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Old 02-04-2013, 06:39 PM   #681
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Greetings,
Aw jeeezz....What's that #669 or #670?....Oh look, something shiny....
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:42 PM   #682
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Yes, but as Charles Lindbergh said, with three engines one has three times the failure rate as one engine. THAT'S WHY HE CHOSE TO HAVE ONE ENGINE RATHER THAN MORE WHEN CROSSING THE ATLANTIC.
well thats a good point. In another thread the question was asked about crossing the atlantic and it was mentioned that the best would be a single engine because of the fuel economy and the reduction in weight allowing more capacity to carry fuel for a long trip. Also was mentioned that often twins are of the same age and when a component goes down the other engine soon has the same component go down. The recomendation is, carry spare parts
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:45 PM   #683
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Greetings,
Aw jeeezz....What's that #669 or #670?....Oh look, something shiny....

no no no. i aint done yet. This is an issue that could cost someone their life if they make the wrong one. Geeeezzz..
Aftere 700 or so comments it was obvious that a single was far superior to a twin so i need this simple point reafirmed if you dont mind

Keep in mind the toonie factor
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:49 PM   #684
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So, my question is, does the advantage of the twin allowing one greater maneuverability and possibly get home protection off set the extra expense of owning a twin?.
There is no right answer. Because, as was hashed to death on the other twins vs singles thread, every boater has different priorities.

In our case, as I've stated before, we will never have a single engine boat in a cruiser (a narrowboat in the UK is another matter). OUR reasons are (in order of importance):

1. While neither my wife nor I have any qualms flying single engine airplanes, my wife is more confident on the boat with two engines under the floor. Which makes her more comfortable which makes her enjoy the boat that much more. Which is far more important to me than saving some money on fuel, service, and maintenance.

2. We enjoy running multiple engines. We find it much more interesting, challenging, and fun than running just one.

3. Particularly with an older boat, having another engine to keep going with in case one needs to be shut down for some reason is far, far preferable to us than trying to find and fix a problem down in the engine room with the boat heaving around, or calling for help and coming home on a rope.

Those are our reasons, but they are totally irrelevant to the next guy on the dock.

You're going to have to make up your own mind on this question because what's important to you may not be important to someone else. So you need to make your own list of pros and cons to single engine and multi-engine and then decide for yourself which way to go. Asking other people what they like might be an entertaining excercise but it's not going to get you much closer to an answer that YOU and only you can answer.

Re-read the 600-post single vs twin thread again if you are still unsure of the pros and cons to the number of engines in a boat.
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:50 PM   #685
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Greetings,
Mr. 45. What is the toonie factor and how could the "wrong" decision cost someone their life? I don't think ANY consensus was reached regarding superiority of a single over a twin unless I missed something.
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:53 PM   #686
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There is no right answer. Because, as was hashed to death on the other twins vs singles thread, every boater has different priorities.

In our case, as I've stated before, we will never have a single engine boat in a cruiser (a narrowboat in the UK is another matter). OUR reasons are (in order of importance):

1. While neither my wife nor I have any qualms flying single engine airplanes, my wife is more confident on the boat with two engines under the floor. Which makes her more comfortable which makes her enjoy the boat that much more. Which is far more important to me than saving some money on fuel, service, and maintenance.

2. We enjoy running multiple engines. We find it much more interesting, challenging, and fun than running just one.

3. Particularly with an older boat, having another engine to keep going with in case one needs to be shut down for some reason is far, far preferable to us than trying to find and fix a problem down in the engine room with the boat heaving around, or calling for help and coming home on a rope.

Those are our reasons, but they are totally irrelevant to the next guy on the dock.

You're going to have to make up your own mind on this question because what's important to you may not be important to someone else. So you need to make your own list of pros and cons to single engine and multi-engine and then decide for yourself which way to go. Asking other people what they like might be an entertaining excercise but it's not going to get you much closer to an answer that YOU and only you can answer.

Re-read the 600-post single vs twin thread again if you are still unsure of the pros and cons to the number of engines in a boat.
Marin, this issue is not regarding your wife it is regarding which ic a better choice in an economy cruser a twin or a single.
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:59 PM   #687
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.
Aftere 700 or so comments it was obvious that a single was far superior to a twin so i need this simple point reafirmed if you dont mind
If it is "obvious" it need not be "reafirmed".
Even if not obvious, the subject has been done to death. Stop it. Now.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:04 PM   #688
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Pay your money, and take your choice.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:12 PM   #689
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If it is "obvious" it need not be "reafirmed".
Even if not obvious, the subject has been done to death. Stop it. Now.
I spent my life in research and untill one has ascertained the quantitative advatage or disadvantage regarding the subject under consideration the research must countinue...or,until you run out of funds.

However, this is a new question not just, twin vs. single, but, is the economy of the single offset by the mauverability of twins and if so is it offset by enough to warrant the expense

thats it in a nutshell.
Thats for your comment Bruce
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:13 PM   #690
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Marin, this issue is not regarding your wife it is regarding which ic a better choice in an economy cruser a twin or a single.
Chose wisely and the wife will support anything you chose to do. Go cheap and she'll be constantly worrying and asking "What happens if the engine breaks?"

Twins every time in my book.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:18 PM   #691
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My Perla is happy with our single engine. Strong, high railings are more relevant to her (as well as my) sense of safety.

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Old 02-04-2013, 07:18 PM   #692
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Nature is the best at design, and although there may be species that double things up like eyeballs, lungs, or testicles, I don't believe there is one with two engines, or hearts.

Gotta go with the wisdom of Gaia on this one!
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:19 PM   #693
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Chose wisely and the wife will support anything you chose to do. Go cheap and she'll be constantly worrying and asking "What happens if the engine breaks?"

Twins every time in my book.
...well said...
if she is prone to seasickness that may result in the purchase of the queen mary, if funds warrant..well maybe taking up a new hobby like soap operas may be the end result if she owns you.

currently with me it was boats or her, I chose boats and she is still there. She even boats on occasion. I had boats first she is second!
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:20 PM   #694
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Nature is the best at design, and although there may be species that double things up like eyeballs, lungs, or testicles, I don't believe there is one with two engines, or hearts.

Gotta go with the wisdom of Gaia on this one!
i like your words Murry. Good point.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:29 PM   #695
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Marin, this issue is not regarding your wife it is regarding which ic a better choice in an economy cruser a twin or a single.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to say that if you do still not realize the totally personal reason for making the choice, but believe there is some "formula" for arriving at your answer, then it might be time for you to think about getting into another pastime.

Because you have to define economy, too. Is it more economical to have two engines and come home under your own power in the event of a problem than deal with the risk, expense, and hassle of coming home on a rope?

If you get a boat with two smaller engines there's every chance it will burn less fuel than a boat with one bigger engine. We burn 5-6 gph with two engines for 8 knots. Our good friend Carey with the lobsterboat burns 11-12 gph (IIRC) with one engine to get 13-15 knots.

Which boat is more economical? The one that burns 5-6 gph and takes for frickin' ever to get anywhere or the boat that burns twice that fuel and goes nearly twice as fast? What's more economically important to you--- time or money?

You're looking for an answer that nobody can give you because someone like Carey may think the economy of time is far more important to him than the economy of cost, while someone else may desire to keep their boating cost as low as possible and are willing to spend a lot more time getting places to do it. And in Carey's case, the economy of time is being realized with a single engine boat with a great big engine in it while in our case the economy of cost (which we don't care about) is being realized with a twin engine boat. So singles vs twins isn't even an economical argument, sometimes.

But I will give you my answer to your questions as to maneuverability and get home advantage giving the edge to a twin over a single being worth the (not that great) added expense. Absolutely, 100 percent, unqualified YES.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:34 PM   #696
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I'm afraid I'm going to have to say that if you do still not realize the totally personal reason for making the choice, but believe there is some "formula" for arriving at your answer, then it might be time for you to think about getting into another pastime.

Because you have to define economy, too. Is it more economical to have two engines and come home under your own power in the event of a problem than deal with the risk, expense, and hassle of coming home on a rope?

If you get a boat with two smaller engines there's every chance it will burn less fuel than a boat with one bigger engine. We burn 5-6 gph with two engines for 8 knots. Our good friend Carey with the lobsterboat burns 11-12 gph (IIRC) with one engine to get 13-15 knots.

Which boat is more economical? The one that burns 5-6 gph and takes for frickin' ever to get anywhere or the boat that burns twice that fuel and goes nearly twice as fast? What's more economically important to you--- time or money?

Your looking for an answer that nobody can give you because someone like Carey may think the economy of time is far more important to him than the economy of cost, while someone else may desire to keep their boating cost as low as possible and are willing to spend a lot more time getting places to do it. And in Carey's case, the economy of time is being realized with a single engine boat with a great big engine in it. So singles vs twins isn't even an economical argument, sometimes.
ok so we we qualify the original question by stateing at displacement speeds. We are not asking which is superior but which is more economical.
Marin, I'm just seeking to mine the vast experiance of our very knowledgeable forun members.

My thanks to everyone for taking the time to answer what at some times might seem like dumb questions
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:42 PM   #697
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We are not asking which is superior but which is more economical.
Again, you have not defined economical. Money? Time? Purchase price? Ownership cost? Resale value?

Go to the archives and search out the stuff Eric has written about using two small engines in a displacement boat vs one larger engine. If it's done right-- and this includes the hull design--- two small engines can give a sufficient amout of power PLUS you get the advantage of a twin in terms of get-home and maneuverability, and you'll get this for either the same or perhaps even less fuel burn than the single engine version, given the engines that are usually put in these kinds of boats.

A theoretical example he's cited is putting two small engines in a GB36 vs one single FL120 (or Cummins 210 or whatever). As long as the speed desired is below hull speed, the two small engines will most likely be more efficient in terms of fuel use than the one larger engine yet you'll get the benefit of twin-engine maneuverability and redundancy.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:48 PM   #698
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My thanks to everyone for taking the time to answer what at some times might seem like dumb questions
Repetitive rather than dumb, I think.
Anyway,that post certainly sounds like closure of the thread. I wish.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:48 PM   #699
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I've had both and underway I would prefer one. Near hard objects (docks) the twins will make you look like a stud!! I think the answer lies in how often are you docking and in what conditions. I was a demigod at docks in my single. Now I'm a God
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:57 PM   #700
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[QUOTE=Marin;132239
A theoretical example he's cited is putting two small engines in a GB36 vs one single FL120 (or Cummins 210 or whatever). As long as the speed desired is below hull speed, the two small engines will most likely be more efficient in terms of fuel use than the one larger engine yet you'll get the benefit of twin-engine maneuverability and redundancy.[/QUOTE]

I don't believe that (yet). So, why don't automobile manufacturers put two engines in each automobile rather than one to increase efficiency? (Batteries and electric motors are not engines, so don't come from there, please.)
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