marketing and maintenance managers and flight ops people and turn it all into things that (hopefully) will help sell airplanes and bombs and missiles and drones and whatnot to people who want them.

In boating I listen to shipwrights and yard owners and diesel shop guys and real experienced power and sailboat cruisers in this area and then pass it on to others when relevant.

Bob Lowe over on the GB forum is a guru. I consider Carl (Delfin) one. Eric (Mannyboats), particulalry when it comes to experience up and down the PNW/BC/SE Alaska coast despite his rather unorthodox views on anchors. Tad obviously even though I don't know him personally. Psneeld, certainly, particularly since he's had experience with all manner of boats and periodially hauls them out of the mud or off the rocks after their owners did something dumb. Rick Boggs, formerly of this forum, knows more about engines and generators and stuff that makes boats go than pretty much anyone I've become acquainted with.

They're gurus. I sure as hell am not.

The TF titles are based solely on the number of posts one has put up. Actually knowing anything other than how to select "Submit Reply" is not a requirement.
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Old 01-23-2015, 06:59 AM   #26
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Greetings,
Mr. Marin. That is why I've never had nor aspired to guru status. I DO know a bit about boats.

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Old 01-23-2015, 08:15 AM   #27
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After a discussion with my local Velvet Drive guys (30 + years experience) I am using 5-30 synthetic in my 71 series tranny after the rebuild I did.
In talking with fellow engineers in my company that were bearing specialists, I know ATF is not the best lubrication choice. And the manual does say engine oil is fine at the lower rpm range, so that's why I made my choice.
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Old 01-23-2015, 01:26 PM   #28
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What was your mans reasoning for OK'ing Multiweight oil (granted it's synthetic oil) since the Borg Warner service manual says not to use it?

"SAE #30 is preferred. SAE#40 is acceptable Multi -viscosity oils such as l0w-40w are not acceptable. The first choice is SAE-API service class “CD”oils. The second choice is SAE API service class “CC” oils."
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Old 01-23-2015, 02:24 PM   #29
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Like I said, I had a discussion with the "old timers" at my local Velvet Drive distributors and that's what we went with. My BW rebuild manual does not say "unacceptable", they simply say they do not recommend it. There is a difference there.
I also have one BW manual that simply says engine oil. Multi vis falls into that category.
It runs fine, runs cool, and runs quiet after over 1000 hours and probably 5000 miles.
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Old 01-23-2015, 02:27 PM   #30
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Again one of those TF discussions where reality trumps theory.....

and keep something long enough...like a hurricane lamp and it has gone from whale oil to petroleum oil to modern chemical mixes.

I will bet many Lehmans and trannys can live a long life with many modern lubes.
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Old 01-23-2015, 03:37 PM   #31
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Like I said, I had a discussion with the "old timers" at my local Velvet Drive distributors and that's what we went with.
I was thinking of switching to 30W motor oil since that's what I'm carrying around for the engines. Just one less barrel of oil to store. I was more interested in why synthetic multi grade and not regular dyno multi grade?? Thanks!!
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:01 PM   #32
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I was thinking of switching to 30W motor oil since that's what I'm carrying around for the engines. Just one less barrel of oil to store. I was more interested in why synthetic multi grade and not regular dyno multi grade?? Thanks!!
Oh I didn't address that. I know that the bearings need lots of lubrication in these gears, and I know that ATF is not the greatest lubrication choice (although used here because of its anti-foaming quality).
So I went with synthetic because it is "supposed" to be a better lubricant, and run cooler.
Ok probably splitting hairs here (I guess no more than many on this board), but that was my reasoning.
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:07 PM   #33
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Synthetics survive overheating better...a temp or blockage in cooling or other adverse condition would have less effect on a synthetic.
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:25 PM   #34
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I have twin dics on my, now I am going to have to dig into the manual to see.....My prepreation lists just gets longer....Thanks TF!
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Old 01-23-2015, 04:53 PM   #35
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Oh I didn't address that. So I went with synthetic because it is "supposed" to be a better lubricant, and run cooler.
Ok probably splitting hairs here (I guess no more than many on this board), but that was my reasoning.
Ok. . Unfortunately, I don't want to switch back to multi grade in my engines again, as for whatever reason, the girls like it too much and drink it gingerly. So I would still be carrying two different types of oil if I put Syn, in the tanny's. I think I'll go with the 30W for now until someone comes up with a do or die reason to switch it. Thank!
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Old 01-23-2015, 05:29 PM   #36
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I'll add to the chorus - same as in my manual - Dexron is "preferred" SAE30 is "acceptable".

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