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Old 11-17-2013, 06:01 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Xsbank View Post
Why bother asking for advice if you don't like what you get?
Its not that I don't like what I get its more that it has not been based on any facts.

No one has come out and said they are a POS because "insert actual flaw here" is a recurring problem.

If someone has any "actual" information pointing to a recurring flaw, believe me, I am all ears.

Yes, I know a considerably heavier motor will likely have more longevity than a smaller lighter motor - but Kubotas are a good brand and there is anecdotal evidence suggesting as apu unit for trucks they are getting more hours out of them than I will put on it in 20 years as long as it is well maintained and dry.
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Old 11-17-2013, 06:44 PM   #22
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Google fp. No matter if it were brand new. It is.still a pos and.will cause u endless hrs of frustration
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Old 11-17-2013, 06:51 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by motion30 View Post
Google fp. No matter if it were brand new. It is.still a pos and.will cause u endless hrs of frustration
And what "FACTS" have you based your opinion on?

Is it just a repeated opinion you have seen parroted across the web based on the earlier models that were sea water cooled.
Newer models are freshwater cooled.

If you have something else to support your vehement opinion, please enlighten me.

And I have googled them, extensively - corrosion on earlier models due to salt water cooling seems to be the main issue I found.
This one is FRESH water cooled.

I also googled other brands of genset and see that they also have their detractors.

To me, it sounds like Ford/Holden in Australia.
A ford man will claim a holden is a POS and vice versa , none of it based on fact.
Reality is they are both fine motorcars each with their own faults, which any mechanical item will have.
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Old 11-17-2013, 06:56 PM   #24
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From your posts, you sound like you're using circular reasoning regarding this unit.

You seem to have a preconceived theory that rebuilding this generator is a good idea, and you are making justifications to support your theory.

You do not know if the generator end is any good.
You know the engine is a rust bucket inside.

You believe that you can get a rebuild for $1000 in labor and what, $500 in parts, if I read your post correctly. This is almost guaranteed not to be the case.

You believe that you can get a new motor for $2,000. If thats true, then you'd be way better buying new rather than rebuilding, but I dont believe that you'll find a new motor for $2,000, but I could be wrong there.

If you were mechanically inclined enough to do this job yourself, and felt like doing the work, then I'd say to go for it. Your labor would be free and you'd learn allot.

Since you're hiring the job out, I'd say to not even try.

Here''s a little background on what I'm saying.

I am in the backup power business. I've worked on generators as part of my living for over 30 years.

When I first went into business for myself back in 1997 I had this bright idea that I would take in used worn out small prime power generators, completely rebuild them to like new condition and re-sell them, allowing a trade in of the old unit. Sounds like a good business plan, right... Nope

The fact is that I tried several of them, and found that by the time I paid myself for labor at a profitable shop rate, and bought the parts,I was approaching the price I could pay for a new complete generator, at dealer prices.

Thats why shops do not do rebuilds of small generators very often. It doesn't make financial sense. Larger generators, yes, but not small ones.

So, good luck. Take the advice or not, its your sword to fall on.
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Old 11-17-2013, 07:21 PM   #25
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Old 11-17-2013, 07:26 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksanders View Post
From your posts, you sound like you're using circular reasoning regarding this unit.
And from the posts here from others it seems they are also making circular reasoning, they are saying NOT to do it because they heard something repeated by "some guy" on the interwebs.
Quote:
You seem to have a preconceived theory that rebuilding this generator is a good idea, and you are making justifications to support your theory.
Quite possibly
But that theory is based on FACTS that a new genny in any brand will cost me at least 7x more than what I could get this one working for.
Quote:
You do not know if the generator end is any good.
And you do not know that it is not.
The owner/seller said it is (it was working and churning out 110 before removal).
FP have a lifetime warranty on that end of their product
I would like to think it should be fine
Quote:
You know the engine is a rust bucket inside.
I do not know that at all.
The very top of the motor is dry of oil and shows signs of surface rust
That does not mean necessarily that the rest of it is a rust bucket, but all that will be revealed when it is pulled down, if it even needs to be.
Quote:
You believe that you can get a rebuild for $1000 in labor and what, $500 in parts, if I read your post correctly. This is almost guaranteed not to be the case.
Quite possibly
The mechanic did approximate, but the last rebuild he did for me on a small Isuzu came in under his initial estimate.
Quote:
You believe that you can get a new motor for $2,000. If thats true, then you'd be way better buying new rather than rebuilding, but I dont believe that you'll find a new motor for $2,000, but I could be wrong there.
I based that number on this ad which has expired
Quote:
Kubota Z482 Engines for Sale

These beautiful Kubota "Super-Mini" 2-cylinder 13.5 HP diesel engines are new and unused. There are four available. A starter and starter mount plate is included, There is no factory warranty as they are "old stock" but we guarantee they are new and unused and that they will run. A testing period of two weeks after receipt is allowed. If the engine fails to run it may be returned at buyer's expense for the full purchase price (not including shipping).

The engines are located in Marrickville, NSW 2204 (suburb of Sydney) and are for local pickup or shipment to Australia addresses only at shipping cost plus $25 for packing. The price is A$1995 per engine.
Kubota Z482-E2B Diesel Engine For Sale
I would assume that I should be able to get one not far off that price - I'll make a call now shall I?
Quote:
If you were mechanically inclined enough to do this job yourself, and felt like doing the work, then I'd say to go for it. Your labor would be free and you'd learn allot.
Initially, this is exactly what I planned on doing.
But if $1500 gets a result, I wouldn't be bothered.
Quote:
The fact is that I tried several of them, and found that by the time I paid myself for labor at a profitable shop rate, and bought the parts,I was approaching the price I could pay for a new complete generator, at dealer prices.
And if in America, that would probably be the case
Here, I have a long way to go before it gets anywhere near the cost of new.
Quote:
So, good luck. Take the advice or not, its your sword to fall on.
Indeed it is and I am prepared to take the punt.

Especially as no one has come out with any reason NOT to do it apart from:
*Several owners on the Internet were not happy with corrosion on early models (but countless thousands have made no comment, happy owners rarely do)
*It may cost more than I think (but still a whole lot less than $16,000)
*A heavier genset will most like last longer.

Was there another reason I missed?
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Old 11-17-2013, 07:48 PM   #27
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Your sword my king.
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Old 11-17-2013, 08:19 PM   #28
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Old 11-17-2013, 08:30 PM   #29
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Parmenter,
Don`t easily discount the remarkably quiet Honda, or less costly (? good copy) Kipor. I kept a noisy Yamaha clone on my last boat, found places for fuel above deck, they use little fuel anyway.
Weighing economics and the diagnoses/predictions, isn`t your best option to punt and go ahead. Not a lot to lose, much to gain, and the FP unit must suit your boat.
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Old 11-17-2013, 08:54 PM   #30
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Parmenter,
Don`t easily discount the remarkably quiet Honda
Hi Bruce, if I was only using it for weekends or even the occasional week away that is exactly what I would have but as I will have a live-aboard vessel and it mostly will be not be that close to easily accessible petrol I would have to carry more than I would be comfortable carrying.

On my last boat when we lived aboard we would often spend 3 to 4 weeks at a time away, but then we only had a 2hp outboard on the dinghy.
Now I was working on fuel usage of a 15 - 20hp outboard on a decent dinghy for exploration and fishing forays.
An hour/day @ 6lph for 4 weeks = 180 litres of fuel to be carried
Plus another 2 or 3/day for a petrol genny (up near 300 litres now) is more petrol than I would be comfortable carrying.
Mind you, 5 litres will probably go up with as much of a bang as 300L

Quote:
and the FP unit must suit your boat
It suits it more an a $16000 heavyweight genny which would have be housed down aft with the already heavyweight primary engine and the heavy dinghy.
At least this FP could be mounted up front in an easily accessible walk in storage area, distributing the load somewhat.
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Old 11-17-2013, 09:08 PM   #31
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Perhaps I've missed it somewhere but what kind of boat do you have?
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Old 11-17-2013, 09:45 PM   #32
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Perhaps I've missed it somewhere but what kind of boat do you have?
A white one

Does that affect the generator?
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Old 11-17-2013, 11:49 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Parmenter View Post
A white one

Does that affect the generator?
No, but an answer like that sure will affect the attitude of the people you are trying to get advice from.
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Old 11-18-2013, 12:42 AM   #34
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No, but an answer like that sure will affect the attitude of the people you are trying to get advice from.
LOL, I was warned that Americans have a different sense of humour to Australians.

My boat as yet hasn't seen water but it is very close.
She is a one off build very similar in style to this made from Cedar epoxy with Perkins 4236 engines
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Old 11-18-2013, 08:00 AM   #35
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Yep, it's white! Thanks for posting the picture. That is a beautiful shear line.

Dmarchand is very knowledgeable on mechanical things, and was trying to keep you out of trouble. The nuances of internet conversations are easily misunderstood. I love the Aussies' sense of humor even if sometimes I don't understand it.
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Old 11-18-2013, 09:11 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by Parmenter View Post
She is a one off build very similar in style to this made from Cedar epoxy with Perkins 4236 engines
Twins? Perkins at that! With used broken down Hynautic controls? And no reliable genset? A big old inefficient fridge? Cheap solar panels too! And wood! My God man, have you lost your mind?

Sounds like fun though.
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Old 11-18-2013, 09:59 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
Twins? Perkins at that! With used broken down Hynautic controls? And no reliable genset? A big old inefficient fridge? Cheap solar panels too! And wood! My God man, have you lost your mind?

Sounds like fun though.

Nope....
He's Australian!

HOLLYWOOD
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Old 11-18-2013, 10:25 AM   #38
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LOL, I was warned that Americans have a different sense of humour to Australians.
Sense of humour had nothing to do with my question. This little community is like a family of sorts, at times dysfunctional and argumentative but pretty much always there for one another. Sometimes it helps others answer questions if you share a bit of background on either yourself or your boat. Filling out your profile is the easiest way to do that, sharing photos of your project is another.

As to the genny, putting $4,500 into something everybody on the web says ain't reliable may not be my cuppa tea but if faced with costs like yours I might give it a go. Assuming you've exhausted options like adding another $2,000 to the kitty and seen about a running take out with no issues that you can hear run. $25 for a 1 year membership at boatdiesel.com and asking your questions there is another dirt cheap option.

Ultimately you pay your money and take your chances. Good luck with your project mate.
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Old 11-18-2013, 11:26 AM   #39
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Why would weight be an issue with that boat? I'd search a little longer and find a used Northern Lights, that FP will not provide you the service you think, and sorry I do not have my data sheets handy to prove beyond a reasonable doubt, then again reasonable does not come into the equation now does it.
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Old 11-18-2013, 12:28 PM   #40
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A quick jump in here. A slip neighbor was outfitting his sailboat for cruising and opted for FP for his Gen. I asked him why FP and attitude started flying around. I just thought it was sailboater vs. powerboater tude time. He was going on a four or five year cruise and spent well over 55K buying things.

The next year I was at the dock and who appears? Mr Cruiser. And I should add, a not so happy Mr. Cruiser

He wasn't friendly at first but soon the sad stories of his cruising and that damned FP gen that the factory service couldn't fix and sucked. The stories of them not coming through with promises and the failure of the unit. I said, only 9 mos old and it wouldn't work?

That's the only FP story I know and if I had a happy one it would be right here.
(happy FP story insert here)
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