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Old 10-14-2011, 12:56 PM   #21
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

Port*- I carry 300 feet of chain. My 30 kg Bruce has held securely in 35 knots on a 5: 1 scope. If I lost the 30 KG I'd go up a size or two to whatever would fit. Su Inglis es bueno


-- Edited by sunchaser on Friday 14th of October 2011 12:58:17 PM
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:06 PM   #22
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
sunchaser wrote:
*Su Inglis es bueno



-- Edited by sunchaser on Friday 14th of October 2011 12:58:17 PM
Your Spanish may be bueno but I think that they speak Portuguese in Brazil.
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:19 PM   #23
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Yes I know that but my Portuguese is no bueno and I bet Port's*Espanol is perfecto like his Inglis.
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:31 PM   #24
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Portuguese wrote:
The bottom is mostly sand or shale. Every boat, sail or power has a Bruce maybe because of the marketing done is the past. However, every now and then I here complain about its capacity of staying on hold. The ones here, who dont like them, use Danforth.

Don't know about shale as we've never encountered that kind of bottom yet, but for sand just about every anchoring test ever done puts the Danforth type of anchor at the top of list in terms of holding power.* The same list that has Bruce at or near the bottom.

The aluminum Fortress is an excellent anchor for sand although the one drawback I have read about it is that if the boat should get pulling hard sideways on it the shank has been known to bend if the anchor stays set with the pull at that angle.

I was told by the fellow who was once the Bruce distributor for the Puget Sound area that the Bruce's wide popularity in this area stemmed from its reputation for setting quicky in a wide variety of bottoms, which we get up here.* This was certainly our experience in the years we used a Bruce.* But, this fellow said, if what's needed is high holding power, the Bruce leaves a lot to be desired.* This, too, was our experience.

If it was just us I'd think that we were doing something wrong.* But this same dragging-under-pressure has been experienced-- apparently a lot--- by several of the members of our boating club and some of them eventually gave up on the anchor.

As I said, we've not experienced a shale bottom (that we know of).* But based on your description of more open anchorages, often with a sand bottom, the folks in your area who chose a Danforth would seem to be making the more dependable choice in my opinion.
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Old 10-14-2011, 01:50 PM   #25
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
dwhatty wrote:Your Spanish may be bueno but I think that they speak Portuguese in Brazil.
******* Of course you're correct, David and...."they've got an awful lot of coffee in Brazil."







-- Edited by SeaHorse II on Friday 14th of October 2011 01:54:39 PM
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Old 10-14-2011, 03:42 PM   #26
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

....Guys. Yes in Brazil we speak Portuguese. As I have been working in 16 different countries, I also speak fluent Spanish, enough French and I won't starve if I am in an Arabian country.
About the coffee, I agree that we have too much, but not as good as the Colombian or Costa Rican...What we have here a lot, is sunshine and warm mild temperatures 365 days a year.
But, we don't have Trawlers, windlasses, aluminum anchors, marine generators, watermakers, navigation electronics, and a lot of other stuff that costs us an arm and a leg....But life is great here! It is a great nautical community.
Come on down guys. I live in a city set on a bay where you can spend a year visiting a different mooring place every weekend without ever repeating. The fuel is expensive!
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Old 10-14-2011, 04:21 PM   #27
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Portuguese wrote:
....Guys. Yes in Brazil we speak Portuguese. As I have been working in 16 different countries, I also speak fluent Spanish, enough French and I won't starve if I am in an Arabian country.
About the coffee, I agree that we have too much, but not as good as the Colombian or Costa Rican...What we have here a lot, is sunshine and warm mild temperatures 365 days a year.
But, we don't have Trawlers, windlasses, aluminum anchors, marine generators, watermakers, navigation electronics, and a lot of other stuff that costs us an arm and a leg....But life is great here! It is a great nautical community.
Come on down guys. I live in a city set on a bay where you can spend a year visiting a different mooring place every weekend without ever repeating. The fuel is expensive!
I would be there in a flash if I could afford it as I have always wanted to visit your country since I learned Portuguese when I was in the US Navy way back in the 1960's. Most of my teachers then were from Brazil. Sadly, I have lost my semi-fluency in Portuguese after 45 years of non use. Where in Brazil are you?
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Old 10-14-2011, 04:30 PM   #28
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

<q>,,,,,Where in Brazil are you?
</q>

Well, I am in Salvador Bahia
12° 58' 43.22"S* 38° 28' 35.80"W
*
Welcome!


-- Edited by Portuguese on Friday 14th of October 2011 04:31:08 PM
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:07 PM   #29
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

We did a project a few years ago with GOL airlines. Worked in both Sao Paulo and Rio. Rio was nice. Sao Paulo not so much. Interesting airport, though. They call it "the aircraft carrier" for good reason.
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Old 10-14-2011, 05:27 PM   #30
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Portuguese wrote:
<q>,,,,,Where in Brazil are you?
</q>

Well, I am in Salvador Bahia
12° 58' 43.22"S* 38° 28' 35.80"W
*
Welcome!



-- Edited by Portuguese on Friday 14th of October 2011 04:31:08 PM
Big country! What is that large body of water Northywest of Salvador towards Madre de Dios and then around toward Itaparica? Looks like good cruising grounds?

I vaguely remember a song we sang in class that starts something like (pardon my spelling, grammar and punctuation):

Não há, ó gente, ó não Luar, como esse do sertão...

Is this from your part of Brasil?



-- Edited by dwhatty on Friday 14th of October 2011 05:54:21 PM
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Old 10-14-2011, 08:25 PM   #31
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Portuguese wrote:
<q>,,,,,Where in Brazil are you?
</q>

Well, I am in Salvador Bahia
12° 58' 43.22"S* 38° 28' 35.80"W
*
Welcome!



-- Edited by Portuguese on Friday 14th of October 2011 04:31:08 PM
A great spot to be living at.* We spent 2 plus months there in 2004 on our way north.* It was our first port in Brazil,* wonderful!* We also stopped in Fortaleza which had a large boat yard.**Where is*Rainha Jannota being built?
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Old 10-15-2011, 12:51 PM   #32
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

David & Emily

That's the Baia de Todos os Santos. It is the place I mentioned that we can spend a full year without ever repeating a place. There 52 different mooring spots in the all bay with different attractions. The song you mention is a classic from this part of the country and it is older than I am. Yet, it stills brings emotions to people when is properly sung.

Larry:
Check out INACE Yachts. That is the shipyard you mention in Fortaleza. By the way, that's a lady business. It is run by an old Portuguese lady and her Brazilian born daughter. She is a Naval Engineer educated part in MIT.
My boat is being built 145 miles inland from Guaruja in Sao Paulo state. When Rainha Jannota is ready to launch, she will have to travel on a flat bed low boy from Campinas to Guaruja. It is nearly a week trip for 145 miles.

Yes. Every time I stay in Sao Paulo more than 12 hours, I get intense headaches. I was not made for that kind of a place.
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Old 10-15-2011, 01:06 PM   #33
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

Some pics of the Baia de todos os Santos and neighbor places. The norro de Sao Paulo picture, despite its name, is one of the corners of the Baia de Todos os Santos.

On one of the pictures youu'll see a trypical "escuna da Bahia" The boat made locally without any type of plans. You just telll the carpenter how long you want it,*thats. all!



-- Edited by Portuguese on Saturday 15th of October 2011 01:10:38 PM


-- Edited by Portuguese on Saturday 15th of October 2011 01:12:52 PM
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Old 10-15-2011, 02:38 PM   #34
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Portuguese:

The bay is beautiful. I want to go there. Are there any trawlers available for charter? Not that I could afford it, but one can dream.
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Old 10-15-2011, 03:59 PM   #35
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

David

There are no Trawlers per say but you can charter a "escuna" with all conforts. There are also sailboats. But you can go around the bay on daily charters in escunas with music food and lots of "Caipinhas"

P.
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Old 10-15-2011, 04:05 PM   #36
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Wondering ... how much mud and junk*from your all-chain rhode*ends up in your anchor locker?
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Old 10-15-2011, 04:15 PM   #37
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Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Marin wrote:
Port--- One thing to keep in mind regarding the Bruce: in test after test over many, many years, the Bruce consistently has one of the lowest if not THE lowest holding power of all the designs tested. Yes, it sets fast in most bottoms and will reset fast--- sometimes. I don't know the kinds of bottoms, winds, etc. you anticipate encountering, but if holding power under higher pressures is going to be important, I suggest that you check into other anchor designs. While the Bruce is the most popular anchor among powerboaters in this area (PNW), which is one reason we initially bought one, boaters up here typically don't encounter winds at anchor that are all that strong. We don't get the big, exposed, windy anchorages one gets in the southwestern Pacific, for example. But, depending on the bottom makeup, when the wind does kick up, a Bruce will let go before a lot of other designs. This was our experience and has been the experience of a number of other boaters we know in the area.

*I've a Bruce copy.* The most popular*with the 35-50 foot boats in my section of the marina is the CQR and second is the Bruce (some have both "armed" on the bow).* I've always liked the quick setting/resetting feature of the Bruce, particularly with tidal current changes.* I've read it's best to go heavy with the Bruce.* Mine is lighter than ideal, but for the near future I'll be anchoring in protected waters.


-- Edited by markpierce on Saturday 15th of October 2011 04:24:37 PM
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Old 10-15-2011, 05:12 PM   #38
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Mark

You're correct. I am asking myself that same question for a number of reasons.

Why all chain? How many times am I going to anchor in a rock bottom?

Can I afford the weight in the bow with all that chain with anchor and a windlass proportional to that weight

In the Complete Anchoring Handbook by Alain Poiraud, Achim Ginsberg-Klemmt, and Erika Ginsberg-Klemmt, they very seldom mention the all chain set up. They do recommend a portion of chain equal to 3 times the lenght of the boat, and they have a dedicated chapter called: "The Best Anchor Rodr is a Combination of Chain and Rope". I started to read this book yesterday and I haven't yet got there yet but I will.

Apart from all that, if you get in trouble and you have to let the rode go, how do you cut chain? It is a lot easier to cut rope than chain in a Trawler or any other place

I better keep on reading!

Regards and Thanks

P.
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Old 10-15-2011, 05:49 PM   #39
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

We hose off the chain as we are hauling it in. We anchor most of the time and have very little mud in the locker, maybe a cup per year!

We attach rope to the end of the chain and tie the bitter end to a shackle inside the locker. The rope will extend outside to the windlass. That way we can cut the line in the event we need to leave quickly.
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Old 10-15-2011, 06:46 PM   #40
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RE: Windlass, not a clue!!!

Quote:
Giggitoni wrote:
*We attach rope to the end of the chain and tie the bitter end to a shackle inside the locker. The rope will extend outside to the windlass. That way we can cut the line in the event we need to leave quickly.
*To be done here.
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