Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-16-2017, 07:05 PM   #1
Veteran Member
 
City: Seattle
Country: United States
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 46
Question about LOA, slip-size and dinghy's.

Hey Everyone,

I am currently on a wait list for a 46' slip at Shilshole Marina in Seattle. As my wife and I are going through the process of finding our "perfect boat", one thing that keeps bothering me is making sure that the boat we choose will fit in the slip we get.

My question is really mostly about boats with cockpit davits and dinghy's that hang over the stern. For example, I'm seeing some boats listed as 44' LOA with a dinghy out back. I'm guessing that would likely push it up into the 46' - 48' range depending on if the dinghy is horizontal or vertical? Not quite sure how much length they typically add to the LOA.

From what I understand, this particular marina (Shilshole) comes out and measures the entire length of the boat to make sure it is in compliance.

Does anyone have experience, suggestions or best practices when it comes to this?

Thanks in advance!!
__________________
Advertisement

PNW Jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2017, 07:24 PM   #2
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
Hey Everyone,

I am currently on a wait list for a 46' slip at Shilshole Marina in Seattle. As my wife and I are going through the process of finding our "perfect boat", one thing that keeps bothering me is making sure that the boat we choose will fit in the slip we get.

My question is really mostly about boats with cockpit davits and dinghy's that hang over the stern. For example, I'm seeing some boats listed as 44' LOA with a dinghy out back. I'm guessing that would likely push it up into the 46' - 48' range depending on if the dinghy is horizontal or vertical? Not quite sure how much length they typically add to the LOA.

From what I understand, this particular marina (Shilshole) comes out and measures the entire length of the boat to make sure it is in compliance.

Does anyone have experience, suggestions or best practices when it comes to this?

Thanks in advance!!
The majority of marinas measure the entire length of a boat including bow pulpit, swim platform, dinghy hanging over, anything else. Then they bill by the greater of boat length or slip length. Now, some have allowances for boats to extend beyond the length of the slip and others do not.

I'm sure there are other size slips available in Seattle. Just seems a bit backward to tie one's hands to a slip size, unless there's no other choice.
__________________

BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2017, 07:27 PM   #3
Veteran Member
 
City: Seattle
Country: United States
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
The majority of marinas measure the entire length of a boat including bow pulpit, swim platform, dinghy hanging over, anything else. Then they bill by the greater of boat length or slip length. Now, some have allowances for boats to extend beyond the length of the slip and others do not.

I'm sure there are other size slips available in Seattle. Just seems a bit backward to tie one's hands to a slip size, unless there's no other choice.
That's kind of what I was thinking. The reason for the slip size is that it's a 2 year wait for a 46' slip. However, they say I can go up to a 50' slip, which is only a 1 year wait and keep my place in line.

It's starting to look more and more like I'll have to suck it up and go with a 50' slip. I was just hoping to save the $100 / month extra it'll cost to go up in size.
PNW Jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2017, 07:34 PM   #4
GFC
Guru
 
GFC's Avatar
 
City: Tri Cities, WA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Beachcomber
Vessel Model: Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,660
Jeff, here's a thought--put your name on the 50' slip wait list. Then, if you find your perfect boat will fit into a smaller slip, get the boat. It's usually easier to find someone who is willing to swap with you if you have a bigger slip. More guys get two-footitis than ever go down in size.


Just curious--is this your first boat? A boat the size range you're looking at is a pretty big step for a first boat. I'm not saying it can't be managed but the learning curve for a boat that size is steeper than one that's in the 35'-40' size range.


But then, I'm the one who always says "Buy your second boat first". By that I mean, don't start out with a 'learner' boat then upsize in a year or two because that gets expensive.
__________________
Mike and Tina
Beachcomber 1995 Sea Ray 550 Sedan Bridge
GFC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2017, 07:36 PM   #5
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
That's kind of what I was thinking. The reason for the slip size is that it's a 2 year wait for a 46' slip. However, they say I can go up to a 50' slip, which is only a 1 year wait and keep my place in line.

It's starting to look more and more like I'll have to suck it up and go with a 50' slip. I was just hoping to save the $100 / month extra it'll cost to go up in size.
Just don't let the tail wag the dog.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2017, 07:36 PM   #6
TF Site Team
 
Insequent's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Insequent
Vessel Model: Ocean Alexander 50 Mk I
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,363
When I bought my boat it was at Edmonds Marina, not that far north of Seattle. The slip was grandfathered to the boat for me, but there were not many of those situations still left. I could keep the slip for as long as I wanted but could not pass it on if I sold the boat. You might get lucky and find a similar situation. At the time the wait list for slips of that length was 10 years. The longer the slip, the fewer there are in the PNW and the longer you will need to wait.
__________________
Brian
Insequent is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 01:40 PM   #7
Member
 
LouisG's Avatar
 
City: Seattle
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Merlin
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 21
I was on the waiting list at Shilshole and they were very flexible with allowing me to move slip lengths if I needed and keep my place in line.

I ended up keeping my boat at Elliott Bay Marina for now but am still on the list in case I want to move it next summer.

My Nordic Tug 32 measures out at 38' 4" from anchor to dingy. Shilshole is very strict with length so I would require a 40' there. EBM is less picky. They give you 1' of wiggle room. So I'm currently paying for a 38' there.

I guess what I learned is the only way to know how long a boat truly is is to measure it.
LouisG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 03:18 PM   #8
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,664
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
My question is really mostly about boats with cockpit davits and dinghy's that hang over the stern. For example, I'm seeing some boats listed as 44' LOA with a dinghy out back. I'm guessing that would likely push it up into the 46' - 48' range depending on if the dinghy is horizontal or vertical? Not quite sure how much length they typically add to the LOA.

From what I understand, this particular marina (Shilshole) comes out and measures the entire length of the boat to make sure it is in compliance.

Does anyone have experience, suggestions or best practices when it comes to this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
The majority of marinas measure the entire length of a boat including bow pulpit, swim platform, dinghy hanging over, anything else. Then they bill by the greater of boat length or slip length. Now, some have allowances for boats to extend beyond the length of the slip and others do not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
That's kind of what I was thinking. The reason for the slip size is that it's a 2 year wait for a 46' slip. However, they say I can go up to a 50' slip, which is only a 1 year wait and keep my place in line.

It's starting to look more and more like I'll have to suck it up and go with a 50' slip. I was just hoping to save the $100 / month extra it'll cost to go up in size.

What B said.

And yes, it depends on the place. We are nominally 42, actually 44 counting the pulpit, even more actually 46+ counting the swim platform we added... and really, no kidding closer to 48+ with the dinghy cantilever-mounted
off the aft end.

Without regard to nominal lengths, it becomes important sometimes to give real LOA especially when arranging transient slips -- so the dockmaster assigns a slip that will really work. We were assigned a 50' space on the museum face dock once, and I really did end up with only about 1' to spare at each end, after we shoehorned ourselves into the slot (lots of spring line work). Inches mattered during that maneuver, and our pulpit was often hanging over the cockpit of the boat just ahead of us. Sometimes "tight" is all the dockmaster has to offer....

Get in line for the 50' slip. You can probably more easily trade downward should that become necessary.

But if you get a smaller boat, you'll also likely get two-foot-itis soon enough, and then you'll have to work a bit to get a 50' slip if that happens.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 04:16 PM   #9
Guru
 
City: North Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,385
Quote:
Originally Posted by LouisG View Post
............ the only way to know how long a boat truly is is to measure it.
This is correct. And the fact that a boat has "32" or "39" in its model number has little to do with the actual length of the boat. My boat was a "28" when it was built and that's what is listed on the documentation. Later, they changed the model to "31" but it was the same boat.

Each marina will have its own policies on boat length, slip length, etc. And in some cases, negotiation is possible.
rwidman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 04:21 PM   #10
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesK View Post
This is correct. And the fact that a boat has "32" or "39" in its model number has little to do with the actual length of the boat. My boat was a "28" when it was built and that's what is listed on the documentation. Later, they changed the model to "31" but it was the same boat.

Each marina will have its own policies on boat length, slip length, etc. And in some cases, negotiation is possible.
Most new boats do publish an LOA including pulpit and platform. They may also publish a deck length. The published LOA has always been accurate in our cases except a RIB that is slightly wider than the swim platform so we add that distance of 4".
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 04:42 PM   #11
Guru
 
kthoennes's Avatar
 
City: Sioux Falls, South Dakota
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Xanadu
Vessel Model: Mainship 37 Motor Yacht
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,038
Yep, seems every marina has its own policy or habits. Ours allows your boat to extend 10% beyond the slip length, total. Our slip is 42. Nominal boat length 37, with swim step and bow pulpit we're right at 41, so we can stick out about 4 more feet - just enough to moor the dingy to the swim step.
kthoennes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 04:42 PM   #12
Guru
 
Bigsfish's Avatar
 
City: Miami River
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Gotcha
Vessel Model: Grand Banks. Heritage. 54
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,593
Funny story, years ago I was tied up at the Bimini Big Game club. I registered as a 34 which was listed on my legal paperwork. Walking fiend the dock the dock master called me over and asked me took at the Bertram ties next to me as asked me which war larger. Certainly my boat was slightly longer perhaps by a foot or so. Dock master informed me the Bertram registered as a 38 foot boat. I told him that owner got screwed by the manufacturer. End of story.
Bigsfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 05:07 PM   #13
Guru
 
dhays's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 8,433
Yup. I own a North Pacific 43. The LOA is 44'6".
Most of the time I just call it a 43' boat. However, when inquiring about transient moorage, I tell them my LOA is 45' total.
__________________
Regards,

Dave
SPOT page
dhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 06:26 PM   #14
Guru
 
City: North Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,385
Mine is 31' long when I'm bragging, 28' long when I'm paying for dockage.


I pay for 30' at my home marina. Regardless of the boat's length, all the slips are the same length. One guy may be paying for a 35' boat, the guy in the next slip may be paying for a 25' boat.
rwidman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 06:52 PM   #15
Veteran Member
 
City: Seattle
Country: United States
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 46
More great feedback here, thanks everyone!

It's a bit frustrating, because I'm coming to learn that there is really no way to tell what the actual LOA of a boat is going to be without physically measuring it. The marina we are planning on calling 'home' has a reputation for being sticklers for going with the full LOA including anchor, swim platform and dinghy.

The boats we are looking at mostly seem to be in the 44-46' range, so although I put my name on a list for a 46' slip, I don't see any way that a boat that is listed with an LOA of even 44' will fit in a slip of that size once you figure in a dinghy on the back.
PNW Jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 06:58 PM   #16
Guru
 
dhays's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 8,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
More great feedback here, thanks everyone!

It's a bit frustrating, because I'm coming to learn that there is really no way to tell what the actual LOA of a boat is going to be without physically measuring it. The marina we are planning on calling 'home' has a reputation for being sticklers for going with the full LOA including anchor, swim platform and dinghy.

The boats we are looking at mostly seem to be in the 44-46' range, so although I put my name on a list for a 46' slip, I don't see any way that a boat that is listed with an LOA of even 44' will fit in a slip of that size once you figure in a dinghy on the back.
The LOA should be information that is pretty easy to find in a boat listing or other reference.
__________________
Regards,

Dave
SPOT page
dhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 07:03 PM   #17
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
More great feedback here, thanks everyone!

It's a bit frustrating, because I'm coming to learn that there is really no way to tell what the actual LOA of a boat is going to be without physically measuring it. The marina we are planning on calling 'home' has a reputation for being sticklers for going with the full LOA including anchor, swim platform and dinghy.

The boats we are looking at mostly seem to be in the 44-46' range, so although I put my name on a list for a 46' slip, I don't see any way that a boat that is listed with an LOA of even 44' will fit in a slip of that size once you figure in a dinghy on the back.
It all depends on the boat and if it's a boat built by a builder still in business it's fairly simple to get measurements. They can at minimum give you the deck length and you just add the pulpit and platform if they weren't factory installed. The main thing in buying is to ignore nomenclatures and look at true LOA's and deck lengths.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 07:31 PM   #18
Veteran Member
 
City: Seattle
Country: United States
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhays View Post
The LOA should be information that is pretty easy to find in a boat listing or other reference.
Maybe I'm over-complicating this? I see LOA listed on almost every listing, however I've been questioning whether it would take into account swim platform, dinghy davits + dinghy (assuming the dinghy is located on davits off the stern).

If most of these listed LOA lengths actually INCLUDE everything that particular boat has on it, things would be a lot simpler. Would you expect that to be the case?
PNW Jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 08:04 PM   #19
Guru
 
dhays's Avatar
 
City: Gig Harbor
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 8,433
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW Jeff View Post
Maybe I'm over-complicating this? I see LOA listed on almost every listing, however I've been questioning whether it would take into account swim platform, dinghy davits + dinghy (assuming the dinghy is located on davits off the stern).

If most of these listed LOA lengths actually INCLUDE everything that particular boat has on it, things would be a lot simpler. Would you expect that to be the case?
The LOA in general will include the hull, swim platform, and bow pulpit. I wouldn't expect it to include a dinghy on davits. Easy to just add an arbitrary 2-3' to account for that depending on the type of davit arrangement.
__________________
Regards,

Dave
SPOT page
dhays is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2017, 08:16 PM   #20
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 17,464
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhays View Post
The LOA in general will include the hull, swim platform, and bow pulpit. I wouldn't expect it to include a dinghy on davits. Easy to just add an arbitrary 2-3' to account for that depending on the type of davit arrangement.
Now, LOA on listings can be wrong. Be suspicious when it's a rounded number. However, the builder has accurate numbers available and most of the LOA's shown in listings are correct. To those facing size restrictions or wanting to be sure, then you'll have to confirm and verify.
__________________

BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012
×