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Old 07-23-2012, 08:02 AM   #21
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Rick,
The only person you are impressing is yourself. You have contributed nothing to my question except acrimony.
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:06 AM   #22
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Rick
I am done explaining this to you. Stop trying to allude that there is some thing "more to the story". It's offensive.
I see you're removed your other post complaining about Rick's response but I read it before you removed it.

When you make a post on a public forum, you have to expect some responses that you may not like. If you leave out important details, the only responses you can possibly get are either guesses or requests for the additional information.

Also, if you've done something that would seem to be unwise (such as leaving the dock knowing that you had a coolant leak), you can expect to be called out on that decision.

If you're going to post on public forums, it's best to put on your "Big Girl" panties first.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:47 AM   #23
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Ron, I didnt remove my post, The Moderator, Gonzo, Did.
I didnt take any issue with his comment about leaving the dock and that is up for debate if it was an unwise decision. I took issue with Rick over his rudeness and continued cherry picking and insinuation that for some reason I was lying about my circumstances or omitting something of which both would serve no purpose and defy logic as I orginally posted to seek the advice of the group. Out of the replies almost ALL had a recommended Course of Action (ie. the Heat Exchanger) while Rick chose to cherry pick my post and offered nothing in the value of a recommendation.

I dont have a soft skin and can pull up my big boy panties just fine, but I dont feel it is in the spirit of the forum to nitpick the original poster who is seeking assistance. I am sure if you read Ricks attempts to show all of us that he is the smartest guy in the room, you will see he offered no solution, only stupid questions and accusations.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:50 AM   #24
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"More than likely when you remove the heat exchanger you will find that it will need replacement because the coolant is flowing into the raw water, a bad thing... Do you have coolant in your oil?
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Ray that is exactly what we found. Good Call. Thanks.
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Old 07-23-2012, 10:25 AM   #25
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Out of the replies almost ALL had a recommended Course of Action (ie. the Heat Exchanger) while Rick chose to cherry pick my post and offered nothing in the value of a recommendation.
A recommendation offered without as much information as possible is a guess. It might be correct, but it might also obscure a different issue.

Watching coolant pour out of your exhaust is pretty much a no brainer as far as placing the heat exhanger at the top of the suspect list but the other factors described lead a practiced troubleshooter to look a little deeper. You might choose to call it "cherry picking" for reasons beyond my understanding but I look at it as troubleshooting and looking for what may be hidden behind the obvious.

Considering your responses to date, I could care less what happens to your engine and bank account in the future. Knowing what happened to you in the recent past may save someone else a great deal of time and money and I do care about that otherwise I wouldn't bother.

Trust me, I don't need to impress anyone in a recreational trawler thread, I make my living impressing a different demographic that is not part of this audience. I am here because I have owned big and small boats and also own a trawler. I enjoy discussing the technical aspects of operating and maintaining one. I look at this as "giving back" a lot of what others have given me, nothing more, nothing less.

Very seldom will I offer a recommendation without asking relevant questions (some of which might seem irrelevant) first. And I become curious when the story changes or additional bits are added that are at odds with the original description. There is nearly always a "rest of the story" that goes untold when something like this happens.
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Old 07-23-2012, 10:35 AM   #26
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A recommendation offered without as much information as possible is a guess. It might be correct, but it might also obscure a different issue................
A point I tried to make.

It's easy to throw out suggestions, but without proper troubleshooting, and proper information, any attempt at repair is likely to result in additional expense as items are replaced one by one until the problem is solved.
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Old 07-23-2012, 10:45 AM   #27
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I'm still looking for the "rude" stuff ...
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Old 07-23-2012, 02:37 PM   #28
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FWIW this was in one of Rick's first posts to this discussion, post #12.

--------------------
Put new Coolant in and started engine. Noticed coolant was going straight out the engine exhaust. Water was green.

Points toward massive failure of the heat exchanger but doesn't answer first question.
------------------------

So Rick did offer his opinion on what the problem most likely was but wanted additional information since with marine engines there are often multiple causes for a particular symptom as most of us have learned over the years. A key in troubleshooting is to eliminate causes for a symptom until you're left with just one, which to paraphrase Sherlock Holmes, no matter how improbable it may seem must be the solution.

But to do that you need as much information about the "case" as one can get. Hence, I think, Rick's continued request for more information. Don't forget, unlike most or all of us, Rick makes his living troubleshooting and fixing propulsion, power generation, and other vessel systems so it's to be expected that he would approach trying to diagnose this particular problem the way he's used to doing it on someone's 200' megayacht.

I suspect I'd get the same kind of probing for every possible bit of information if I asked one of our senior flight line mechanics for advice on a perplexing problem I was having with an old de Havilland Beaver.
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Old 07-23-2012, 03:21 PM   #29
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PALEASE!! I'm not the only guy here aware of RickB's out of line responses. Just as I'm pretty sure that BH doesn't have history of throwing comments out, being called on it- then pouting for awhile away from the site before REPEATING the cycle yet again. And Gonzo- if you want to be a moderator here- then do it fair and balanced. If you want to have a RickB fan club, start your own site. This is a SHARED online community and everyone brings something to the table.
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Old 07-23-2012, 03:24 PM   #30
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I'm still looking for the "rude" stuff ...
I am with Rick on this one.

I have learned that when Rick comments on something it is backed up with fact. You can pretty much count on it.

It is a diagnosis not a guessing game.

Hard to trouble shoot with big pieces of the puzzle missing.

You can always throw parts at the problem untill it works or trouble shoot the issue and fix it right the first time.



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Old 07-23-2012, 04:25 PM   #31
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PALEASE!! I'm not the only guy here aware of RickB's out of line responses.
I must have missed them while pouting ... if you don't mind, tell me which responses are "out of line" please.
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:04 PM   #32
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I must have missed them while pouting ... if you don't mind, tell me which responses are "out of line" please.
Rick, I don't want to start another endless thread about "prove this" and "that's not what I meant". I have been in the same position as BH in the past with you a couple of times and I know well how you present yourself. If there are others on the forum who don't mind your opinion- as though they possibly are gaining information not readily available from Google, then by all means present it as you want. But as I have told you before, I am not interested in your opinion unless you are certain I am about to hurt myself or others. I don't need access to information you might provide enough that I am willing to tolerated the rudeness. Having said that, carry on.
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:19 PM   #33
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Let's stop this nonsense. I think both of you guys need a break.

Rick, I think if you thought about it, you could find where you appeared to be a little over the top with your tone/comments.

BH, the simple solution to replies that you don't like, is to ignore them and focus on the replies that interest you. Instead, you're throwing an endless amount of fuel around.

With that said, Engine problems can be a frustrating time. I am glad you found the real issue with your heat exchanger. Hopefully that will completely solve this for you.

Cheers.
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:28 PM   #34
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So, what you are saying is that you can't really find anything "rude" but you just don't like it anyway so you feel perfectly free to slam me for something you cannot even point to. You call me "rude" but your personal attack is OK? That is truly bizarre.

I mean what I write, you will be very hard pressed to find an example of me saying "that's not what I meant." Yes, I will defend my position against baseless personal attacks by those who cannot even support that attack with an example of what they claim is so "rude" or offensive.

If you can't support your accusation, then why make it? Or is it rude of me to ask?For someone who feels it is perfectly proper to make the kind of statements you made in your 1:21 post, you seem to hold my posts to a much different standard than your own. I call that hypocrisy and suggest you either "put up or shut up."

If you are not interested in my opinion, don't read my posts. See how easy and painless that is?
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:36 PM   #35
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"I think if you thought about it, you could find where you appeared to be a little over the top with your tone/comments."

"Over the top"of what? Come on, tell me what was over the top. If you bring your personal sensitivities into this then you have an obligation to say what it is that you find offensive. Just throwing out undefined, fuzzy, little hand grenades to make yourself feel better is hardly an adult behaviour.
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Old 07-23-2012, 05:55 PM   #36
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Rick,
Your approach to sharing your opinions in this circle goes back to the days when a big part of the croud was on Passagemaker Forum. That's years ago before TF started. You joined the site and immediately tried to knock Fast Fred down on everthing he posted. I mean everything. If Fred said Red, he was an idiot endangering the whole marina and it HAD to be blue. Totally unnecessary. And it hasn't improved.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:19 PM   #37
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Rick,
You set the tone with your first reply on the thread. You keep alluding that I am not telling everything regarding my over temp and that my friend is called "impugning ". Look it up. You also insist on playing volley ball with my replies to your questions. Also boorish behavior.
I simply was asking for a helpful reply and received that from the others and it took one reply.
Yet you blather on and on facts and choose to argue with me to prove some hidden point.
As I said before and I say again , I'm done trying to explain anything to you. In the military, we have a saying, you're either part of the solution or part of the problem. You haven't offered much in way of solution.
You are a poor ambassador to the forum

Forklift, I appreciate your observation of the facts.

I will lurk instead of intent to contribute because I really don't have time for the drama.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:21 PM   #38
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Rick,
Your approach to sharing your opinions in this circle goes back to the days when a big part of the croud was on Passagemaker Forum.
Ah, so, let's see if I have this straight ... you have been nursing a grudge for longer than TF has existed and it has finally prompted you to post a string of personal attacks on me based on some deeply buried emotional issue that you can't support with anything more than your personal discomfort.

Why is OK to make the accusations that Gonzo removed but beyond the pale to ask for details about an engine problem? Why is it rude to enquire what the temperature switch settings are?

If you care to get back on topic, do you have a Perkins propulsion engine with automatic shutdown that holds 8 gallons of coolant? Do you think it is wise to start a trial run with coolant streaming out the exhaust? Is there anyone here that does? If so, what does the manual say about the settings?
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:30 PM   #39
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Impugning? No, it is more a case of pointing out that leaving the dock with an engine pumping coolant over the side then finding it overheated enough to shut down is just a simple observation of someone doing a really really foolish act that likely caused more damage than is immediately obvious.

Your unwillingness to provide any details about the event or the engine configuration begs quite a few other questions. Good for you getting the answer you hoped to get, but seriously consider asking yourself those same questions.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:52 PM   #40
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Alright, you guys have had your fun.
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