Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 03-22-2015, 11:07 PM   #1
Veteran Member
 
City: Ellensburg
Country: USA
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 32
Filter change air bleed

I just changed fuel filters on the Racors for two Perkins 6-3544t. When I tried to bleed the filter nothing happened.. The fuel in the tanks is about at the same level as the filters(1/2 full). The fuel comes from a manifold that joins the tanks which has an air bleed on top. I cracked that open to see if that would let fuel through the filter. I heard air sucking into the bleed so I closed it but some air entered.
Question: when I try to start the engine will I have a "air in the injectors" problem?
Should I do anything before I try a start?
Thanks, Loon
__________________
Advertisement

Loon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 11:22 PM   #2
Guru
 
Capt.Bill11's Avatar
 
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,422
Do you have fuel shut off valves at the tanks or up stream of the filters?

If so close the valves, open the Racors and fill them before trying to starting the engine. Open the fuel valve of course.

Do you know where the bleeder or fuel return line is located on your engine?

If so you can start the engine with the bleeder or return line slightly cracked open. Many times if there is air in the system you can bleed it out as the engine runs or tries to start. Catch the fuel with oil sorbs or in a bucket.


Posting some clear, well lit photos of your fuel system might help.
__________________

Capt.Bill11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2015, 11:24 PM   #3
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,162
I bleed from the tank to the injectors. Racor primary filter - Secondary filter - Hi Press fuel pump - injectors. I use a remote start switch to crank while bleeding along the way. When she sounds like she wants to start, I stop and move to the helm to open the throttle for the start, then retard as she fires.

Mine is like your engine with the extra 2 cylinders lopped off.
__________________
Al

Custom Google Trawler Forum Search
FlyWright is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 01:13 AM   #4
Veteran Member
 
City: Ellensburg
Country: USA
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 32
The shut off is just upstream of the filter. I completely filled the filter so there is very little air in it. I'll try the bleed at the engine on Tuesday when I go back to the boat. If I crack the fitting a little and it starts, should I let it run and then tighten the fitting?
Loon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 01:27 AM   #5
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,162
Do you have a manual that explains the procedure for the 6.354?
__________________
Al

Custom Google Trawler Forum Search
FlyWright is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 07:31 AM   #6
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,734
The injectors on that engine should self bleed once the injection pump is bled.
There is a bleed screw on the injection pump.
__________________
Jay Leonard
Attitude Adjustment
40 Albin
Mystic,Ct
jleonard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 07:56 AM   #7
Guru
 
O C Diver's Avatar
 
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in Crisfield, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,803
Which model racor do you have (900, 1000, etc.)? Is the racor in line before the fuel pump? Did you drain the seperator, or just pull the element? If you have one of the larger separators, 900 or 1000 and you didn't drain the seperator, there is a simpler way to bleed the system. If you only pulled the element, the system is fine from the seperator through the engine. With the the fuel shutoff valve open, spin or run the motor for no more than 10 seconds and then shut it down. Close the fuel shutoff valve, open the racor and top off the fuel. Close the filter, open the fuel valve, and repeat the process. On the second or third time the fuel level will have not dropped in the seperator, and the system is completely bled. The large racors can have somewhere around a pint of air space in the top before air leaves the seperator.

Ted
__________________
Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
O C Diver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 10:24 AM   #8
Veteran Member
 
City: Ellensburg
Country: USA
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 32
Thanks guys, I'm going to try a couple of you suggestions. I do have the Racor 1000 so the idea of maintaining the fuel from filter to engine appeals to me. I'll run it 10 sec, top off the filters, bleed the injector pump. Do it again and that should be good to go. I'll let you know how it went.
Thanks again
Ian
Loon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 10:35 AM   #9
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,152
I never had to bleed when I just changed the external filter(s). If you're careful and refill the Racor body, you should be fine. Even doing that on the secondary filter, never had me needing to bleed. In 5 years, I only every had to do it once when I got a small leak around the lift pump while it was running and it sucked air in.

Do you need the manual? Mine was a non-turbo, but I think the procedure is the same.
__________________
2000 Navigator 4200 Classic
(NOT a trawler)
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 01:31 PM   #10
Guru
 
Xsbank's Avatar
 
City: Pender Harbour, BC
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Gwaii Haanas
Vessel Model: Vancouver Shipyards Custom Aluminum 52
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 2,442
If you don't drain the bowl of a Racor, just pull the filter, you are shaking a lot of crap off the old filter which will bypass the new one, letting that crap go downstream to whatever awaits it. Give yourself a break and drain/clean the bowl.
__________________
Don't believe everything that you think.
Xsbank is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 05:24 PM   #11
Guru
 
tpbrady's Avatar
 
City: Anchorage/Wrangell
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Silver Bay
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 42-002
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 505
i have not had to bleed the injection system on the 6.354 when swapping a Racor as long as I filled it up. To bleed the 6.354 you start at the lift pump and work toward the filters. There is a bleed on top of the filters and then one on the injection pump. Using the lift pump open them one at a time and pump until only fuel comes out. The final part of the bleeding process is to crack the nuts on each injector and crank the engine until you see fuel coming out of each and then crank a little more. I normally put paper towels all around to absorb fuel.

Tom
tpbrady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2015, 05:47 PM   #12
TF Site Team
 
dwhatty's Avatar
 
City: Home Port: Buck's Harbor, Maine
Country: USA
Vessel Name: "Emily Anne"
Vessel Model: 2001 Island Gypsy 32 Europa (Hull #146)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,730
Filter changing and bleeding was a PIA our old boat that had twin Chrysler Nissans and three filters (one Dahl, one screw on cannister and one on-engine bowl) in-line on each engine and two bleed points for each engine.

Our present boat with a single Cummins 6BTA with dual Racors and one on-engine spin on has, knock on wood, never had to be bled. Just have to ensure the filters are topped up with diesel after the drain and change.
__________________
David Hawkins
Deer Isle, Maine
dwhatty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2015, 11:19 PM   #13
Veteran Member
 
City: Ellensburg
Country: USA
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 32
Well the start up was a non-event. Thanks everyone the combined advice was spot on. We turned them over, stopped after 15 sec, topped off the racors, and presto they both ran like thoroughbreds. Now I try ing to track down an intermittent port tach. It's intermittent on both so it must be the sender. No sender on the front of the engine where it should be so I'm thinking alternator.
Loon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2015, 01:55 AM   #14
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,162
If your tachs are like mine, they're fed by the alternator stators. If the alt is putting out, it works. If it's not, for whatever reason, that side is dead or inaccurate.

Loon,

My alts are cabled directly to their respective battery. When the start batt is full, the onside (port) alternator gives up the ghost until I place a load on the battery. Since my start batt has no load when underway, I need to tie the batts together then place a load on the house bank. It works every time, but provides little additional info to me if my engines are synced and the other tach is indicating correctly. So I have learned to live with the inaccuracy of my port tach.
__________________
Al

Custom Google Trawler Forum Search
FlyWright is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2015, 02:22 AM   #15
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: 2011 Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,248
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyWright View Post
...My alts are cabled directly to their respective battery. When the start batt is full, the onside (port) alternator gives up the ghost until I place a load on the battery. Since my start batt has no load when underway, I need to tie the batts together then place a load on the house bank. It works every time, but provides little additional info to me if my engines are synced and the other tach is indicating correctly. So I have learned to live with the inaccuracy of my port tach.
Whaaa?? Al, you make having twins increasing complications by the square compared to a single (perhaps because electricity is nearly a complete mystery to me.) ... Meanwhile, tomorrow we'll be heading to Pittsburg with eight pounds of ham for the SF Bay/Delta-trawler get-together this weekend. ... Furthermore, I'm contemplating a strategy to replace or repair my inoperative/broken inverter. Thank goodness the alternator pumps out the "juice."
__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2015, 01:12 PM   #16
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
Whaaa?? Al, you make having twins increasing complications by the square compared to a single (perhaps because electricity is nearly a complete mystery to me.) ... Meanwhile, tomorrow we'll be heading to Pittsburg with eight pounds of ham for the SF Bay/Delta-trawler get-together this weekend. ... Furthermore, I'm contemplating a strategy to replace or repair my inoperative/broken inverter. Thank goodness the alternator pumps out the "juice."
It's not that complicated...maybe I made it sound that way. My aeronautical engineering and aviation piloting experience taught me a thing or two about electricity. Certainly not my forte, but I get by. Suffice to say that with twins, I have the redundancy I desire in engine propulsion and electrical power. It's more than the minimum and less than the ultimate, but it works well for me.

See you in Pittsburg later this afternoon!!
__________________

__________________
Al

Custom Google Trawler Forum Search
FlyWright is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012