Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-08-2016, 09:47 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
David Hughes's Avatar
 
City: Marietta
Country: US
Vessel Name: True Love
Vessel Model: Leopard 37 PC
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 128
Stator failure?- Northern Lights 6kw

Had guests on my boat last week, and while at anchor in Pelican Bay, Cayo Costa, FL ( hot as blazes), after about 10 hours of running the Air Con units, smoke began pouring out of the engine room- more specifically the generator sound containment box, and even more specifically the windings end of the generator. It was a LOT of smoke. They shut down the gen, donned life jackets are were nearly ready to jump. The smoke soon abated after shutdown and they spent the remaining couple of days at South Seas and Tween Waters so they could run shore power. All that is preamble to my question: Has this happened to anyone else and did you have to spend the $4000 for the new stator/windings unit, or did you have it simply rewound by someone. If rewound, about what should that cost? Tomorrow, Gulf Coast Marine Electric ( who I like and trust) is coming over to look, but it would nice to not be a complete ignoramus about it. Thanks!
__________________
Advertisement

__________________
David Hughes
2009 Leopard 37PC- Cape Coral, FL
David Hughes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 12:20 AM   #2
Guru
 
Ski in NC's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Louisa
Vessel Model: Custom Built 38
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,890
Rare for stators to burn out on NL units, but it does happen. Check with Broward Armature, they have popular rewound units on the shelf.
__________________

Ski in NC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 02:23 AM   #3
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Many Northern Lights generators came with the Marathon Magnaplus generator end.

This is probably the best generator end I've seen in terms of reliability.

If your generator end is ruined, and by the sounds of things it might be you can google "marathon Generator end"

You will find that you can get a brand new end for MUCH less than the $4,000 you mentioned. I found the 6 kw end for $2K and the 8KW end for $2100 using google.

In the heat of florida, larger is better for a generator end, as long as the length fits in your enclosure. For example the 6 and the 8Kw are the exact same frame size so they bolt up the same with the 8 kw being a couple inches longer.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 05:51 AM   #4
TF Site Team
 
Bay Pelican's Avatar
 
City: Chicago, IL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bay Pelican
Vessel Model: Krogen 42
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,795
Had to replace the stator on a Westerbeke 8kw. First tried rewinding. The rewinding failed in one hour. Cost $3,500 for the refurbished part.
__________________
Marty
Bay Pelican is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 09:11 AM   #5
Veteran Member
 
pacopico's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: USA
Vessel Name: REEL INN
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 36 Tournament Fisherman
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 44
Those gen ends are rather bullet proof...surprised to hear smoked...I see you mention it is in a sound shield. How is the airflow to the rear of the genset (air inlet) - is there some obstruction?

Typically it is better to replace the gen end alone, vs a local re-wind.

That said, rewinding isn't rocket surgery, so it can be done well by someone with the right experience and materials.

On the gen end, it is not a Marathon...it's our proprietary end (Taiyo) and it is not compatible with any other models...the M673 has it own "one and only" end.
pacopico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 10:49 AM   #6
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacopico View Post
Those gen ends are rather bullet proof...surprised to hear smoked...I see you mention it is in a sound shield. How is the airflow to the rear of the genset (air inlet) - is there some obstruction?

Typically it is better to replace the gen end alone, vs a local re-wind.

That said, rewinding isn't rocket surgery, so it can be done well by someone with the right experience and materials.

On the gen end, it is not a Marathon...it's our proprietary end (Taiyo) and it is not compatible with any other models...the M673 has it own "one and only" end.
You sound like you are with Northern Lights...

Is there a reason on that model you went with the Taiyo generator end??? I say that because the other NL generators I've seen and worked on used the Marathon end.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 11:41 AM   #7
Veteran Member
 
pacopico's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: USA
Vessel Name: REEL INN
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 36 Tournament Fisherman
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 44
We have used Taiyo on our sub-40kWe sets for the past 30+ years.

Above 40kWe we use Marathon.

Marathon are fine ends...Taiyo ends are equally as good. However they cost more when you get to the larger size.
pacopico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 12:32 PM   #8
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacopico View Post
We have used Taiyo on our sub-40kWe sets for the past 30+ years.

Above 40kWe we use Marathon.

Marathon are fine ends...Taiyo ends are equally as good. However they cost more when you get to the larger size.
well...

The good thing is that is you have a problem with a generator end, you are not brand specific for a replacement.

Thats something most folks do not realize. The engine and flywheel are with incredibly few exceptions standard SAE sizes.

I've not been hands on with the little NL units except the couple that I own, but have been engaged from the office with many many magnaplus replacements for the small NL units, and the feedback from the field has always been very positive.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 01:35 PM   #9
Veteran Member
 
pacopico's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: USA
Vessel Name: REEL INN
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 36 Tournament Fisherman
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 44
673's have a integrated fan/flywheel combination. Good luck.
pacopico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 01:56 PM   #10
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacopico View Post
673's have a integrated fan/flywheel combination. Good luck.
So the way this works, is if all the measurements Work out to a standard SAE bell housing, and flex plate then ANY brand generator end will work (any brand that uses the industry standad SAE sizing system)

If the measurements do not correspond to a standard SAE size then folks are forced to go back to the generator manufacturer for a replacement.

As I indicated I do not have hands on experience replacing the generator end on the NL 673, so I cannot speak as to wether these use SAE adaption, or some NL propritary size.

What I can say is that once the generator end is off, you can determine the SAE sizes in just a few minutes using a framing square and a tape measure.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 04:00 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
David Hughes's Avatar
 
City: Marietta
Country: US
Vessel Name: True Love
Vessel Model: Leopard 37 PC
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacopico View Post
673's have a integrated fan/flywheel combination. Good luck.
What does mean? That I can't have a new generator end bolted on?
__________________
David Hughes
2009 Leopard 37PC- Cape Coral, FL
David Hughes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 04:48 PM   #12
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Hughes View Post
What does mean? That I can't have a new generator end bolted on?
David

If you remove or have removed your generator end (which you will have to do in Any case anyway, you can take some specific measurements that will determine the SAE sizes of the bellhousing and flywheel flex plates.

If they do not correspond to a SAE seandard measurement, then you will have to use a NL supplied generator end. Otherwise you can use any brand generator end you choose.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-09-2016, 04:53 PM   #13
Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,275
Love to hear what is found, our boat is going to be equipped with that same Northern Lights generator...
Bruce
Bruce B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 11:53 AM   #14
Veteran Member
 
pacopico's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: USA
Vessel Name: REEL INN
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 36 Tournament Fisherman
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 44
Guys, I think a mountain is being made out of a molehill here.

Yes the gen end can ALWAYS be changed.

To keep the overall length of those little sets down we use a custom built generator that integrates the fan and the flywheel.

I do not remember which SAE the flywheel housing is, but in this case the flywheel is not a "off the shelf piece".

Those gen ends are reasonably priced, therefore the potential money saved by going to another generator end, and figuring out the flywheel is a potential time and money waster.

Can anyone bolt up a compatible genset to any prime mover - sure! We make 40kWe gensets with four (4) different generator ends for four (4) different markets! And we aren't the only one.
pacopico is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 12:04 PM   #15
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,376
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce B View Post
Love to hear what is found, our boat is going to be equipped with that same Northern Lights generator...
Bruce
Don't sweat it, any issues you have will be way down the road and long after you've moved up to the AT 56.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 12:12 PM   #16
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,376
David Hughes

So you may well need a Taiyo end. The bigger question is why did your unit fail. Pacopico suggested ventilation. On many Cats the gensets are placed or better said shoe horned in such a way that fresh air is not well circulated especially if the genset is in an enclosure.

How about a circulating fan(s) that is engaged when genset starts up. Many vessels are equipped with ER fans to keep localized temperatures in check.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 01:41 PM   #17
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacopico View Post
Guys, I think a mountain is being made out of a molehill here.

Yes the gen end can ALWAYS be changed.

To keep the overall length of those little sets down we use a custom built generator that integrates the fan and the flywheel.

I do not remember which SAE the flywheel housing is, but in this case the flywheel is not a "off the shelf piece".

Those gen ends are reasonably priced, therefore the potential money saved by going to another generator end, and figuring out the flywheel is a potential time and money waster.

Can anyone bolt up a compatible genset to any prime mover - sure! We make 40kWe gensets with four (4) different generator ends for four (4) different markets! And we aren't the only one.
Thanks very much for the information!!!
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 03:24 PM   #18
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 381
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
Don't sweat it, any issues you have will be way down the road and long after you've moved up to the AT 56.
Let me know if you move up,I will buy your new one coming in,sight unseen!!! Of course,at a discount!!! haha ,just kiddin.
tinped is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 06:54 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
David Hughes's Avatar
 
City: Marietta
Country: US
Vessel Name: True Love
Vessel Model: Leopard 37 PC
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
David Hughes



So you may well need a Taiyo end. The bigger question is why did your unit fail. Pacopico suggested ventilation. On many Cats the gensets are placed or better said shoe horned in such a way that fresh air is not well circulated especially if the genset is in an enclosure.



How about a circulating fan(s) that is engaged when genset starts up. Many vessels are equipped with ER fans to keep localized temperatures in check.

Thanks, and I think this is what's needed.
__________________
David Hughes
2009 Leopard 37PC- Cape Coral, FL
David Hughes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2016, 10:33 PM   #20
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,206
Just backing up a second, you said you saw lots of smoke from the generator, then asked about replacing the stator.

Has the actual failure been diagnosed? It seems to be that any number of different things might have smoked, the stator being only one of them.
__________________

__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:19 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012