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03-07-2015, 10:03 PM
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#1
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Veteran Member
City: Ft.Lauderdale
Vessel Name: Sandpiper
Vessel Model: 1976 Marine Trader D/C
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 40
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Lehman exhaust elbow
Hi, I am in the process of replacing the exhaust elbow on my 120 Lehman.
Have been able to break loose the top two bolts but the two bottom ones are frozen. Besides the usual things like applying heat and such, any other ideas before I break out the impact gun?
This is being done because I found a coolant leak where the elbow joins the exhaust manifold. So I guess the manifold is suspect but hoping it's the elbow(which is pretty ratty) or the gasket.
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03-07-2015, 11:03 PM
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#2
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Guru
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,438
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Hit them hard several times on the bolts head with a large hammer. Then try a tighten them a touch before you try to break them loose.
You could try it in conjunction with this stuff:
http://www.crcindustries.com/files/F...20Brochure.pdf
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03-08-2015, 12:21 AM
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#3
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Guru
City: NARBONNE
Vessel Name: 'Snow Mouse.'
Vessel Model: BROOM FLYBRIDGE 42.
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,733
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I'd go along with Capt. Bill, if you put a socket wrench on the frozen nut with a 'T' piece, give the head of the 'T' piece a couple of cracks with the hammer while you have the 'T' bar under tension loosening the nut. If that doesn't work ask around if anyone mechanically minded has a nut splitter, or buy one and keep it future use.
When you reassemble use Copperslip anti seize compound to prevent the same trouble in the future.
I assume you know that the Lehman is based on the Ford base engine.
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03-08-2015, 05:53 AM
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#4
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Enigma
City: Slicker?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,566
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Greetings,
Mr. TS. Welcome aboard. I'd be VERY careful about giving ANY piece of cast iron a whack with a BFH. Repeated heating and cooling of the bolt heads to dull red hot would be my plan of attack along with GENTLE tapping of the bolt head during heating and cooling cycles. Patience, Grasshopper...
__________________
RTF
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03-08-2015, 06:04 AM
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#5
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Guru
City: Niceville, FL
Vessel Name: At Last
Vessel Model: 1990 Jefferson 52 Marquessa
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 724
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Yesterday I just used a nut splitter for the first time on a bracket that I was trying to remove from the engine mount frames. What a pleasant surprise. The nut came off in pieces and the bolt was undamaged. I was careful not to crank the splitter down to the point of damaging the threads of the bolt. If they are replaceable bolts then it does not matter. The trick is, can you fit it into the area that you are working.....
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03-08-2015, 08:37 AM
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#6
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Guru
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,438
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Nut splitters are great. Unfortunately he's working on bolts.
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03-08-2015, 11:41 AM
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#7
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Scraping Paint
City: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,745
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What you do not want to do is damage the manifold itself. They are no longer available new (unless some company has started making them as an aftermarket item). Replacement exhaust elbows are readily available from American Diesel and exhaust specialists like National Marine Exhaust can make up a new one.
But according to Bob Smith at American Diesel, the only way today to get a replacement Lehman manifold is to get one off an engine that's being parted out.
The photo below is of one of our exhaust systems with an American Diesel elbow.
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03-08-2015, 11:54 AM
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#8
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Guru
City: Mt Crested Butte
Vessel Name: Artemis
Vessel Model: Cheoy Lee 67
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 551
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Ease of the impact wrench, it'll just snap them. brush diesel on them for a few days, it's a great solvent.. Don't try to undo,tighten fractionally first, then they'll come free.
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03-08-2015, 12:24 PM
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#9
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Member
City: Florida
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 8
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I agree with rtf
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03-08-2015, 02:16 PM
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#10
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Guru
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11
Nut splitters are great. Unfortunately he's working on bolts.
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Now who is being a nut splitter.... ....
Also awhile back someone else posted that acetone and ATF mixed 50/50 won all penetrant contests beating PB Blaster, Liquid Wrench and 3 in 1 formulas for freeing up frozen fasteners.
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03-08-2015, 02:19 PM
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#11
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Guru
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RT Firefly
Greetings,
Mr. TS. Welcome aboard. I'd be VERY careful about giving ANY piece of cast iron a whack with a BFH. Repeated heating and cooling of the bolt heads to dull red hot would be my plan of attack along with GENTLE tapping of the bolt head during heating and cooling cycles. Patience, Grasshopper...
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Seems you have your wisdom back if not your energy yet....pasta help?
Just tied up in St Marys at the free dock (6 hr limit posted)...nice little town not to be missed, but like Darien is up a river with good current...fortunately only about 2.5 miles instead of 7.
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03-08-2015, 03:12 PM
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#12
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Guru
City: NARBONNE
Vessel Name: 'Snow Mouse.'
Vessel Model: BROOM FLYBRIDGE 42.
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,733
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We're talking taps with the hammer while the wrench is under tension to release the nut/bolt, not a hefty redneck wallop to do damage.
In a worst case scenario you can get another manifold from Bowman engineering or through Mike Bellamy at Lancing marine.
Obviously try all other methods for a good result before resorting to Redneck engineering.
If it were me I'd make damn sure when you refit it that the next time it needed to be off it would come off easy.
Patience and you'll win the day.
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03-08-2015, 03:32 PM
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#13
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Guru
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld
Now who is being a nut splitter.... ....
Also awhile back someone else posted that acetone and ATF mixed 50/50 won all penetrant contests beating PB Blaster, Liquid Wrench and 3 in 1 formulas for freeing up frozen fasteners.
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I posted that. If he made a well out of clay around the bolt head so the mixture could sit around the bolt head it might work. As well as tapping on the bolt head every so often as it sits immersed in the fluid.
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03-08-2015, 03:43 PM
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#14
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Guru
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11
I posted that. If he made a well out of clay around the bolt head so the mixture could sit around the bolt head it might work. As well as tapping on the bolt head every so often as it sits immersed in the fluid.
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Sorry.... couldn't remember if you posted the acetone/ATF mix as a penetrating fluid or in the drinks and appetizers section....
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03-08-2015, 03:46 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 305
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Best penetrating oil I've tried is "Mouse Milk", I got mine from an airplane parts store. Again the secret is patience, apply "Mouse Milk" at intervals over several days, don't break the bolt or round off the nut/bolt head by trying before it is ready!
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03-08-2015, 05:09 PM
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#16
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Veteran Member
City: Ft.Lauderdale
Vessel Name: Sandpiper
Vessel Model: 1976 Marine Trader D/C
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 40
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Thanks to all for the replys. Tried the heat method to no avail. Decided instead to pull the manifold and let the machine shop get the elbow off. Manifold removal was non remarkable. It looks pretty good, of course the "elbow end" is still an unknown. I kinda look at this as the glass 1/2 full as I will have the manifold inspected and reconditioned. Already have the replacement elbow ready to go. Now, can anybody recomend a shop that reconditions manifolds in the Ft. Lauderdale area? Thanks again everybody!
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03-08-2015, 05:49 PM
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#17
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Guru
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,438
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Call G S Marine (954) 523-2125
3040 SW 4th Avenue
Fort Lauderdale, FL 333153015
I've got a SS exhaust elbow for a 135 Lehman laying around that should fit a 120 if you're interested?
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03-08-2015, 07:18 PM
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#18
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Veteran Member
City: Ft.Lauderdale
Vessel Name: Sandpiper
Vessel Model: 1976 Marine Trader D/C
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 40
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Thanks but already purchaced a replacement. A 1A283, ending in 3"NPT.
Found one of those since I have a 45* stainless NPT. pipe to the muffler after the elbow.
However will check out CS Marine tomorrow.
Thanks, Doug
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03-09-2015, 06:33 AM
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#19
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Guru
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,037
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trawler Sandpiper
Thanks to all for the replys. Tried the heat method to no avail. Decided instead to pull the manifold and let the machine shop get the elbow off. Manifold removal was non remarkable. It looks pretty good, of course the "elbow end" is still an unknown. I kinda look at this as the glass 1/2 full as I will have the manifold inspected and reconditioned. Already have the replacement elbow ready to go. Now, can anybody recomend a shop that reconditions manifolds in the Ft. Lauderdale area? Thanks again everybody!
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3 years ago that is what I also had to do, remove the manifold. I took it to my son's auto repair shop and he got the remaining bolt out on about 10 seconds with an acetylene torch and vise grips. The elbow end of the manifold was corroded so another automotive machine shop milled the manifold shorter by about 3/16 inch to get back to solid iron again.
__________________
Jay Leonard
Ex boats: 1983 40 Albin trunk cabin, 1978 Mainship 34 Model 1
New Port Richey, Fl
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03-09-2015, 07:41 AM
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#20
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Guru
City: Edgewater, MD
Vessel Name: Catalina Jack
Vessel Model: Defever 44
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,585
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I had the same problem on my pair of Lehman 120's. In my case the bottom two bolts came out easily while the top two were frozen. I gave up and had a yard extract them but I do not know how it was accomplished. My plan going forward was to unbolt them every six months or so and reapply an anti-seize compound. I use a product called Kopr-Kote. However, I am re-thinking.
How about this as an alternative? Replace the bolt with a threaded stud and use a nut as the fastener and still use an anti-seize compound. Should the nut later become frozen, a nut-splitter will take care of the problem. Since the mating surface is gasketed, I can't see any disadvantage using a stud and nut. Opinions?
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