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Old 07-12-2012, 02:13 PM   #21
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Don't know why the FL120's injection pump drain plug would be metric. England was not on the metric system in the 50s, 60s, and 70s when this engine was being manufactured. I bought a new Land Rover Series III-88 in 1973 (and still have it) and there is not a metric fastener on it anywhere including the engine, transmission, etc.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:26 PM   #22
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The later Ford of England Dover engine is the base engine for the Ford Lehman 135.
And the 90.
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Old 07-12-2012, 02:33 PM   #23
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Our 1973 engine manual covers three engines--- the 4-cylinder 80 hp, the six-cylinder 120hp, and a turbo version of the 120 hp engine that developed 150hp. According to the manual, all three engines are derivatives of the same generation engine. So far as I know, Lehman never marinzed the turbo version of the Dorset.

The slightly more powerful Dover engine came out some time after the Dorset. I assume this engine was also available in four and six cylinder versions, too, with the four-cylinder version being the FL90. I've not had any experience with the Dover/FL135 engine.
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Old 07-12-2012, 08:29 PM   #24
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This may help FL users,though off topic (but which one?). I replaced my original type,probably the originals,4 PSI coolant tank ("radiator") caps. The overflow,and need to top up, decreased so much so I may not bother fitting recovery tanks.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:04 AM   #25
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The overflow,and need to top up, decreased so much so I may not bother fitting recovery tanks.

However the recovery tank is a required part of the system.

The concept is to remove all the air in the coolant system , which the cap and recovery tank does.

Removing ALL the air makes the cooling system about 25% more efficient .

Not bad for a couple of bucks worth of plastic.

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Old 07-17-2012, 01:25 PM   #26
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However the recovery tank is a required part of the system.

Not with the FL120--- they did not have them as fitted stock. Don't confuse an automotive-style recovery tank--- the usually plastic remote bottle or tank that takes the overflow from the engine's cooling system when the engine heats up and then allows it to be pulled back into the engine as the engine cools down---- with the metal header or expansion tank on the front of every FL120. The header tank is a required component as it serves as the reservoir for the coolant, same as the upper chamber of a vehicle's radiator.

A recovery tank is an aftermarket add-on for the FL120 and requires some modification of the engine's header tank to use. It is not a requirement for the engine and offers no benefits to the actual cooling process. All it does is eliminate the need to top off the coolant periodically since the way the header tank deals with coolant expansion is to simply blow the excess out the overflow pipe into the drip pan or bilge.
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Old 07-17-2012, 08:35 PM   #27
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Not with the FL120--- they did not have them as fitted stock.
............
A recovery tank is an aftermarket add-on for the FL120 and requires some modification of the engine's header tank to use. It is not a requirement for the engine and offers no benefits to the actual cooling process.
...........
.
Well ..... yabbutt........

I dunno about your 120s Marin but there's a substantial difference in fluid volume hot and cold on mine. There was obviously some good reason to create the retrofit kit. Just because it wasn't original equipment doesn't mean that, were the engine marinized today, it wouldn't be. At the very least running without it will mean either a very messy bilge or significantly less coolant circulating in the engine. And that definitely offers some "benefits to the actual cooling process".
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Old 07-17-2012, 08:53 PM   #28
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However the recovery tank is a required part of the system.

The concept is to remove all the air in the coolant system , which the cap and recovery tank does.

Removing ALL the air makes the cooling system about 25% more efficient .

Not bad for a couple of bucks worth of plastic.

FF
My FLs have bleed screws on the cooling system as original,you open the screws and top up until coolant comes out(reminds me of bleeding the cooling system on a rear engined Renault which otherwise overheated++, radiator was aft,heater radiator was forward, with long pipes in between).The Lehman engine manual says not bleeding is a common cause of overheating. I don`t think recovery bottles were original,though American Diesel does sell them,and a modified filler neck which takes a higher psi cap(8 instead of 4psi).
I agree retro-fitting recovery bottles makes sense, been on cars for years, and I may yet do it.BruceK
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Old 07-17-2012, 09:10 PM   #29
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I dunno about your 120s Marin but there's a substantial difference in fluid volume hot and cold on mine. There was obviously some good reason to create the retrofit kit.
Absolutely. And we bought a pair of them within a year of acquiring the boat. But we have yet to install them. Why? Because I'm lazy. So we have a "poor man's" recovery system on our engines. I put extension tubing on the coolant overflow pipe that comes out of the neck of the header tank on each engine and fed it into a cleaned out quart oil bottle that sits in each engine's drip pan. As the coolant heats up the excess is blown out of the tank and down into the bottle. When I do my engine room check before the next day's startup (or whenever the next cold startup is) it's a simple matter to pour the coolant from the quart bottle back into the header tank.

I also aways crack the petcock on top of the exhaust manifold before every cold start to make sure no air pocket has formed up there. NOTE--- The cap on the header tank usually has to be loosened or removed in order to get a flow out the manifold bleed petcock. If you don't do this the partial vacuum that can form in the top of the tank can prevent the coolant from exiting the petcock. And NEVER open the petcock if the engine and coolant is hot.

The FL120 header tank is part of the marinization kit and takes the place of the upper radiator tank that would have been in an automotive, industrial, or agricultural application of the base engine. But in the 50s and 60s and early 70s nobody cared about recovering stuff--- it was no big deal to simply let excess fluids be blown out onto the ground or into the bilge. And adding coolant to replace the coolant blown out of the header tank was no big deal either.

But today it makes a lot more sense to use a recovery system, either the proper kit as sold by American Diesel or our cheapo oil bottle system.
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Old 07-17-2012, 09:34 PM   #30
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Well ..... yabbutt........

I dunno about your 120s Marin but there's a substantial difference in fluid volume hot and cold on mine. There was obviously some good reason to create the retrofit kit. Just because it wasn't original equipment doesn't mean that, were the engine marinized today, it wouldn't be. At the very least running without it will mean either a very messy bilge or significantly less coolant circulating in the engine. And that definitely offers some "benefits to the actual cooling process".
My 135 Lehman is only 2 years old and no recovery system.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:00 PM   #31
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I put a recovery bottle on my 135 a long time ago. Just used the generic one from the auto parts store. Didn't change the filler neck or anything...maybe it had already been changed, but it works fine. My 135 is 1986 vintage.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:02 PM   #32
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Meridian
ISO (metric)bolt sizes are the world's most commonly used, so you should be able to find one out there somewhere.
M8 is an 8 millimeter (just over 5/16" inch) with a 60 degree angled thread (same as UNC), but the ISO thread is slightly finer than UNC on most sizes.
20.32 threads/inch on M8 vs 18 threads per inch on a 5/16" UNC, so they are not interchangable.
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Old 07-18-2012, 06:14 AM   #33
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All it does is eliminate the need to top off the coolant periodically since the way the header tank deals with coolant expansion is to simply blow the excess out the overflow pipe into the drip pan or bilge.

That is how the header tank handles an overfilled system, and it works well.

Since there is almost no pressure in an old boat cooling system , the time to fill coolant levels is HOT . With all the heat expansion in the water the resivoir can be filled to the top..

What ever setup is preferred , keeping air out of the coolant is a worthwhile goal.

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Old 07-18-2012, 08:29 PM   #34
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Since there is almost no pressure in an old boat cooling system , the time to fill coolant levels is HOT . With all the heat expansion in the water the resivoir can be filled to the top

FF
FF,are you engaging in a little "Marin baiting"?

It is clear from p.19 of the Lehman instruction book:
1.To commence the top up and air bleed of the cooling system procedure with the engine cold, completing it with cap off, thermostat open, air bleed valve closed .
2.Opening the air bleed valve on a hot engine will draw air into the system and "cause overheating"
3. "Extreme care should be taken in removing the cap while the engine is hot".
All of that also accords with commonsense. I`m thinking the metal in the engine expands,reducing the space for the coolant,rather than the coolant expanding,though the effect is the same, excess coolant is forced out. My new caps have reduced coolant loss significantly.
I`d put page 19 up if I had the skill, maybe Marin will, otherwise I`ll get help with it,for Lehman owners who don`t have the engine book. BruceK
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:10 PM   #35
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The FL120 operators and parts manuals are also available online from various sites. The Grand Banks owners site has them in PDF form in the "manuals" section. I believe you have to be a member to access the manuals section but the GB forum is free to join.
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Old 07-19-2012, 05:48 AM   #36
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rather than the coolant expanding,

Most liquids expend while heated.

A new law requires fuel to be temperature measured and adjusted for the smaller gallons of hot fuel.

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Old 07-19-2012, 08:23 PM   #37
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Anyone know why cooling systems are pressurized?

See below for my guess!
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Old 07-19-2012, 08:26 PM   #38
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Pressurizing raises the boiling point. Thats why a pressure cooker speeds up the cooking process. My guess is that if you can raise the temperature that water/ coolant starts to boil (create steam), the better you can keep the coolant contained.
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Old 07-20-2012, 06:31 AM   #39
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England was not on the metric system in the 50s, 60s, and 70s when this engine was being manufactured,

What makes you believe the pump was MADE in England?

Just because it is in an engine sold in England?

I believe most of the blocks today are cast in Brazil , machined elsewhere and assembled somewhere else?
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Old 01-10-2013, 12:17 PM   #40
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How helpful is this????

Thank you sooo much for this info. I'm contemplating purchasing a steel boat with a six cylinder ford lehman diesel .... at least now I know what questions to ask and some things to look for ......... I'll look at the boat on Saturday with my wife --- if there's a then we'll proceed to the next step................ what would be the top 5- 10 questions that could be asked regarding this engine.... how often has oil been changed would be one.... no. of engine hours would be another................ primary/secondary fuel filtration set-up ????????? good stuff!!!!!!
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