Best use of $650 for engine monitoring

[timjet]

I currently have a Garmin 740 and a Raymarine E90W MFD. I use the Garmin for navigation because it’s brighter screen and easier route viewing and data presentation make it better suited for this than the Ray unit. I use the Ray unit for radar, video ER monitoring, AIS, MARPA and autopilot coupling. This is a good setup as the Garmin always displays nav data, important on the FL west coast with the many narrow channels and shoal areas. I play with the Ray unit switching between video, radar and autopilot control.

I am thinking of installing a actisense engine monitoring unit (EMU). EMU-1: Engine Monitoring Unit .
This unit converts the analog data from the engine sensors on my Cummins 6BT 330 to NMEA 2000 that can be read and viewed on both the Garmin and Raymaine MFD’s. I would have to set up a NMEA 2000 backbone and currently the EMU would convert RPM, oil pressure and water temperature to NMEA 2000 that I would display on the MFD’s. Strangely the Ray unit has no alarms, but the Garmin unit does. I would set up the Garmin unit to alarm when oil pressure or water temp exceeds a value I would set before the analog alarms settings are reached. I estimate the cost to do this to be about $650.

I’m wondering if this is the best use of this money for engine monitoring? For this money I could install EGT gauges, and perhaps a low raw water flow sensor. I already have boost and a Borel raw water high temp alarm. I’m also considering installing a coolant temp alarm/gauge that senses coolant temp closer to the top of the engine than the factory installed coolant gauge. I’ve heard the location of this sensor will likely indicate an overheat problem before the factory installed one but not sure where the takeoff for this is. I take engine readings everyday and monitor oil pressure and water temp pretty closely.

[FONT=&quot]What do you guys think?[/FONT]

 

[ksanders]

I have thought about it at length, and had the opportunity when I repowered two years ago. I just do not see NEMA 2000 based gauges as being all that useful.

Part of a larger glass bridge system, if you gould get your entire boat there, it might be nice, but...

For $650 you could get Atena Tach's, EGT and boost gauges. Thats where I'd sink that money. Actually thats where I did sink that money when I had the choices.

 

[sunchaser]

I would spend the money on an electric lift ER hatch so you can safely and easily check out the engines several times during the day as you are cruising. Nothing beats eyes and an IR gun on operating engines.

 

[obthomas]

I wrestled with NMEA 2000 instrumentation through my Garmin Network and decided instead to alarm everything with Aqualarm's six alarm system. Its independent rings a damn large bell, lights a light, and I know when something is wrong. Oil pressure, engine temperature, exhaust over-temperature, raw water flow, high bilge and engine room fire. About the same money.

I like the independence. I have found that even though my three Garmins are networked, often settings on one do not transfer over to the others automatically. For example I tried to configure my AIS on one Garmin and was about to send my AIS back for repair when I found that you can only configure it from the chart-plotter that it is connected to. I have a NEMA 0183 AIS transponder and all Nema 0183 stuff has to be connected to one chartplotter in a Garmin network. Just $hit like this makes me feel more secure with the dedicated alarm system.

 

[Portuguese]

I do not want networked things. More than once I have seen a bota calling for help because they lost "the monitor".

As engine data concerns, have you seen what Maretron does?
Maretron | Engine Monitoring

They have very good products, I don't know if 650 will be enough but I am pretty sure that you can find something whithin that range, if it is to show in your Ray/Garmin

Portuguese

 

[FF]

Murphy Gauges , work fine with NO electric.

Are the gauges simply to monitor the engine or as boat bling?

 

[healhustler]

I've got a recent Garmin suite that I'd like to include in engine/system monitoring. I just bought a 4 gauge set for my newly reconditioned gen-set (murphy style) and I'm thinking about doing the same with murphy's in the engine space with remote camera monitoring. Even remote monitored infra-red temp gun is manageable if FF would figure it out for me.

 

[obthomas]

I've got a recent Garmin suite that I'd like to include in engine/system monitoring. I just bought a 4 gauge set for my newly reconditioned gen-set (murphy style) and I'm thinking about doing the same with murphy's in the engine space with remote camera monitoring. Even remote monitored infra-red temp gun is manageable if FF would figure it out for me.

Garmin has some limitations.....The newer chart plotters 4000, 5000 6000 series each manage two cameras.....Camera images are not networked and can only be seen on the chart plotter to which they are connected. The Chart plotter can be set to alternate between the 2 cameras connect to it.

 

[ksanders]

If you are going to run cameras, why not just display them on a laptop?

My furuno system has an input for a camera, but I'll never use it. Many Cameras are IP addressable with built in web servers. Just browse to the camera and there it is.

 

[N4712]

Garmin has some limitations.....The newer chart plotters 4000, 5000 6000 series each manage two cameras.....Camera images are not networked and can only be seen on the chart plotter to which they are connected. The Chart plotter can be set to alternate between the 2 cameras connect to it.

Go with a multiplexer, it breaks it up into 4 cameras on one screen. http://www.amazon.com/VideoSecu-Sec...ty-surveillance&ie=UTF8&qid=1386801690&sr=1-1

 

[RT Firefly]

Greetings,
$650?

 

[healhustler]

Go with a multiplexer, it breaks it up into 4 cameras on one screen. Amazon.com: VideoSecu Office Home Security Camera CCTV Color Surveillance Video Quad Splitter Processor 1EY: Electronics

I have the multiplexer on both sides of the helm for two separate screens, thus far, unmounted. But Kevin has a good point and the plan is to have an I-Pad and Laptop running (Admiral's toys) and will likely use the laptop to monitor the cameras.

 

[twistedtree]

The stuff you are considering displaying on your MFD - is it all info that is already available on other gauges? If so, I'd probably lean more towards getting new info rather than just moving where existing info is displayed.

 

[healhustler]

Well, at least in my case the Murphy gauges for the genset are mounted on the relocated genset beneath the veranda (aft deck). One cameral would be on the gauges and another at the front service side of the Lugger looking down on the raw water pump, fuel system, belt, siphon, and bilge. In the ER just ahead and beneath the salon, another camera on a fuel-filter vacuum gauge, filters and starboard side of the engine. Another camera on the port side looking down at belts, raw water system, bilge and pump, and the last camera at the rear of the engine looking down at shaft seal and aft. bilge pump. With the price of cameras and monitor systems these days, why not.

My helm mounted oil pressure gauge for the main is not consistent in it's reading, but another oil pressure gauge I found taped up in a mass of wires under the helm was better. At some point, I may use a tube type oil pressure gauge and attach it next to the fuel-filter vacuum gauge already on camera. None of the extra gauges in the plan are duplicated at the helm, but even if they were, I wouldn't mind. My helm is old and in need of an update....gauges there too.

 

[timjet]

The stuff you are considering displaying on your MFD - is it all info that is already available on other gauges? If so, I'd probably lean more towards getting new info rather than just moving where existing info is displayed.

Thanks guys for all your input. FF; is it boat bling, well yes and no. As a pilot I like lots of gauges, but they really should tell you something, right?

Cameras are a great way of monitoring, and cheap. I have two cameras connected to my Ray E90W. One points to engine vacuum gauges and one points to port engine fuel pressure gauge. (I've had some fuel issues). No room for a laptop on the helm so cameras are connected to the Ray MFD.
Eliminates the need for an electric hatch opener as Sunchaser suggested. The admiral no longer has to take the helm while I go below to check gauges, she's much happier.


My thought process on moving data from analog to NMEA 2000 was the ability to set alarms and track trends. For example my Garmin unit would allow me to set an alarm when coolant temp exceeds 190, 10 degrees higher than normal giving me an early warning before the factory installed high temp bell goes off. But I monitor the analog gauges pretty closely and it's unlikely I wouldn't notice a temp gauge rising.

Maretron has a good reputation but the unit Portuguese suggested only works with Yanmar engines. It probably can be modified though.

So I've decided to add Pyro gauges. Hewitt Industries (3" Pyrometers)
Nice big 3" gauges that are easy to read w/o glasses. I already have 3" boost gauges.

Next project is to some how monitor generator temp. Twice I've had the genset overheat due to clogging of the through-hull on the outside of the boat. Generally this happens at 2 am. The last time it happened no alarm went off but the air conditioner was not putting out cold air and I woke up because I was hot. Further investigation found the AC strainer was clogged and the genset exhaust on the outside of the boat was putting out steam. The genset strainer was also clogged and had apparently not yet reached the temp to auto shutoff or set off the alarm. Last month at haul out I had the yard modify the genset through-hull by cutting the screen opening on the outside thus eliminating the little holes and making the opening bigger. This should help eliminate clogging, I still have the strainer screen on the inside of the boat. I won't have to dive the boat again to unclog the genset opening.

 

[jleonard]

While I don't normally run my genset at night, I used to experience raw water clogging until I replaced my thru hull and strainer with oversized units. I think I went from 3/4 inch to 1 1/4.
It has not clogged since.

 

[obthomas]

If you are going to run cameras, why not just display them on a laptop?

My furuno system has an input for a camera, but I'll never use it. Many Cameras are IP addressable with built in web servers. Just browse to the camera and there it is.

This assumes you will always have an internet connection.

 

[BDofMSP]

This assumes you will always have an internet connection.

You just need a local wifi network on boat. It doesn't need to be connected to the internet.

 

[tpbrady]

Kevin,

Have you ever looked at the Lowrance LMF-400 guages for displaying NMEA 2000 engine data? They aren't real expensive and can display just about any data transiting the NMEA 2000 network. I use one to display engine temp, oil pressure, and battery voltage at the upper helm to supplement the idiot lights and alarms.

Tom



Tom

 

[ksanders]

This assumes you will always have an internet connection.

If you have something as simple as a linksys switch, or router and you plug your cameras and laptop into it then you'll be able to access your cameras without having internet.

 

[ksanders]

Kevin,

Have you ever looked at the Lowrance LMF-400 guages for displaying NMEA 2000 engine data? They aren't real expensive and can display just about any data transiting the NMEA 2000 network. I use one to display engine temp, oil pressure, and battery voltage at the upper helm to supplement the idiot lights and alarms.

Tom



Tom

Hello Tom, I have not considered that option, although it it something I'll google. It sounds interesting.

Are you our of Seward, Whittier, Homer or Valdez?

 

[obthomas]

You just need a local wifi network on boat. It doesn't need to be connected to the internet.

Thanks for the clarification. However you are not being completely precise.

I have a hotspot with local wifi to my laptop or my phone and the IP cameras will not work. My phone is also capable of being a hotspot with local wifi and it won't support IP cameras either.

 

[obthomas]

If you have something as simple as a linksys switch, or router and you plug your cameras and laptop into it then you'll be able to access your cameras without having internet.

But you need internet to set it up. I have a hotspot and a linksys or router will not work.

 

[ksanders]

Thanks for the clarification. However you are not being completely precise.

I have a hotspot with local wifi to my laptop or my phone and the IP cameras will not work. My phone is also capable of being a hotspot with local wifi and it won't support IP cameras either.

But you need internet to set it up. I have a hotspot and a linksys or router will not work.

If you are using a wifi hotspot, like at a marina and want to also have a network on your boat, thats doable as well.

Just get a router that can use wifi as the broadband or internet connection. Many of the cradlepoint units will do that.

My solution is that I never use free wifi. I use Mifi from my cellular provider using my shared data plan.

The end result is that I have a wifi hotspot on my boat with my boats name as the SSID. That wifi hotspot gives me access to any devices I have locally on the boat like cameras, or my alarm monitoring system. It also provides internet access.

 

[obthomas]

I have a wifi hotspot on my boat with my boats name as the SSID. That wifi hotspot gives me access to any devices I have locally on the boat like cameras, or my alarm monitoring system. It also provides internet access.

So educate me....I have a Verizon Midi Wifi hotspot on my boat with the name of my boat as the SSID.....I have an IP camera and an wifi printer and neither will commuicate with the hotspot. Both want a wireless router connected by cable to a computer and the internet to set up the IP page. I do not have this router nor a internet connection other than the hotspot. I can't seem to do what you say you are doing.

 

[BDofMSP]

So educate me....I have a Verizon Midi Wifi hotspot on my boat with the name of my boat as the SSID.....I have an IP camera and an wifi printer and neither will commuicate with the hotspot. Both want a wireless router connected by cable to a computer and the internet to set up the IP page. I do not have this router nor a internet connection other than the hotspot. I can't seem to do what you say you are doing.

That seems to be a limitation of the particular camera and printer. I have coworkers that use that Verison hotspot with wireless printers, so I know that it's possible. While I may have been imprecise. my point was simply that Internet access is not required. That hotspot will continue to provide local network routing even if it is out of range of a cellular internet signal.

 

[obthomas]

That hotspot will continue to provide local network routing even if it is out of range of a cellular internet signal.

We disagree. My Verizon Hotspot has no pass through IP addressing and will not communicate with any camera or printer. It may be possible to add a wifi router that can be set up over a wirless conection but I do not have such a router. My hotspot will not act as a router wether in or out of range of a cellular tower.

If you have other more precise information than "friends are doing it" I would very much appreciate any help you can offer. I would like to monitor a couple of IP cameras on my boat. I could make sure my Cat is doing well and watch my firearms. Thanks.

 

[BDofMSP]

If you have other more precise information than "friends are doing it" I would very much appreciate any help you can offer.

I know that they have a variety of models. If you give me the specific model that you have, I can ask around here. I don't personally use one but there are several people that do.

 

[River Cruiser]

Greetings, $650?

It's always nice to see someone with their priorities properly aligned.

 

[ksanders]

So educate me....I have a Verizon Midi Wifi hotspot on my boat with the name of my boat as the SSID.....I have an IP camera and an wifi printer and neither will commuicate with the hotspot. Both want a wireless router connected by cable to a computer and the internet to set up the IP page. I do not have this router nor a internet connection other than the hotspot. I can't seem to do what you say you are doing.

OK, the problem might be in your MIFI hotspot. If it does not allow interdevice communication, and or if it uses IP pass through then you'll probably have a problem.

The IP pass through just means that your laptop will aquire a IP address directly from your carrier. There can be limitations on how many devices, etc... Do not use IP pass through unless you have a specific technical reason for doing so.

I solve these issues by using a router that uses a MIFI as its internet gateway. The router then assigns IP address on its Lan subnet and uses PAT to allow devices to access the internet. Then you have a true LAN on your boat.

One guaranteed for sure way to make this work is to buy a router that can utilize your MIFI as its internet gateway. This can be either from plugging your MIFI directly into the router, if its a USB MIFI, or if its a hotspot only mifi having your router use WIFI as its internet gateway. In this case your router would associate with your MIFI hotspot.

IMHO, and having done this for a very long time, the best, cheapest, easiest to use devices to create a local area network with a cellular gateway are made by cradlepoint, www.cradlepoint.com. I have the model MBR1200 on my boat and the MBR1400 at my home business. While I typically greatly prefer Cisco IOS based products, I really like the Cradlepoint solutions for MIFI access.