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Old 02-11-2016, 01:53 PM   #61
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Look into a Marine Trader 34. Short, stout, cheap, roomy and plentiful. These people switched from a cruising sailboat to trawler and seem to have it well worked out. Your budget, maybe not so much...

The Trawler Beach House
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Old 02-11-2016, 02:27 PM   #62
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Look into a Marine Trader 34. Short, stout, cheap, roomy and plentiful. These people switched from a cruising sailboat to trawler and seem to have it well worked out. Your budget, maybe not so much...

The Trawler Beach House
A quick look at them shows they look like they fit my price point. Thanks for the info. I'll look at them more in depth.
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Old 02-11-2016, 02:39 PM   #63
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Regarding your post above about sending engine oil out for inspection, wouldn't a magnet do the same thing? I'm guessing you'd be looking for coolant/water in the oil (milky oil) or metal shavings.
Short answer-NO. You're looking for things that wouldn't be detectable just using a magnet.
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Old 02-11-2016, 02:39 PM   #64
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Is it really that bad?

Depends.

On how you feel about it.



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Old 02-11-2016, 02:45 PM   #65
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As to the ads for boats on the lower end of the price scale. Lazy owners, lazy brokers. I worry about the lazy owner, thinking perhaps he treated the boat the same way all it's life. As to the broker, if he has a million dollar boat, a $500k boat and a $30k boat many are not going to work the $30k boat. They'll just respond to inquiries. It's a matter of spending the time and effort where the larger commission is.

One thing that doesn't get mentioned but ran across my mind yesterday talking about real estate brokers. When you have a boat or house to sell, look for someone whose business is built on that size and price range to broker it.
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Old 02-11-2016, 02:46 PM   #66
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it sounds to me that you don't have much experience sailing. In that case avoid a sail boat. Most spend half their time under power anyway. A small single diesel powerboat would be my recommendation. Look long and hard for one that was well loved by someone not able to use it any more. They do exist and if everything is sparkling including the engine space that is a good clue .
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Old 02-11-2016, 03:33 PM   #67
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syd - I recommend you go to the search feature and ask one to three word "questions" about ALL you would like to learn. It is obvious your learning curve for pleasure boating is in the straight-up angle. Read all you can in forums as well as asking questions to Google in general. IMO - you have a lot of reading to catch up on in order to ease your boat-search and to make sure your boat choice becomes a boat you can live with... and, then, learn to love! - Best Luck! - Art
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Old 02-11-2016, 04:23 PM   #68
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Scurvy-yard-dog,

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We bought our sailboat new in 2006. It is 43 foot long and we have traveled all through the Caribbean and the Bahamas. Our engine now has 1100 hours and burns about 1.5 gal an hour and pushes the boat at 8 -.8.5 on flat water. We could get it down to a gallon an hour or less if we slowed down to 7 - 7.5 knots.

I figure that the boat will cost on average $1000/month, on average. permanent dockage $250/month on the Chesapeake. Insurance, $140/month. Electricity at the dock, $30 - $40 per month. The other $500 or so is money you have to set aside for big things that break.

A gallon of bottom paint can run more than $200/gallon. Our boat takes three gallons every two years. Almost any minor issue will cost you money and not infrequently a boat unit. (boat= break out another thou). So, while I go for months and months without spending the allocated $1000, I have to set money aside so that I have it when I need it.

As far as boat life, you will find that you will spend what you have. I have learned that folks tend to end up with folks who spend similar amounts of money. Some folks go to the bars and restaurants every night, other don't. Some never fix anything on their boat and others polish every screw.

A serviceable set of cruising sells for our boat would cost $6- $10,000, depending on how fancy you get. These sails could last you 15 - 20 years with care. Of course, they will need occasional mending and new sacrificial cloth. Last sacrificial cloth mounted our our boat ran about $600.

Others will have different figures depending on the size and age of their boat. We are looking to move to a trawler because of the room and we are most likely done with bluewater sailing. I expect to burn 5 gals an hour at trawler speed and to spend a bit more on boat maintenance. Just think about servicing two engines every 100 hours or so. We would often go a year and never put 100 hours on the boat, or genset.

Good luck
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Old 02-11-2016, 04:53 PM   #69
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Regarding your post above about sending engine oil out for inspection, wouldn't a magnet do the same thing? I'm guessing you'd be looking for coolant/water in the oil (milky oil) or metal shavings.

Is it possible to run on one engine? I'm guessing it is and would be great in the case of one engine failing but is it advisable for fuel conservation?
No a magnet will not do the same thing. I've attached an older analysis report so you can see. Different parts of the engine have different metals and they can usually see what the wear is..clutch..bearing..etc besides how much water or coolant there is. good thing to know, especially if you do them periodically you can see something happening long before you're calling for a tow.

yes you an run on one engine, your steering may be a bit affected, but sure.

EDIT: you'll see in the report, they saw a clutch being worn in the main trans, and the smaller wing engine (backup only), even thou its 10 years old, its still being broken in (only had 20 hours actually) among other things
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Oil analysis.pdf (1.21 MB, 21 views)
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Old 02-11-2016, 05:26 PM   #70
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it sounds to me that you don't have much experience sailing. In that case avoid a sail boat. Most spend half their time under power anyway. A small single diesel powerboat would be my recommendation. Look long and hard for one that was well loved by someone not able to use it any more. They do exist and if everything is sparkling including the engine space that is a good clue .
I have zero experience and am looking for something that I can live on full time. You bring up a good point about somebody unable to use or enjoy the boat anymore and has a good maintenance record. That's the kind I would look for anyway, whether it be a boat, truck or whatever. I'm looking for a boat owned by that little old lady that just drove it to church on Sundays.
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Old 02-11-2016, 05:47 PM   #71
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I have zero experience and am looking for something that I can live on full time. You bring up a good point about somebody unable to use or enjoy the boat anymore and has a good maintenance record. That's the kind I would look for anyway, whether it be a boat, truck or whatever. I'm looking for a boat owned by that little old lady that just drove it to church on Sundays.
Over the decades we've found boats you describe. There are/is way[s] to qualify a boat before ever going to see it... right over the phone or via email. Then, once a boat seems to maybe be one that fills your criteria... go forth and review same. If it taint the one to purchase be not afraid to walk away. There is one waiting for you two to meet.

In "old-salt" world of marine doings: When the boat finds you, you will know it's a correct match. - Or something like that - LOL
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Old 02-11-2016, 10:04 PM   #72
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Scurvy-yard-dog,

B
We bought our sailboat new in 2006. It is 43 foot long and we have traveled all through the Caribbean and the Bahamas. Our engine now has 1100 hours and burns about 1.5 gal an hour and pushes the boat at 8 -.8.5 on flat water. We could get it down to a gallon an hour or less if we slowed down to 7 - 7.5 knots.

I figure that the boat will cost on average $1000/month, on average. permanent dockage $250/month on the Chesapeake. Insurance, $140/month. Electricity at the dock, $30 - $40 per month. The other $500 or so is money you have to set aside for big things that break.

A gallon of bottom paint can run more than $200/gallon. Our boat takes three gallons every two years. Almost any minor issue will cost you money and not infrequently a boat unit. (boat= break out another thou). So, while I go for months and months without spending the allocated $1000, I have to set money aside so that I have it when I need it.

As far as boat life, you will find that you will spend what you have. I have learned that folks tend to end up with folks who spend similar amounts of money. Some folks go to the bars and restaurants every night, other don't. Some never fix anything on their boat and others polish every screw.

A serviceable set of cruising sells for our boat would cost $6- $10,000, depending on how fancy you get. These sails could last you 15 - 20 years with care. Of course, they will need occasional mending and new sacrificial cloth. Last sacrificial cloth mounted our our boat ran about $600.

Others will have different figures depending on the size and age of their boat. We are looking to move to a trawler because of the room and we are most likely done with bluewater sailing. I expect to burn 5 gals an hour at trawler speed and to spend a bit more on boat maintenance. Just think about servicing two engines every 100 hours or so. We would often go a year and never put 100 hours on the boat, or genset.

Good luck
This is what I like to hear, Gordon. A lot of people seem to be doing it on $1k or less per month.

I'm willing to invest about $50k into this and what I don't spend on the boat will be put back for unforeseen expenses (emergency fund). If I can find a decent boat in the $20k to $30k range, I'll be happy as long as I don't have to immediately sink my emergency fund into the boat to make it safe and functional.

I like the idea of the trawler but am not 100% sold on it yet. I think I can probably get a boat in better shape for my money with a sailboat as opposed to a powerboat. I'm looking in the 32' to 40' range on motor-sailers and think I'd be comfortable with that size although a 40' boat may be a bit big to learn sailing on but I don't have the money to throw at a lesser 'beginner' boat to turn around and unload it at a loss and then purchase a larger boat. The learning curve may be steep but I'm always up for a challenge.

Since I have a house to sell, I'm not in any real hurry so I have time to read up, look things over and maybe do some local sailing. Missouri has some pretty large lakes with active sailboat communities on them. All I need is some warm weather.

Again, thanks.
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Old 02-11-2016, 10:12 PM   #73
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No a magnet will not do the same thing. I've attached an older analysis report so you can see. Different parts of the engine have different metals and they can usually see what the wear is..clutch..bearing..etc besides how much water or coolant there is. good thing to know, especially if you do them periodically you can see something happening long before you're calling for a tow.

yes you an run on one engine, your steering may be a bit affected, but sure.

EDIT: you'll see in the report, they saw a clutch being worn in the main trans, and the smaller wing engine (backup only), even thou its 10 years old, its still being broken in (only had 20 hours actually) among other things
Cool. The transmission part is what really concerns me. I could refurbish an engine but have never been inside of a transmission. I just spent $2300 having the tranny in a jeep grand cherokee rebuilt so I could only imagine the cost involved in rebuilding a marine tranny.
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Old 02-11-2016, 11:36 PM   #74
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Cool. The transmission part is what really concerns me. I could refurbish an engine but have never been inside of a transmission. I just spent $2300 having the tranny in a jeep grand cherokee rebuilt so I could only imagine the cost involved in rebuilding a marine tranny.
In a good shop with truthful techs - about the same $$$
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Old 02-17-2016, 01:42 PM   #75
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My only experience as a boat operator is with sailboats, dinghy to 40 feet. My experience as the owner is with sailboats 36-40 feet. Costs will vary greatly depending on where you cruising grounds are.

I think that $1k a month is wishful thinking. Moorage costs in my area are typically $7-10 per foot. Add to that taxes, insurance, maintenance, utilities and you start to get close to that $1k figure. However, older boats have more things break. That costs money, even in materials.

Also, FWIW, I saw at least one person mention that there would be little difference in fuel cost between sail and power. I doubt that. On my 40' sailboat with a Yanmar 56hp engine, I burn under 1g/hr at 7knots. On my 36' my fuel burn was only .75g/hr at 6 knots. I don't know of many (any?) trawlers that can match that fuel efficiency.

So not to rain on your parade, but when you here folks talk about a boat being "a hole in the water you pour money into", they aren't far from the truth.
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Old 02-17-2016, 01:49 PM   #76
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I think I can match your fuel economy...with my generator...at idle...

Yes I agree with you also. I think ft for ft a sailboat will be more economical to run as a whole. That includes fuel economy.
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Old 02-17-2016, 01:58 PM   #77
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So not to rain on your parade, but when you here folks talk about a boat being "a hole in the water you pour money into", they aren't far from the truth.
Thanks Dhays.... I'm already pouring money into vehicles and a home so I'll really just be redirecting the funds. I don't really consider repairs as living expenses. How much do you spend on fuel a month for your sailboat and do you live on it?


PS.... I've found slips for a 36' boat in SW Florida for under $500 a month ($11 a foot) plus $35 a month of for electricity. Living on the hook is free isn't it?
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Old 02-17-2016, 02:10 PM   #78
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Here's a whole list of people doing it and most are couples. Subtract a little for a single guy like me that that doesn't mind cooking (I'm actually a pretty darn good cook), doesn't smoke (tobacco products are expensive) and very rarely drinks alcohol.

I still have part of a 6-pak of beer in the fridge from last summer.

https://www.google.com/#q=Living+on+...1000+per+month
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Old 02-17-2016, 02:39 PM   #79
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Thanks Dhays.... I'm already pouring money into vehicles and a home so I'll really just be redirecting the funds. I don't really consider repairs as living expenses. How much do you spend on fuel a month for your sailboat and do you live on it?


PS.... I've found slips for a 36' boat in SW Florida for under $500 a month ($11 a foot) plus $35 a month of for electricity. Living on the hook is free isn't it?
I have never lived on any of my boats. However, my 36' sailboat was used by the PO as his and his daughter's only home for a number of years.

I spend very little on fuel. My boat is used on the weekends and for vacations. A couple weeks ago it was used as a floating hotel when I had to attend a meeting. 4 hours motorsailing each way and a cheep dock at a Yacht Clubs reciprocal dock. So my situation is going to be very different than yours.

If you are anchored in some anchorage, you don't have to pay. However, unless you have a very good solar or wind generation, your utilities cost has now because fuel costs as you run your generator. I have no experience with that. At anchor, you also will need to likely run your dinghy into shore to buy supplies. From my experience up here, the stores within walking distance of a dock tend to be more expensive than the local supermarket you drive to. Again, I know nothing of the cruising areas in the SE.

I don't want to discourage you and probably $1k/month can be done. However, I am fiscally cautious and think that if something can go wrong, it probably will. If I was you, I would try and pencil out all of your expected costs, get them as close as you can, then add 50% for the unexpected.
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Old 02-17-2016, 02:54 PM   #80
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A number of years ago, my family and I went cruising one summer on our Trawler. At the end of the summer we calculated that we spent about $100 per day while "actively" cruising.

Diesel was about a buck a gallon at that time and fuel was a minor part of our expenses. We rarely anchored out, usually tied up to locks and sometimes marinas (especially with restaurants) and went to restaurants (especially with docks).

We could have done the trip in a sailboat but every one we looked at was like a cave. The trawler allowed a nice view out the large windows that was not possible in a sailboat.
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