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Old 02-02-2019, 01:24 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by DLETF View Post
Got it; pictures attached.
As you can see it is 12 point bolt head. 10mm

Get a socket and label it for the future, don't depend on your mechanic to know
what is needed. He may mess your engine up before admitting that he did not know.
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Old 02-03-2019, 07:38 AM   #22
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As you can see it is 12 point bolt head. 10mm

Get a socket and label it for the future, don't depend on your mechanic to know
what is needed. He may mess your engine up before admitting that he did not know.

Right, the wrong socket is being used. It's essentially a male Torx fitting.
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Old 02-03-2019, 10:32 AM   #23
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yes male Torx

https://www.walmart.com/ip/11-Pc-Tor...b8bf5297f6a25a
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Old 02-03-2019, 12:10 PM   #24
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No it is not a Torx head. It is a spline drive bolt, the proper socket is a spline drive socket. Using a torx socket or a regular SAE socket would be like using an Allen wrench in a torx fastener — it might work, it might destroy the fastener.
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Old 02-03-2019, 12:14 PM   #25
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Yep, 10mm 12pt spline drive. Not Torx. Some cheap sockets tend to round them off.
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Old 02-03-2019, 12:26 PM   #26
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Ok learned something new. never ending evolution of socket shapes.

What is the purpose of the spline drive bolt head other than overloading tool boxes?.
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Old 02-03-2019, 02:52 PM   #27
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It’s to keep non factory trained personnel from performing incorrect maintenance.

Actually spline drive allows more torque than 12 point before failure is reached.

I have to say, that bolt does not look like a spline drive to me. The picture is not adequate for me to say for sure what it is and I don’t know for a fact what it is but it looks a lot like a reverse torx plus head. Yes there really is such a thing. It is similar to the MORFOR head that Ford uses on its truck beds.

Would be nice if we had an actual spec. From Cummins.
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Old 02-03-2019, 04:30 PM   #28
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No. It's not to keep people from working on it. They use 12pt bolts on the starter for clearance. No room for the socket or wrench if you could even get the bolt in.
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Old 02-03-2019, 11:13 PM   #29
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THere is a 12 point head bolt , not spline, not torx. I have run into them before and a 12 pt socket or box end wrench fit them perfectly.

On my V555 Cummins engine are some of those 12 pt bolts but 7/16. Done for clearance purposes and also in my case because some of the bolts you literally can only turn the fastener one point at a time, 30o , which makes the removal a long drawn out process.
To get those bolts one must have the specific wrench needed or the unit is not coming off.

Maybe something else would fit but as Ski pointed out maybe monkey the bolt head causing serious trouble for removal.
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Old 02-03-2019, 11:53 PM   #30
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No. It's not to keep people from working on it. They use 12pt bolts on the starter for clearance. No room for the socket or wrench if you could even get the bolt in.
12 point bolt is the same as 6 pt bolt in respect to clearance. In other words 10mm is 10 mm regardless of points. 12 point does allow more torque before failure when tightening.

I was being funny about the qualified mechanic
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Old 02-06-2019, 08:52 PM   #31
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I would find another mechanic, removing a starter on any engine is pretty basic work.
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Old 02-07-2019, 07:54 PM   #32
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I agree with the comment about the mechanics, I'll bet even our Prime Minister could get that starter off (I'm kidding, Little Potato gets drool on his tie, he could never accomplish anything like that).
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Old 02-07-2019, 10:04 PM   #33
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Cummins Part #: 3903834
Fits 1994-2007 5.9L Cummins only. These DO NOT work with a starter spacer.
They are M10x1.5x35mm long.
Replacement starter bolts, takes 3 to replace all.
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Old 02-09-2019, 10:30 AM   #34
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Spline drive works on 6, 12, spline drive bolts.
I dont have any spline drive since I have never needed any yet.
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Old 02-09-2019, 12:17 PM   #35
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Spline drive is not the answer to everything. Using spline drive on a 4 or 6 pt bolt is not proper. There is not enough contact area in high torque applications. They are very handy to have when you are caught with out the correct tool. If the bolt has already been stripped by some one using an incorrect tool, spline can often save the day.

While I have a set of spline drive wrenches on board, they are not my go to wrench.
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Old 02-09-2019, 07:17 PM   #36
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4 point. Now bringing in antique furniture into the equation?
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Old 02-10-2019, 07:05 AM   #37
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I'm new to this site so forgive me if I'm doing something in error. You need to find someone that has a heat induction tool. It looks like a wand with a wire loop on the end. You put the loop around the bolt head and it heats up the bolt cherry red. Then you use the proper socket or an extractor socket on the bolt head to remove it. These heat induction tools are used a lot to remove stripped lug nuts on custom wheels so the wheels don't get damaged. They run $300 to $400 if you have to buy one, but it maybe the cheaper option.

Hope this helps!
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Old 02-10-2019, 07:00 PM   #38
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Seems it might be best to heat the female part of the equation?
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Old 02-10-2019, 08:31 PM   #39
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Odd you should mention a 4 pt head. Not on my boat that I know of but on my brand new kitchen tap set.

I also ran into them when I used to work on some of the plastic injection moulding machines although they were plugs for drains or fillers. But they were present so I got 8 pt sockets to deal with them as i needed.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:08 PM   #40
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Quote:
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12 point bolt is the same as 6 pt bolt in respect to clearance. In other words 10mm is 10 mm regardless of points. 12 point does allow more torque before failure when tightening.

I was being funny about the qualified mechanic



The vast majority of 12pt bolts use a smaller head than the same size thread 6pt. Take 1/2"-13. STD head size for 6pt is 3/4" same bolt in 12 pt uses a 1/2" head.
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