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Old 10-05-2017, 07:20 PM   #1
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Tier 3 diesel engine choices

My next boat will probably be a 31 to 35 ft tug/trawler and I'd like to hear about parts and service experience on newer Tier 3 diesels on the West coast OR/WA. Volvo D4/D6, Cummins QSB5.9, Deere 4045M, Yanmar, and maybe Perkins.

All manufacturers like to get "dots on the map" so they can show that there is service everywhere, but we all know that reality can be different when you are stranded with a wire harness issue or bad sensor.

Which major manufacturers respond the best with their distributor and dealer network? Anyone offering a basic software program that will let you troubleshoot and read fault codes?

I'm partial to Deere (industrial) but don't know how well they support their marine engines. Thanks for any input!
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Old 10-05-2017, 08:52 PM   #2
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In my area Deere has the least support...almost non existent. With the exception of Perkins the rest are pretty equal.
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Old 10-05-2017, 10:50 PM   #3
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My Deere 6068's were fitted in Port Townsend, WA. They were pretty much the last available Tier II's in the USA at the time of installation. There is good support for them in the PNW. Also in Australia, where I have the boat now.

Deere is one of the preferred choices for re-power - most of the OA Mk 1's with re-powers have gone with 6068 Deere. But the 4045 would be enough power, and they are also very good engines. The PNW has a lot of marine Deere users.

There is now 1100 hrs on each of my 6068's. I have only had one issue, a relay failure on the injector pump. The fault codes were accurate and showed on the helm display, no special software was required. Dealer said he had never seen a relay failure before. It was hanging a little loose rather than being tightly secured, and we postulate that vibration caused an internal failure in the relay. Clearly an unusual and rare event, but stuff happens as they say.

Deere would always be my first choice if they had a model with the right power output for the boat I had in mind. They have good fuel efficiency.

Edit. I forgot about a seal failure on one of the raw water pumps. I caught it early as I saw the water leaking and the salt deposit. no damage. No engine overheat alarm. Pump rebuilt by dealer quite quickly. At the time they said unusual to get a seal failure at so few hours.
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Old 10-06-2017, 05:57 AM   #4
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Do any of your engine options have mechanical injection and no turbo?

That would be my choice for extended cruising.
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Old 10-06-2017, 08:20 AM   #5
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Mechanical injection would be great, but with Tier 3 in the 150-250 HP range everyone has had to move to common rail injection and electronic controls. These systems are pretty reliable, but you can't do much without a trained technician, laptop, updated software, etc.
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Old 10-06-2017, 09:34 AM   #6
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"My next boat will probably be a 31 to 35 ft tug/trawler"

"but with Tier 3 in the 150-250 HP range everyone has had to move to common rail injection and electronic controls."

If its a displacement boat 1/3 to 1/5 the HP will be required , how high can the HP be before Tier 3 starts?
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Old 10-06-2017, 10:19 AM   #7
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The EPA has made it very complex to understand with all the categories and HP ranges, but it looks like final Tier 3 took effect in 2014 for recreational diesels. 25-100HP allows slightly higher emissions, so manufacturers may not need to use common rail if they can meet standards. Above 100HP is more restrictive, so I'm assuming it's all electronic and common rail injection.
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Old 10-06-2017, 01:27 PM   #8
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Timeoff:

A lot depends on how you plan to run the boat. If you plan to go fast using 200+ hp continuously then the Cummins QSB can't be beat for robustness as well as dealer service.

If you only plan to run at displacement speeds using maybe 50 hp then other engines can be considered. But the QSB can't be beat for that service either.

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Old 10-06-2017, 01:35 PM   #9
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Yea, my votes would be for the Deere 4045 or Cummins QSB5.9. Which you get depends on how much hp you expect to need. Both have good reputations and should be well supported in the PNW.

To cruise hull speed probably need about 30-50hp, so one rated at 100-150 should be good. That favors the 'Deere, which I think you can get in 100-150. Lowest rated QSB is 230hp I think, may be a bit overkill. Unless you want to try to beat hull speed.
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Old 10-06-2017, 01:46 PM   #10
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Deere in PNW. I have 5 years experience with two 6068s. The only problem I have had is faulty starter switches.
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Old 10-08-2017, 05:56 PM   #11
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I agree on the Deere, 4045M.


In the 150-200 HP tier 3 range: Perkins does not appear to have anything, Volvo has the D3 series, Yanmar the new 4LV series, and then there is the Cummins QSB5.9 which is probably overkill.


The Beta/Kubota V3800 (99HP) looks interesting and less complicated, although I know nothing about the transmissions they offer.


Volvo seems to be the most common engine offered by the boat builders, but a turbocharged and supercharged diesel running at 3500 RPM just sounds over-stressed to me.
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Old 10-08-2017, 07:34 PM   #12
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Repowered with a John Deere 4045 tier 2. Have 1,500 hours in under 2 years with only a couple of wiring harness connector issues. Great dealer support from the company I bought from. At one point it looked like I might have needed a throttle position sender ($700+). Dealer had one on the shelf and if I needed it, he'd next day air it to me and resolve the replacement with JD. Hard to beat a dealer who will troubleshoot stuff and explain fault codes over the phone. Unfortunately, there aren't as many JD marine dealers as Cummins or Cat.

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Old 10-29-2017, 08:26 PM   #13
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Looking at a Nordic Tug 34 now, but they only offer the Volvo D4-260. Max torque is at 2500 rpm, so at slower speeds you are always going to be on the back side of the torque curve.


Anyone out there have this engine (or similar D4) that can give me some good/bad experiences with service, warranty, parts etc? Thanks.
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Old 10-29-2017, 08:47 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timeoff View Post
Looking at a Nordic Tug 34 now, but they only offer the Volvo D4-260. Max torque is at 2500 rpm, so at slower speeds you are always going to be on the back side of the torque curve.


Anyone out there have this engine (or similar D4) that can give me some good/bad experiences with service, warranty, parts etc? Thanks.


Here come the haters.

I ainít one. We have two tamd63 and they are fine. Parts are expensive, but volvos are good and reliable as any motor out there.
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Old 10-29-2017, 08:51 PM   #15
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Perhaps this emission situation will promote more twin engine boats.
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Old 10-29-2017, 08:52 PM   #16
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Volvos were not a good experience for me.
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Old 10-29-2017, 10:09 PM   #17
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I had Volvos and agree with Tom good and reliable as any motor out there. Parts did seam expensive. I now have QSB's and love them so far.
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Old 10-29-2017, 11:37 PM   #18
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I canít speak for Oregon. Puget Sound has great dealer support for Volvo, yanmar, Deere, cumins, man, cat and Detroit.

Iím not making an engine recommendation. Just informing you that dealer support is not an issue on these engines.
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Old 10-30-2017, 08:18 AM   #19
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Good, thank you. I'm starting to research VP dealers in the Puget Sound area. I don't mind doing all the regular maintenance, but sometimes you need the tech with the laptop, software, and experience.

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Originally Posted by tiltrider1 View Post
I canít speak for Oregon. Puget Sound has great dealer support for Volvo, yanmar, Deere, cumins, man, cat and Detroit.

Iím not making an engine recommendation. Just informing you that dealer support is not an issue on these engines.
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Old 10-30-2017, 08:36 AM   #20
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Given the large presence of Lugger engines, which are almost entirely marinized Deere engines, in the PNW as well as Deere and Deere industrial/agro, I would be focused on Cummins and Deere myself. And I'd re-up my subscription to Boatdiesel.com and get some more expert opinions.
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