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Old 12-17-2010, 06:57 AM   #41
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RE: Flo Scan

Wow, I can't imagine needing to do an engine room inspection every 30 minutes. On a weeks worth of cruising on the ICW at an average of 8 hours per day under way, that computes to 16 times per day and 112 times over the course of a week. That certainly would take all of the fun out of cruising. If my confidence in my boat and monitoring equipment was that low, I would just not leave the dock. We do regular inspections of the engine compartment while under way, but usually only about twice per day and sometimes only once. Chuck
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Old 12-17-2010, 08:40 AM   #42
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RE: Flo Scan

I also check the engine room and bilge about ever 30 minutes as the entrance is quick and easy.* I feel the 671 exchange/manifold, check under the engine and fuel tank for fluid, check the Racor vacuum gauges, feel the raw water hoses on the gens and 671, and do a general inspection.* Some long range boats have a check list.* I have noticed/found problems long be for the gauges would have told me.
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Old 12-17-2010, 10:18 AM   #43
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RE: Flo Scan

So there you have it - those who don't have walk in ERs think routine ER inspections are largely*a waste of time.* Delfin and Phil, quick lock your ER doors while under way!*

As a female participant on*the Biggest Loser opined, "My husband said he loved me when I was fat, but he lusts after me now that I'm thin and curvaceous. I like lust!"
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Old 12-17-2010, 11:19 AM   #44
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RE: Flo Scan

Constantly checking the engine room?* Sounds like paranoia.* Well, perhaps I should stop along the freeway every hour to check tire pressure, open the hood, and look under the car.
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Old 12-17-2010, 11:23 AM   #45
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RE: Flo Scan

Quote:
markpierce wrote:

Constantly checking the engine room?* Sounds like paranoia.* Well, perhaps I should stop along the freeway every hour to check tire pressure, open the hood, and look under the car.
If you car breaks you just pull over If your boat breaks you wind up on the rocks or left without power a wave swamps you and you go down. Worst case i'm sure but a little parinoia goes a long way.

SD

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Old 12-17-2010, 11:33 AM   #46
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RE: Flo Scan

Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you. As I said, I do engine compartment checks regularly, but IMO there reaches a point where you spend all of your time being safe (paranoid) and very little time enjoying the fruits of cruising. There is a balance there somewhere. Chuck
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Old 12-17-2010, 11:45 AM   #47
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RE: Flo Scan

Fuel blockage would be my greatest concern, especially crossing a bar at a harbor's entrance.* I can see checking the filter(s) at the beginning of each voyage and after 24 hours of continuous use, but*a peek-a-boo won't disclose problems like a timing belt about to go bad, etc.** I'm not about to open the engine hatch in the pilothouse floor routinely every half hour or so.*
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Old 12-17-2010, 11:53 AM   #48
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Flo Scan

My walk in ER checks take*about 4 minutes. I also do a deck walk around and lift the the lazz hatch to check rudders at least once per day. I do the ER check at the start and end on short runs and every 2 hours on long day runs. Buy an IR temp gun and you'll quickly see where all the fun is to be had. How many of you monitor shaft log, exhaust water, oil pan*or transmission**temps? If I were boating on the ICW or other crowded places where boattowUS works, I'd be less attentive. Dude and Delfin know well the pitfalls of an issue in the far reaches of the tide, fog and current rich PNW. Plus, it is great fun for a gear head to be around rotating and working equipment.

I've done the beach and babes scene too. I never knew the boat had engines as my head swiveled.


-- Edited by sunchaser on Friday 17th of December 2010 12:54:48 PM
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Old 12-17-2010, 12:12 PM   #49
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RE: Flo Scan

Got gauges?* My builder says the Coot has "Tack, oil pressure water, temperature, battery volt meter, exhaust pyrometer (added by us), hi temp/low oil warning buzzer."* I'm having a FloScan added.* Am I missing something major?
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Old 12-17-2010, 12:39 PM   #50
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Flo Scan

Quote:
markpierce wrote:

Got gauges?* My builder says the Coot has "Tack, oil pressure water, temperature, battery volt meter, exhaust pyrometer (added by us), hi temp/low oil warning buzzer."* I'm having a FloScan added.* Am I missing something major?

You might want to add an amp meter.* Tells you what the load is on the electrical system.* The volt meter doesn't do this.* Since you're a single engine boat--- and if you have a standard raw-water/heat exhanger cooling system--- an instrument highly recommended on the Grand Banks forum is a raw water monitor.* This will indicate immediately if your cooling water flow is interrupted for any reason.* A number of GB owners on the forum have installed a temperature sensor on the exhaust elbow(s).* This will also indicate right away if the flow of raw cooling water has been lost.

As to hi temp/low oil warning sensors and buzzers I have no faith in them at all.* Like most alarms (and fuses) their primary purpose is to let you know that the component they are monitoring or protecting has just failed.* Our boat has the hi temp, low oil pressure, etc alarms but we operate the boat as though it didn't have them.* I'm not saying don't put them on.* Just don't rely on them.* Your instruments, eyes, nose, ears, and soles of your feet (vibration) are far more reliable and will tell you things long before the alarms will.

*


-- Edited by Marin on Friday 17th of December 2010 01:40:53 PM
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Old 12-17-2010, 12:50 PM   #51
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RE: Flo Scan

Nope Mark, I don't have continuous read dash gauges for shaft seal temp, exhaust water temp, transmission oil*temp or engine oil temp. Doesn't sound like you do either. An IR gun is about 50 bucks.

Here is a different question, how big should a vessel be before you elect to routinely do ER checks?
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Old 12-17-2010, 01:12 PM   #52
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RE: Flo Scan

Quote:
Marin wrote:

You might want to add an amp meter.*...
I think I see two electrical meters on this earlier-built Coot:



*
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Old 12-17-2010, 01:14 PM   #53
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RE: Flo Scan

Racor makes a drain the water idiot light,* or how about a transmission oil temp guage.* If you have hydraulics* how about a pressure guage.

SD
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Old 12-17-2010, 01:23 PM   #54
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RE: Flo Scan

Quote:
sunchaser wrote:... how big should a vessel be before you elect to routinely do ER checks?
*Big enouh to have an enclosed engine room.
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Old 12-17-2010, 01:36 PM   #55
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RE: Flo Scan

Quote:
markpierce wrote:

Got gauges?* My builder says the Coot has "Tack, oil pressure water, temperature, battery volt meter, exhaust pyrometer (added by us), hi temp/low oil warning buzzer."* I'm having a FloScan added.* Am I missing something major?

What gear do you have?* You might think about transmission oil and pressure.* Very inconvenient when you burn them up.

One of my favorites is wind speed/direction.* Kind of expensive, but well worth the cost IMHO.

Next up is potable/gray/black water guages and rudder indicator (essential).*** I have no ammeter because there is a Link 2000 that provides that and a great deal more information.* Attached is a section drawing of our primary gauge cluster.

[img]download.spark?ID=843750&aBID=115492[/img]

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Old 12-17-2010, 01:52 PM   #56
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RE: Flo Scan

The boat comes with sight gauges for the fuel tanks, and I'm paying extra for a holding-tank gauge and a rudder indicator.
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Old 12-17-2010, 01:59 PM   #57
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Flo Scan

Quote:
sunchaser wrote:

1.* An IR gun is about 50 bucks.

2.* Here is a different question, how big should a vessel be before you elect to routinely do ER checks?
1. While an IR gun is a valuable tool, it only works if someone is holding it, has it turned on, and it's aiming at something.*

We don't have any sort of raw water cooling monitor system on our boat, but I can see the value.* I would pick that over an IR gun simply because if you loose your raw water cooling for any reason--- blocked intake, failed hose, impeller failure, etc---- engines like the FL120 will overheat rapidly and I've been told by people very familiar with the base Ford engine, both here and in England, that the absolute surest way to kill the engine is to overheat it.* According to them the Ford Dorset engine (base engine of the FL120) will not tolerate a serious overheat condition for more than a minute or two before some catastrphic failure will occur.* This is one reason the engine was such a dismal failure in the late 1950s in it's designed purpose as a truck engine.*

So at any sign of the begining of an overheat an FL120 should be shut down immediately.* A raw water monitor of some sort will provide this advance warning.

Since the chances are remote the raw water system will fail in some way when you're aiming an IR gun at it--- unless you station yourself in the engine room during the entire voyage-- a raw water alarm seems to me to be the way to go.

2. I think ER checks have more to do with the boater than the boat.* I've known people in Hawaii who did regular checks of the outboards on their boats during a fishing trip.* And I've known people with larger cruisers who never did any engine checks at all and simply called their mechanic when something "didn't work right."

We remove the covers of the outboards on our 17' Arima after a fishing trip--- be it a one day trip or a week's worth of trips up north--- mainly to look them over and spray them down with WD40.* And to fog them if they're going to be sitting for awhile.* But other than that we don't do anything with them in terms of checks.

We check the engines in the GB before every start to make sure the oil looks okay, coolant, no leaks, no obvious problems, and so on.* And depending on my interest I usually do an engine room check after we've been underway for a couple of hours.* But that's about it.

In my opinion there's really not all that much that can go wrong down there unless there are worn-out or neglected components like hoses, filter seals, belts, pump impellers, etc.* The engines in our boat were designed as vehicle engines in the 1950s, and as such there's really not that much to them.* We had an injector pipe crack-- the engine continued to run smoothly but smell of diesel alerted us to he problem (yet one more reason we never run the boat from the flying bridge.)*

The raw water system bears some paying attention to simply because it's pumping a fluid that's trying to destroy it in terms of rust and/or corrosion.* We've had raw water problems a few times and a failed (leaking) engine coolant pump.* In all those cases, the coolant temp gauge began to creep up so we shut the engine down, tied off the shaft, and finished the trip on one engine.* The raw water system bears some paying attention to simply because it's pumping a fluid that's trying to destroy it in terms of rust and/or corrosion.

But our engine, fuel, and electrical systems are very simple.* Boats with more complex systems most likely require more monitoring, either in person or with sensors, cameras, etc.

But I think how often a boater checks the engine room or space or box is totally a matter of what makes that boater comfortable.* Gear heads may enjoy getting down amongst the machinery.* Others may simply want to make sure their engine's don't overheat or stop charging the batteries.* So I don't think there is any right or wrong answer to "how often do you check your engine room?"




-- Edited by Marin on Friday 17th of December 2010 03:27:26 PM
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Old 12-17-2010, 02:08 PM   #58
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RE: Flo Scan

Quote:
Marin wrote:So at any sign of the begining of an overheat an FL120 should be shut down immediately.* A raw water monitor of some sort will provide this advance warning.
This little device or something similar attached to the cooled portion of the exhaust elbow will do a great job of letting you know that things are heating up.

http://www.devale.com/disc-thermosta...mperature.html





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Old 12-17-2010, 02:14 PM   #59
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RE: Flo Scan

I also count noses, check the roof/deck, lazaret/stern deck and since*the engine room is close and easy to pop in an out of, why not?**Just something I have done and in the habit of doing.* Also with the auto pilot*and electronic charts it gets so boring, so I do something to keep awake.**We do have a large dinett in the pilot house that my wife usually falls asleept on. ***

If the engine room was not easy access then maybe not as often, but on a reguilar bases.* I agree a boat is not like a car where you can pull along side the road.* I would not have a command bridge again that would keep me away from*passenger, engine room and general access of the boat.* ***
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Old 12-17-2010, 02:22 PM   #60
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RE: Flo Scan

"Attached is a section drawing of our primary gauge cluster."

They say that if you can't say something nice, don't say anything but I just have to say that that panel is like some of those seen on homebuilt aircraft. Some people think guages are cool so the builder tries to find a place for every guage he collected during the build.

As a long time guage gazer I would prefer to see the guages that matter grouped together in a rational manner so a quick scan will show what you need to know just by the positiion of the indicators ... you really don't need to read the numbers every time your eyes pass over the real estate, you look for patterns and changes in the patterns. Put your temperatures together near your pressures, side by side or vertical.

Do you really need to scan your blackwater level or potable and gray water contents? Are they changing that quickly that you need to know RIGHT NOW? That panel is pretty valuable real estate to fill up with a septic tank guage.

It's your boat so it's your choice but using it for an example isn't doing anyone any favors.

That's my 2 cents on that subject ...
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