How Do You Power Your Anchor Windless

[jstauffer]

In the not to distant future I will be replacing my house batteries. Presently the boat has two (house) battery banks, one engine start battery and one genset start battery. The two house bank batteries are separated by isolation diodes and switches. One of the house banks is only two 6 volt lead acid batteries in series for 12 volts. It looks like at one time the PO was using this small house bank to power the anchor windless, but just before the main disconnect switch for the windless he ran a wire (6 or 8 gauge) to the distribution panel which now allows the small house bank to also feed the main DC distribution panel. I don't like this set up so will be changing that. My question is, should the anchor windless be powered from the house batteries, start battery or a battery of it's own. My thought is to have it powered from the engine start battery as I would always have the engine running when operating the windless.

Thanks

 

[caltexflanc]

If you have a house bank that is charged by an engine alternator it doesn't make much difference. Whichever is the easiest wiring job.

 

[hobbystuff]

There is often lively discussion around this topic.

I just redid all the wiring, including new batteries on our boat and I have the windlass running from the house bank. In my mind the key to this is where your alternator is connected, on our setup the alternator charges the house bank directly, the engine start battery gets charged through a dc-dc charger from the house bank. When using the windlass we always have the engine running so the windlass has decent voltage and the alternator carries the load - This has worked flawlessly for us.

Cheers.

 

[ksanders]

Ours is wired to the house bank and I like it that way.

My thought is that nothing connects to the engine batteries except the engine.

 

[jstauffer]

BTW, my port alternator charges my start battery and my starboard alternator (high output alternator) charges both house bank batteries via an isolator. And with all the crossover and on/off switches installed by the PO you can configure nearly every option imaginable (which, in some cases my not be desirable).

Early on in this tread it appears powering the windless off of the house batteries is preferred method. If I do this I think I would wire the two house bank batteries together and just have one house bank which would eliminate the isolation diode (along with the .6 voltage drop they produce) and some of the crossover switches.

 

[Mule]

I placed a battery forward, made it stand alone and charged it with a 35 watt solar panel. No heavy gauge wiring to compensate for resistance at high amperage draw. The 3 amp charging current is nothing and it keeps her fully charged. Wench? Or is that winch? use is normally short in duration, (in either case) at least for me and I have never had my battery run out of energy, me on the other hand, is altogether another subject.

 

[Edelweiss]

My thought is to have it powered from the engine start battery as I would always have the engine running when operating the windless.
Thanks

This is the way mine came wired from the factory and the logic seems to work out fine for me. With the engines running you have the alternators powering the winch through the high amperage output start batteries. Usually if you're pulling the anchor you would be running for some period of time and recharging any discharge quickly.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Can't you just pull your anchor by hand?

Keep your start batt dedicated and run your engine to charge batts if need be.

I doan worry about it.

 

[Xsbank]

Hydraulic. The only downside is the engine MUST be running.

 

[LarryM]

I installed a separate battery forward for both thruster and anchor windlass. It is charged via a Xantrex Echo Charge from the House/Start ACR. The ACR controls and distributes output from either the alternator underway or battery charger dockside. It has a manual control/override, but I have never needed to use it.

Since the thruster is used for only seconds, and the windlass a minute or so max, battery capacity has been entirely adequate so far.

Wiring the anchor windlass to the thruster battery kept the power leads short, so heavy gauge wiring and associated large fuses were not required to minimize voltage loss.

The generator start battery is kept fresh by another Echo Charge in the same way.

Larry
M/V Boomarang

 

[ksanders]

i'll throw another one out there.

I am considering upsizing my windlass for a variety of good reasons.

The original cable is not large enough to support the new windlass, so it needs to be replaced.

I'm thinking about going with a AC powered windlass.

The windlass would be powered with my inverter, and if that inverter was for example inoperative then the generator would provide the power.

The up side of this is simply a much lower current draw, and the savings in both hassle and cost savings realized by not having to pull large cables all through my boat.

 

[sunchaser]

i'll throw another one out there.

I am considering upsizing my windlass for a variety of good reasons.

The original cable is not large enough to support the new windlass, so it needs to be replaced.

I'm thinking about going with a AC powered windlass.

The windlass would be powered with my inverter, and if that inverter was for example inoperative then the generator would provide the power.

The up side of this is simply a much lower current draw, and the savings in both hassle and cost savings realized by not having to pull large cables all through my boat.

Your plan makes sense. Larger vessels can be found with an electric hydraulic windlass to lessen the long hydraulic runs from the ER.

What is cost and brand availability of 110V windlass vs a 12 or 24 volt unit? We do run our genset to inverter charger when weighing anchor to keep a high charging rate going.

 

[Mule]

I installed a separate battery forward for both thruster and anchor windlass. It is charged via a Xantrex Echo Charge from the House/Start ACR. The ACR controls and distributes output from either the alternator underway or battery charger dockside. It has a manual control/override, but I have never needed to use it.

Since the thruster is used for only seconds, and the windlass a minute or so max, battery capacity has been entirely adequate so far.

Wiring the anchor windlass to the thruster battery kept the power leads short, so heavy gauge wiring and associated large fuses were not required to minimize voltage loss.

The generator start battery is kept fresh by another Echo Charge in the same way.

Larry
M/V Boomarang

Yeah, my thoughts on placing battery up front. I tend to overkill, used 8D AGM with the as I mentioned solar charged.

 

[caltexflanc]

Ideal makes 115/230 volt windlasses in a variety of configurations. Plath makes them in 115. Both of these are the highest quality. Plath is in Oregon so it might make sense to discuss with them first.

 

[ksanders]

Your plan makes sense. Larger vessels can be found with an electric hydraulic windlass to lessen the long hydraulic runs from the ER.

What is cost and brand availability of 110V windlass vs a 12 or 24 volt unit? We do run our genset to inverter charger when weighing anchor to keep a high charging rate going.

In the Ideal line there is an approx $1500 additional cost for the AC version.

In another post George mentioned Plath windlass. I'd never heard of them but am planning on looking over their products tonight.

 

[caltexflanc]

An AC motor to produce the same torque as a DC and stay a manageable size in a windlass application is going to be expensive. Here is a dissertation on the two:

White Paper - A Comparison of the Characteristics of AC and DC Motors - B7096-2

 

[Insequent]

I have a bank of 4 x 12V AGM's in the bow for the anchor winch and bow thruster. This made sense to me as I had the space available for the batteries and it enabled short cable runs for both high amp draw items.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

Hydraulic. The only downside is the engine MUST be running.

Not necessarily.

 

[hollywood8118]

Hydraulic. The only downside is the engine MUST be running.

Last time I checked this is a trawler forum...unless the engine is running there is no reason to lift the anchor!

Hollywood

 

[FF]

>unless the engine is running there is no reason to lift the anchor!<

Indeed!

Many folks shy away from the best system as too complex and too expensive.

A belted hyd pump can have a clutch , like on your car air cond, so it need not run all the time the engine is on.

This means a simple 10G tank will easily handle the heat load from hauling the anchor , or any other short term operation, like bow thrusters or dink hoist.

Hyd motors are not expensive , so a look at your old windlass might show how easy it would be to mount one and NOT buy a new windlass..

Ours operates from a simple pull valve on the foredeck , as we have to go fwd anyway to unlatch the chain stopper , its no big deal.

WE use rope 99% of the time so anchor recovery is to pull the on valve , a single wrap in the drum gets the boat moving , and is easy to do and tail as the boat moves..

When over the anchor IF the single turn wont pull a second or rarely a 3rd turn is wrapped on and up she comes. Usually a 60# anchor.

When secured in the roller the anchor trip line is caught with a pole and brought aboard.
It makes a great safety tied to a cleat , although the chain stopper (Ideal) has never failed.

5 min and your hands will get wet.

 

[FlyWright]

Last time I checked this is a trawler forum...unless the engine is running there is no reason to lift the anchor!

Hollywood

Exactly!!

I pondered the same question as the OP years ago when I installed my windlass, recabled my boat and upgraded my electrical systems. I have a single 8D battery to start both Perkins 4.236 engines. That's all it did and it's overkill battery capacity for these engines. I will probably switch to a group 31 lead acid when this 8D finally dies.

I have my windlass connected to the start battery and have not had an issue with it in 4 1/2 years of extensive anchoring. Like others pointed out, unlike a sailboat, our engine(s) are running when setting and retrieving anchor. I like to preserve the house battery capacity for house loads only.

If I ever need to enlist the help of the house to aid the start battery or vice versa, I have switches that can tie the batteries together. I also have a small Honda generator. It's never been an issue for me though.

 

[rochepoint]

I have my windlass connected to the start battery and have not had an issue with it in 4 1/2 years of extensive anchoring. Like others pointed out, unlike a sailboat, our engine(s) are running when setting and retrieving anchor. I like to preserve the house battery capacity for house loads only.

If I ever need to enlist the help of the house to aid the start battery or vice versa, I have switches that can tie the batteries together. I also have a small Honda generator. It's never been an issue for me though.

+1

 

[Peter B]

Originally Posted by FlyWright

I have my windlass connected to the start battery and have not had an issue with it in 4 1/2 years of extensive anchoring. Like others pointed out, unlike a sailboat, our engine(s) are running when setting and retrieving anchor. I like to preserve the house battery capacity for house loads only. If I ever need to enlist the help of the house to aid the start battery or vice versa, I have switches that can tie the batteries together.

My set-up also, and without trouble in 12 yrs. More importantly, I use a maintenance free truck starting battery for the boat, because of huge cold cranking amp reserve, whereas my house batts are AGM, and this type of battery 'loves' the type of brief but heavy discharge that the anchor winch needs, as they are similar mechanically, anchor winches and starter motors. A solar panel keeps that one topped up nicely when not running the engine.

 

[AusCan]

Jerry -
Do you have a bow thruster or are you contemplating one? If so, I'd install one or more batteries up forward to power both the anchor winch and possible bow thruster. This would eliminate any voltage drop over a long, possibly undersized cable to the anchor winch.

If batteries up forward are not feasible, make sure the cable is sized adequately for the winch motor amperage and the length of cable. I agree completely with Peter's comments above regarding battery type.

btw - My anchor winch recently died, and I found evidence of the long battery cables overheating. This likely played a part in the death of the winch motor.

 

[Bay Pelican]

Last time I checked this is a trawler forum...unless the engine is running there is no reason to lift the anchor!

Hollywood

Twice in the last five years I have boarded boats at anchor that were dragging and used the windlass without being able to start the engine. While generally the owner will start the engine before using the windlass a third party trying to save the boat may not have a key to the inside.

 

[dimer2]

I have 2 dedicated batteries for the windlass and another 2 for the bow thruster. These are both wired for 24 volt and are located forward with their own chargers. The rest of the boat is 12 volt.

 

[jleonard]

I normally run my windlass long before starting the engine.
Usually while coffee is perking I pull up to let the anchor chain flush itself from the mud.
Then we have coffee and breakfast.
Makes much shorter work of cleaning the chain and anchor.
I start the engine only when I'm ready to depart.

 

[Mule]

Last time I checked this is a trawler forum...unless the engine is running there is no reason to lift the anchor!

Hollywood

Ur right, not the schooner forum, the Ark Forum....wonder if Noah even had an anchor.... So many ?s

The only reason would be to be towed due to trouble....

 

[jstauffer]

AusCan...No, I do not have a bow thruster, but would love to have one and that may be a future project. So, thanks for your advise as I think I can find a place to install these batteries in the bow.

There are lots of good ideas here on the forum, and thanks to all of you for your suggestions. I believe I should be able to get another year out of my house batteries, so in the mean time will probably wire my windless into my one year old 8D start battery with the idea of when I replace the house batteries to do a overhaul of my DC system and install separate batteries in the bow for the windless and maybe even a bow thruster.

Thanks again.

 

[N4712]

We have two AGM 8D's in the bow that are tied into the house bank.