Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-15-2019, 08:30 AM   #1
Member
 
City: gahanna, ohio
Country: USA
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 16
Marinas ...Boat sizes

Good Day all,
I am confused.
We have been looking for a single engine trawler and are trying to figure
all of the potential costs.
We just returned home from south Carolina where we looked at a 35ft sundeck trawler. it says 35 right on it but when you measure it comes up to 42 feet long with the bow pulpit and swim platform.
He strongly stated that in 6,000 miles he had never been charged for over 35 feet at any marina.
Question?
I know he is trying to sell a boat but everything I have read a lot of marina's
charge a premium over 40 ft. Do marina's charge for LOA or waterline length?
as far as Marina's 35ft sounds a whole lot better than 42 feet plus for the pocketbook.
Is there any sort of a standard on boat lengths and marina fees for them? That is probably a dumb question.
Thanks in advance for your knowledgeable advice.
Gary
__________________
Advertisement

gfr51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 08:53 AM   #2
Enigma
 
RT Firefly's Avatar
 
City: Slicker?
Country: Bumpkin?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 12,622
Greetings,
Mr. gf. There are NO dumb questions (mostly). It is MY understanding that if the model of boat you have is 35' that's the size you get charged for. Now, perhaps, if one was staying longer term at a marina or on a face dock someone may get out a measuring tape but I've never experienced it...yet.
__________________

__________________
RTF
RT Firefly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:00 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Bkay's Avatar
 
City: Reedville, VA
Country: United States
Vessel Model: Beals Island lobster boat
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 308
I agree with RT somewhat. If your boat is called "Majestic 35" and you tell the dockmaster that you are 35', then frequently that's what you'll be charged.

If you pull into a 36' slip and stick out into the fairway - you are more likely to be charged more. And if you ask the dockmaster, he will likely say "we charge on LOA - if you can retract something, you won't get charged for that length. But if it's fixed, you will."

Also, some places will charge on the slip length and they won't be even 5' increments. So they may say "you won't fit in our 34' slip, so I've got a 37' and 42' available". I have not experienced that a lot except for busy times when the dock fills up.

How's that for failing to answer your question? Although I've never seen anyone charged on waterline length - it's usually LOA but sometimes you can get away with LOD.
Bkay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:11 AM   #4
Guru
 
Russell Clifton's Avatar
 
City: Anacortes Wa.
Country: usa
Vessel Name: Sea Fever
Vessel Model: Defever 49 RPH
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 578
Seems like every marina in the Northwest will ask you for the overall length of the boat. Last winter in Anacortes they actually walked all the docks with a tape measure and checked the actual length of all the boats.
Russell Clifton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:21 AM   #5
Veteran Member
 
City: Green Cove Springs
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Nomad
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 55
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 87
We are 60+' LOA. But our model number is 55'. So to every marina we visit we are 55'. I've never had a marina break out a tape measure or dispute the length- if that happens we will leave immediately.

I view it as we have 55' of living space. I'm not paying more for bow pulpit and swim platform. Especially when I see a 45' cat with triple the living space come in and pay less than us.
Commander Nomad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:23 AM   #6
Guru
 
Woodland Hills's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alzero
Vessel Model: Hatteras 63' CPMY
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 799
We have a 63’ lwl, but we never pay on lwl at the marina. It is always on loa: 70’. You tell them you have a 63’ Hatteras and they ask you how long it is.
Woodland Hills is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:30 AM   #7
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: AICW
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 19,836
I say my model size which is a half foot longer than LOD, and I would say out of a 100 East Coast marinas, all but maybe 5 accepted my word on that length.
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:40 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
MV Wanderlust's Avatar
 
City: Lakeland
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderlust
Vessel Model: 1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52'
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 450
We've always been charged for LOA, whether at our home port, a transient slip, or on a wall somewhere.
MV Wanderlust is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:43 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
City: tallahassee
Country: United States
Vessel Model: 1979 Mainship 34
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 382
Only time i've experienced this is on my smaller center consoles being dry rack stored.
Mrwesson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:53 AM   #10
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,000
Honest people will divulge what’s asked of them.
Any other response is cheating.
I have a 30’ boat in a 30’ slip.
I hate it when overhangs are not observed by the marina’s. If boaters are gleeful for “getting away w something” that’s between them and the marina. But when I need to watch my step because of all the bow pulpits over the walkway it makes me a bit mad. And what’s worse is the boats swim platforms and dinghies sticking out (sometimes 3-4’) into a narrow fairway I’m .. very unhappy.

In our marina they police the walkways quite well but totally (it seems) ignore the fairways. I consider the fairway paid for by the tenant and no one individual has any right to it. And I have no idea if they charge the guys for their overhang into the fairway.

But it’s the marina’s call. And I can see why they welcome overhanging into the fairway ... if they do what they say they do. That is charge overhanging boats for the space. Their bottom line goes up. But they shouldn’t do that because it’s already paid for by the other tenants. It’s not honest business. It’s criminal ... stealing.

And then there’s outboards kicked up 5’ out into the fairway ......
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 09:58 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Bkay's Avatar
 
City: Reedville, VA
Country: United States
Vessel Model: Beals Island lobster boat
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 308
This is not a totally unrelated comment, but a local waterman made this observation - Every boat has 3 lengths: the one you tell fisheries and tax assessors, the one you tell the railway, and the one you tell girls at the bar.

Well, in hindsight, maybe it is totally unrelated. Sorry.
Bkay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:09 AM   #12
Veteran Member
 
City: Green Cove Springs
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Nomad
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 55
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad Willy View Post
Honest people will divulge what’s asked of them.
Any other response is cheating.
I have a 30’ boat in a 30’ slip.
I hate it when overhangs are not observed by the marina’s. If boaters are gleeful for “getting away w something” that’s between them and the marina. But when I need to watch my step because of all the bow pulpits over the walkway it makes me a bit mad. And what’s worse is the boats swim platforms and dinghies sticking out (sometimes 3-4’) into a narrow fairway I’m .. very unhappy.

In our marina they police the walkways quite well but totally (it seems) ignore the fairways. I consider the fairway paid for by the tenant and no one individual has any right to it. And I have no idea if they charge the guys for their overhang into the fairway.

But it’s the marina’s call. And I can see why they welcome overhanging into the fairway ... if they do what they say they do. That is charge overhanging boats for the space. Their bottom line goes up. But they shouldn’t do that because it’s already paid for by the other tenants. It’s not honest business. It’s criminal ... stealing.

And then there’s outboards kicked up 5’ out into the fairway ......
That's a great moral high ground when you have no overhangs. For the rest of us, when LOA is significantly more than usable space, that concept rubs raw.

If random persons' dinghy hangs off 5' over their stern, no I don't think you should pay for that. Your usable space, the living space that concerns number if persons on board, power requirements, etc, is far more important than LOA.

For an old school CCA rules sailboat, where the 45' LOA is 10' more than the usable LWL living space, should they pay more than a 42' Sea Ray Condo boat? I don't think so.
,
Commander Nomad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:24 AM   #13
TF Site Team
 
Larry M's Avatar
 
City: JAX, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hobo
Vessel Model: Krogen 42-120
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,800
In California we were measured a couple of times. On the Washington Coast, they went by documented length, in Florida it’s a mixed bag but more often than not it’s by the slip length and wants available.
Larry M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:28 AM   #14
DDW
Guru
 
City: San Francisco
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 860
It depends on the marina. I've been charged for stated LOD (Length On Deck) sometimes, and extreme overall length (LOA) sometimes. For a transient berth for the night, more likely the former, for an extended monthly stay more likely the latter. If they didn't measure and charge for actual length, then everyone would add some graphics to the side of their boat saying "Mini 19 Trawler" or something like that. "Hey it's 19' - just look at the label!" The Coast Guard has stepped up a bit in this regard and insisted that manufacturers include the permanently attached swim platforms in stated length. That's why my boat (AT34) is now called an AT365.

The AT34 is nominally 34' on deck. Actually 36.5' with the swim platform permanently bonded onto every one they've sold. Add another foot for the anchor and sprit. And at least 2.5 more for the dinghy hanging off the back. Now I'm 40'. In a 34' slip I'll be hanging into the fairway 6 feet.

Some marina's will charge for the larger of the boat length of slip length. Some will allow a few feet longer than the slip, some none. Yes, Cap Sante in Anacortes will measure your boat and charge you for the extreme length, allowing zero hanging out into the fairway. More lenient a the daily rate.

Most marinas charge by the foot for transient, but some value closer to square footage for permanent slips. A 40' boat doesn't take twice the space of a 20' boat, it takes 4 times the space: it is twice as long and twice as wide.

I've found these comments to be true on both coasts, and in Canada and the Caribbean. The cheapest wharfage I've seen was in Newfoundland, $60 for the year.
DDW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:36 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
guy with a boat's Avatar
 
City: Southern California
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Northern Sky
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 63
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander Nomad View Post
That's a great moral high ground when you have no overhangs. For the rest of us, when LOA is significantly more than usable space, that concept rubs raw.

If random persons' dinghy hangs off 5' over their stern, no I don't think you should pay for that. Your usable space, the living space that concerns number if persons on board, power requirements, etc, is far more important than LOA.

For an old school CCA rules sailboat, where the 45' LOA is 10' more than the usable LWL living space, should they pay more than a 42' Sea Ray Condo boat? I don't think so.
,
The marina is in the business of renting space. How much living area you have shouldn’t be of concern to them. The relevant dimensions are those which determine how much of their dock you need. Space you occupy can’t be rented to someone else so it is charged to you. It doesn’t much matter if that space is bow pulpit, hanging dinghy, or living area. It still occupies marina space and is chargeable.
guy with a boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:46 AM   #16
Veteran Member
 
City: Green Cove Springs
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Nomad
Vessel Model: Chris Craft Commander 55
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 87
Right. Im taking up a 70' slip. By your reasoning I should be charged for 70'.

I guarantee if you come in to a slip that is 10' longer than your LOA and you are charged for the slip length rather than your vessel length you won't be happy.

A 40' boat in a 50' slip will be very upset if they are charged for 50'.
Commander Nomad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:46 AM   #17
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,000
Thank you guy,

And why shouldn’t we all be on the great moral high ground.
Everyone else is cheating.
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:52 AM   #18
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander Nomad View Post
Right. Im taking up a 70' slip. By your reasoning I should be charged for 70'.

I guarantee if you come in to a slip that is 10' longer than your LOA and you are charged for the slip length is your vessel length you won't be happy.

A 40' boat in a 50' slip will be very upset if they are charged for 50'.
In Alaska I had a 50’ slip for some time for my 30’ boat. And I was charged for 50’ but it was so dirt cheap I was very happy. $575 a year.

One should be charged and pay for the length of their boat .. dinghies, swim steps and anchor infrastructure and any slip length over your OAL included.

A 60’ boat in a 70’ slip is using the whole space wether the boat is taking it all up or not. They can’t rent the other 10’.
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 10:58 AM   #19
Guru
 
Woodland Hills's Avatar
 
City: Jacksonville
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alzero
Vessel Model: Hatteras 63' CPMY
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 799
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commander Nomad View Post
That's a great moral high ground when you have no overhangs. For the rest of us, when LOA is significantly more than usable space, that concept rubs raw.

If random persons' dinghy hangs off 5' over their stern, no I don't think you should pay for that. Your usable space, the living space that concerns number if persons on board, power requirements, etc, is far more important than LOA.

For an old school CCA rules sailboat, where the 45' LOA is 10' more than the usable LWL living space, should they pay more than a 42' Sea Ray Condo boat? I don't think so.
,
I cannot believe you are being serious! If you have a sailboat that has a lwl of 35’ and a 8’ boomkin and 12’ bowsprit and my marina has 100’ of dock from which to earn a living renting space am I supposed to give away 20’ of income every night because you think anyone else cares about how much living space you have?

As a marina owner you support your family by the linear feet of your dock space that you can rent: if my dock is 100’ long and it is full for the night, I’d better be getting paid for 100’ times the rate per foot. Why should anyone else care to subsidize your purchase of a long boat with no living space by giving you free rent?

Where does this sense of entitlement come from? If you are so envious of boaters who made wiser purchases than you, such as the Sea Ray example you give, you can always trade up to something that won’t make you try to cheat people out of their rightful income. If you wanted a short boat with a lot of room, you should have bought one, not try whine about how your own boat has so little room inside for its oal that you expect others to give you free money in compensation for your own mistake.
Woodland Hills is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2019, 11:00 AM   #20
Guru
 
Giggitoni's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo, California
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Mahalo Moi
Vessel Model: 1986 Grand Banks 42 Classic
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,756
The length and width of marina slips are usually proportionate. Therefore, don’t make the mistake of getting a slip that is too short because the width might be too narrow. I would rather pay for a 45-foot slip for my 42-foot boat than “thread the needle” every time I dock.
__________________

__________________
Ray
"Mahalo Moi"
1986 GB-42 Classic
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑβΕ
Giggitoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012
×