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Old 02-27-2011, 10:43 AM   #21
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RE: Oil Analysis?

I charge $25/oil sample and send them to a lab in Ohio that gives you reports you can access online and build a database from.(I occasionally use Gregory Pool Cat if I need a really quick turn around because I can drop them off at the local GP shop and get a 48 hour turnaround most of the time but there is not online database)*Our service company pulls oil samples on every single oil change we do and start building a database for the customer. THe firs sample will only tell you something good if something bad is going wrong, but if you pull samples every time it will show wear trends. I tell my customers we respectfully will not do an oil change without pulling an oil sample and no one has complained so far because it is usefull data to have. I would not buy a boat without it, and I do not let my brokerage customers buy a boat without an oil sample. It's like a physical for the engine and will tell you many things even a good engine surveyor can not.

Sea Kits sells kits that come with a little oil sample pump that you screw the bottlle right onto and pump it out of the dipstick tube. They have prepackaged bottles that come with them with the postage already paid to send them to the same lab we use.

Oil samples equal invaluable in my opinion.
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Old 03-15-2011, 04:30 PM   #22
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RE: Oil Analysis?

So, to resuscitate this thread, here's an update... The original offer mentioned above was not accepted, so I kept looking. Found another boat which checked out well on personal inspection, made an offer and we struck a deal with the usual contingencies of survey, mechanical inspection and sea trial. Talked with a surveyor highly recommended in the area and saw a sample survey report which was impressive for its clarity and thoroughness. I have scheduled a survey, but the surveyor recommends, and offers, optional oil analysis for the engine (single screw), generator and transmission at $50/analysis. Based on the earlier discussion, I'm not going to pay someone $50 to do something I can do for $16, so what gives? Has this been hyped in the surveyor world as a money maker? I have no hesitation paying a surveyor for their skill and knowledge in doing the survey, but selling this "add-on" seems a bit much.

David (dvd)
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Old 03-15-2011, 05:01 PM   #23
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RE: Oil Analysis?

Quote:
dvd wrote:

So, to resuscitate this thread, here's an update... The original offer mentioned above was not accepted, so I kept looking. Found another boat which checked out well on personal inspection, made an offer and we struck a deal with the usual contingencies of survey, mechanical inspection and sea trial. Talked with a surveyor highly recommended in the area and saw a sample survey report which was impressive for its clarity and thoroughness. I have scheduled a survey, but the surveyor recommends, and offers, optional oil analysis for the engine (single screw), generator and transmission at $50/analysis. Based on the earlier discussion, I'm not going to pay someone $50 to do something I can do for $16, so what gives? Has this been hyped in the surveyor world as a money maker? I have no hesitation paying a surveyor for their skill and knowledge in doing the survey, but selling this "add-on" seems a bit much.

David (dvd)
I guess the surveyor thinks his time is worth something.* So $50 - $16= $36 bucks for about a half hour of time per sample.* Doesn't seem out of line but if you think so drive to your CAT dealer get the three bottles and do it your self.* Same result if you know what to look for in the analysis report.
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Old 03-16-2011, 04:04 AM   #24
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RE: Oil Analysis?

$50.00 plus a good survey for which you can hold him responsable , not a bad deal.
I would do the oil sample myself and check the results ( hey it's my profession).
But one sample with no comparison is not going to tell you too much unless the engine is a complete mess.

My 2 c worth.
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Old 03-16-2011, 04:56 AM   #25
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RE: Oil Analysis?

"Could provide some interesting clues as to PO maintenance."

A better "clue" is a look at the stuff stowed in the ER.

Car oil , or Diesel oil? Car Antifreeze or diesel? Check the PH yourself to see if its ancient.

Spare anything ? A half used case of oil filters is usually a good sign, unless the boat was underwater.

A chat with the yard foreman is also worth the time.
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Old 03-17-2011, 06:55 AM   #26
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RE: Oil Analysis?

Car Antifreeze or diesel

Can be one in the same depending on the engine so that's not a good clue.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:28 AM   #27
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RE: Oil Analysis?

Benny is right,
The additional price requires the surveyor to interpret the analysis I believe, which would mean that he has a responsibility to give you a thumbs up or down on the engine.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:18 PM   #28
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RE: Oil Analysis?

I think the previous posts in this thread have shed light on when an oil analysis is valuable and for what purpose. That discussion has been very helpful to me. However, as I have interviewed surveyors the past couple of weeks, most have indicated that an optional step in the survey is oil analysis of engine(s), transmission and generator, (ranging from $50 - $60 PER SAMPLE) with results being mailed directly from the lab - i.e. no interpretation or counsel by the surveyor based on these results. The general consensus by most surveyors is that a separate engine assessment should be performed by a diesel mechanic and the only reference to the engine on the survey report is a "static" description of the engine and how the engine performed under normal operating conditions during the sea trial. There are 2-3 paragraphs of disclaimers in most reports stating that the survey is only descriptive with no future performance implied or warrantied.

Let me make it clear that I am not disparaging surveyors - I value their expertise. I have used them in the past and will use them in the future because they know more about boats than I do, even though I do not expect them to make my decisions for me. I just wonder if I am seeing a trend here that was way too obvious in the profession of medicine which I practiced for over 30 years. In medicine there was (is) too much CYA activity (which I despise) and too much emphasis on maximizing revenue (which I abhor). That doesn't mean that it is right or wrong, or that everyone is doing it. I just hope that this emphasis on oil sampling is not being pushed to surveyors as an income-enhancing activity rather than something that will add value to the customer.

David
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Old 03-17-2011, 11:43 PM   #29
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RE: Oil Analysis?

David,
Going with that unless yourv surveyor is Engineer based, I don't know about the US but here in Aus they will be either Deck or Engine orientated.
Being an Engineer I would always go for an Engineer based surveyor as he would also probably do a complete engine survey as well.
If not get the engine/engines surveyed separately and have this same person do the oil analysis as part of the report.
Personally I would not do this until I had had the hull surveyed unless it was all being done as a package.

Benn
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Old 03-18-2011, 05:02 AM   #30
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RE: Oil Analysis?

"Can be one in the same depending on the engine so that's not a good clue."

True for antiques but probably not on anything with an electronic control box.

"Being an Engineer I would always go for an Engineer based surveyor as he would also probably do a complete engine survey as well."

Depending on the engine this could be really expensive !!

A simple Bosch style injector can be yanked for a blow down test rather quickly bu anyone that has removed a spark plug..

On a Detroit it takes a mechanic to remove/replace the injection unit, and the engine needs to have the rack re set .
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