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Old 03-22-2016, 01:00 PM   #41
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Think I dove her 16 times over 4 or 5 years.
You're obviously a technical diver. So what gas mixes did you use and I assume you switched mixtures when descending that deep?
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Old 03-22-2016, 01:40 PM   #42
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You're obviously a technical diver. So what gas mixes did you use and I assume you switched mixtures when descending that deep?
When I did it open circuit (scuba tanks) it was with trimix;

Oxygen / Helium / Nitrogen

16/50/34 surface to bottom back to 120'
32/20/48 120' to 40'
70/0/30 40' to surface

Most of the dives were with a rebreather where the mixture was 16/50/34. Oxygen level was increased on ascent reducing the Helium and Nitrogen. From 15' to the surface it was 100% Oxygen.

Ted
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Old 03-22-2016, 06:23 PM   #43
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Boy, I'm sure that was a fascinating experience, but I'm not that brave anymore. I worked for my father's marine construction company to get through college, almost all shallow coastal stuff, pilings, power plant intakes, that kind of thing. We used Desco helmets (we called them "Desco pots" because you could bang those things on rocks and girders and intake racks and concrete walls and beat the daylights out of them, tough as cannonballs). I remember my one deepest dive though, to the mouth of an intake pipe at a hydroelectric station in upstate New York. It was an easy dive, piled on the lead and just walked the top of the inclined 36" pipe all the way down to the end, wrapped a cable and shackle around a log stuck on the intake grate and came back up, but it was around 120 feet (on plain air). We dove in the dark all the time so it wasn't that, and even aside from the thermoclines, there was just something dense about the water that deep. Felt psychologically very different. No thanks.
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Old 03-22-2016, 10:00 PM   #44
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That would be Queensland businessman/politician Clive Palmer, associated with Queensland Nickel which recently ceased production. I would very much like to see photos of the ship under construction, it`s only 2 years to the maiden voyage. I`ll believe it when I see them, or the ship.
I wouldn't hold your breath on the Titanic replica floating under Clive's watch.

Indeed he might be sinking, financially, himself over a debt that his 'cash box' company guaranteed. Paid article so I wont include the link, but it is in relation to work carried out for gas exploration in PNG where a $16m payment remains in dispute. In my exploration experience you might contract with a company that has no significant assets but in that case you will obtain a guarantee from one that does have adequate net asset backing. If reports of his personal wealth are accurate then I expect that the dispute will be resolved, although its going through the courts first. Whatever personal wealth he does have will not likely become entangled in messy situations like Queensland Nickel or Palmer Coolum Resort where hundreds of jobs lost and debt/legal disputes are substantial. The former might be resurrected but has been quoted as being akin to a Phoenix Company situation. Its a safe bet that major suppliers to the new operating shell company will be looking for a guarantee.

As to his expertise when boating, he could probably use some help
‘Titanic II’ billionaire narrowly avoids superyacht collision – Motor Boat & Yachting

That boat, a $5.3m Horizon 30m vessel, was gifted to his daughter Emily for her 15th birthday in 2009. But it is now going:

"The Courier Mail" Mar 19, 2016:
"We can’t have two of them (superyachts). There isn’t enough space (on the jetty), so we’ve got to let Maximus go. We’re making way for the new one.” Mr Palmer said he did not know how much the new boat was costing or even who was paying for it.


The last sentence is fascinating. I don't want that kind of boat, just the method of acquiring it!


There may another angle to the story. "The Australian" reported in Mar 3, 2016 article "Clive Palmer yacht a $5m rustbucket". Not sure what the details are, it was a paid article and I'm not that interested, although a couple of lost propulsion incidents might point to systemic 'deferred maintenance' issues.
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Old 03-23-2016, 12:29 AM   #45
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I wouldn't hold your breath on the Titanic replica floating under Clive's watch.


As to his expertise when boating, he could probably use some help
‘Titanic II’ billionaire narrowly avoids superyacht collision – Motor Boat & Yachting

That boat, a $5.3m Horizon 30m vessel, was gifted to his daughter Emily for her 15th birthday in 2009. But it is now going:

"The Courier Mail" Mar 19, 2016:
"We can’t have two of them (superyachts). There isn’t enough space (on the jetty), so we’ve got to let Maximus go. We’re making way for the new one.” Mr Palmer said he did not know how much the new boat was costing or even who was paying for it.
A reasonable explanation: the new boat is as likely as Titanic Mk.2. In other words there will be no new boat.
I`ll take bets that in the coming election, be it the July 'Double Dissolution" ( should that be Disillusion?),or the normal course, Clive won`t be re-elected to the House of Reps, and his one remaining "tame" Senator won`t get back either.
A thought about the "Harmony" pic (that`s the topic, right?). I`ve seen other pics, it`s not pretty, but that pic looks distorted, like a small car caught in a nose to tail between 2 trucks.
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Old 03-23-2016, 01:34 AM   #46
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Mr B (as opposed to your wonderful spouse!)-you are pretty close with your estimates of the cost differential of boat building here vs SE Asia. A few years ago, I represented a small groups tht was considering building a specific boat model, anticipated demand around 5-8 boats annually. That had me spend quite a bit of time exploring the Asia vs US as they felt there was some intangible value attached to the "Made in USA" label. We were looking a using an existing builder, financing some expansion for them to handle the production. Some 20-25 years ago, when most SE Asian building was done primarily in Taiwan, the cost difference between here and there was around 30-35%. The difference was mostly in labor costs. Very little cost difference in materials and parts. That has narrowed over the years as the infrastructure built up and the labor force became more skilled. About 5 years ago, we determined that the cost difference had dropped to something around 8-19%. A difference that can be dealt with. But, many, many boats are still built overseas because of the built-up infrastructure and skilled workforce.
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Old 03-23-2016, 01:39 AM   #47
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The boat in the OP's picture does not improve much, if at all, from other angles. I've cruised past it. Some of these monsters (monstrosities?) have jet turbines on the uppermost aft deck. Presumably to provide enough power to run a million 1500W hairdryers etc. That noise cannot add to a nice on board experience.

I really want to take a cruise, but first need to find a suitable destination and secondly a right-sized cruise vessel. It wont be as large as the one in post #1 unless its one of the special Cunard ships.

Apologies for the thread drift above and one last indulgence if I may. Bruce, the article I linked was a bit old, there is a new yacht coming and expectations are it will be of similar size to the so-called rust bucket Horizon. The Titanic replica is never coming...
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Old 03-23-2016, 10:32 AM   #48
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I really want to take a cruise, but first need to find a suitable destination and secondly a right-sized cruise vessel. It wont be as large as the one in post #1 unless its one of the special Cunard ships.
National Geographic and Lindblad Expeditions run a fleet of very small cruise ships to some very interesting places. It's a bit pricey, though. I've actually thought about applying to work there.

With regards to the original post, it's amazing to me the number of truly hideous passenger ships out there now. I fear may sound like an old fart when I say this, but the last truly pretty passenger ship was the QE2. I really don't even think Queen Mary 2 is all that pretty.









What's up with that butt??
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Old 03-23-2016, 10:42 AM   #49
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Mr B (as opposed to your wonderful spouse!)-you are pretty close with your estimates of the cost differential of boat building here vs SE Asia. A few years ago, I represented a small groups tht was considering building a specific boat model, anticipated demand around 5-8 boats annually. That had me spend quite a bit of time exploring the Asia vs US as they felt there was some intangible value attached to the "Made in USA" label. We were looking a using an existing builder, financing some expansion for them to handle the production. Some 20-25 years ago, when most SE Asian building was done primarily in Taiwan, the cost difference between here and there was around 30-35%. The difference was mostly in labor costs. Very little cost difference in materials and parts. That has narrowed over the years as the infrastructure built up and the labor force became more skilled. About 5 years ago, we determined that the cost difference had dropped to something around 8-19%. A difference that can be dealt with. But, many, many boats are still built overseas because of the built-up infrastructure and skilled workforce.
There is another major factor too. The investors in boat building are not in the US. To be successful, it requires a tremendous amount of capital and there just aren't many people or companies in the US willing to make that kind of investment. Beyond Chouest (Westport), Versa (Hatteras), and Brunswick (Sea Ray and many others), it's not here. When Glastron, Four Winns, etc. were being resold by Platinum they sold to Beneteau. Sunseeker and Ferretti, two of the three largest yacht builders, are both Chinese owned. In Asia there is money looking for a home. Not so much in the US.

I did considerable analysis a couple of years ago, looking at a specific Asian boat builder. Had they been willing to sell (some owners were, others weren't, so a real internal battle), they would be building in the US now.
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Old 03-23-2016, 11:06 AM   #50
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B-definitely spot on about Asian money, especially Chinese, looking for a home. For many wealthy Chinese, there first priority is to get their money out of China and keep it safe from the vagaries of the government. It has skewed the Seattle real estate market tremendously. Especially for office buildings and large multi-family projects. Among those investors, much les concern over the economics of a deal, much more of an attitude of "buy it, whatever it costs". A short example-a client decided to sell a 25 year old apartment complex he built and ran. He has always kept it in top shape, and it is in a good location. Several appraisals came in at around $12-13M, his broker solicited offers and got 13 serious offers all ranging from $10.5-$14M with the usual conditions, due diligence, examine financials, building inspections, etc with a 90 day closing pending getting financing. All made extensive site visits with engineers, architects, etc. A family owned Chinese RE company sent its local rep, he spent 3 hours on the property, and by late that afternoon sent a written offer, no conditions whatsoever, close in 45 days, all cash, with a $250K non-refundable binder, offering $21.5M! I now have a very happy client.
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Old 03-23-2016, 11:18 AM   #51
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Those ships have the aesthetic appeal of a doublewide on a deck barge. Hideous, indeed.

I sure miss the shape of the old ships. Graceful sheer lines, beam curves not flattened by Panamax limits, etc. It makes more work for the guys cutting plates, but dang it they are easy on the eyes.
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Old 03-23-2016, 01:01 PM   #52
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...With regards to the original post, it's amazing to me the number of truly hideous passenger ships out there now. I fear may sound like an old fart when I say this, but the last truly pretty passenger ship was the QE2. I really don't even think Queen Mary 2 is all that pretty.



What's up with that butt??
Yes, as much as I love the QM2, that curved butt is indeed fake, it was an add-on for almost entirely aesthetic reasons and as that photo shows, if you look closely you can see it's kind of glued on for looks. On the other hand the resulting fantail is maybe my favorite part of the ship, the "Don't jump Rose!" spot to watch the ocean recede into the distance with a glass of champagne in your hand. Even if the tail is fake I still think it's the most graceful liner on the water present day, although Disney tries to copy the classic look with navy blue or dark hulls and red stripes. Cunard did Queen Victoria and the new QE too, but they're both "eh" in my opinion, although I've never been on those two.
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Old 03-23-2016, 05:43 PM   #53
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The Disney Wonder is more of a classic ocean liner. I took this picture just north of Shearwater in BC in when it was southbound. I had passed it 3 weeks earlier in Grenville Channel in the fog. Very impressive 150 yards to starboard.
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Old 03-23-2016, 06:42 PM   #54
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Today they call them cruise ships.
We called them our only way to get around.
Most of the time...
Union Steamships Catala.
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Old 06-18-2016, 01:17 AM   #55
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Hideous looking thing.
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Old 06-18-2016, 06:51 AM   #56
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When we are in St. Lucia's Rodney Bay we see the Royal Clipper once a week. Have thought of taking her on one of her transatlantic crossings.
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Old 06-20-2016, 01:11 PM   #57
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I've done a cruise on the Royal Clipper. It really was very nice. I've also done cruises on some of the giant cruise ships with thousands of passengers.

I always hear people say how they wouldn't want to do that, because you're crowded onto a boat with so many people. Honestly, when you're on the boat you really don't notice it. That is, it doesn't feel crowded at all. The only time you notice is when you are waiting to debark or embark. Then sometimes there is a bit of a line. There can also be lines for some meals, but then there are usually a dozen different choices; so if you don't like the lines just get your meal somewhere else.

Not saying that it is the best way to travel. The cruise on the Royal Clipper was head and shoulders above any experience I've had on a big cruise ship. But my wife and I just don't find the big cruise ships to be nearly as bad as some people (mostly people who have never BEEN on a big cruise ship) seem to think it is.
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Old 06-21-2016, 04:02 PM   #58
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I used to think that car carriers (Ro/Ro) were the ugliest boats in the world - basically just office buildings laying on their sides... but some of those photos above of the cruise ships are just about as bad. Designed to be purely functional - not aesthetic.
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Old 09-23-2016, 12:18 PM   #59
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Harmony of the Seas (and its peers) look like someone figured out how to get Soviet era housing to float. Ugh.
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