Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 03-04-2014, 04:40 PM   #21
Enigma
 
RT Firefly's Avatar
 
City: Slicker?
Country: Bumpkin?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 9,995
Greetings,

__________________
Advertisement

__________________
RTF
RT Firefly is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 04:46 PM   #22
TF Site Team
 
Larry M's Avatar
 
City: JAX, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hobo
Vessel Model: Krogen 42-120
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,726
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougcole View Post
...I know grass is tough on every anchor, but have any of you rocna owners out there had any experience, good or bad, in grass bottoms?

Thanks,
Doug
Last spring we traveled from Mayaguana to Bimini with our 33 Kg Rocna. Never had to reset or dragged. Better than the CQR we had used there years ago and definitely better than our Lewmar claw that the Rocna replaced. We still looked for a sandy patch in grass though.
__________________

Larry M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 06:27 PM   #23
Guru
 
Tom.B's Avatar
 
City: Cary, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Skinny Dippin'
Vessel Model: Navigator 4200 Classic
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,152
I am curious... Why is grass such a problem? Roots loosening bottom?
__________________
2000 Navigator 4200 Classic
(NOT a trawler)
Tom.B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 08:43 PM   #24
Guru
 
C lectric's Avatar
 
City: Somewhere
Country: , Canada
Vessel Name: Island Pride
Vessel Model: Palmer sedan 32'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,866
I expect the problem is many anchors simply cannot penetrate the grass and roots so just skate on it. I'm not a diver so can't look.

I don't have much grass to deal with, we do have it, but where I boat flat blade kelp can foul an anchor badly, preventing anchoring.

The kelp and I suspect the grass prevent the anchor from penetrating the seabed at all.
I'd given up on some nice spots because the anchor simply fouled , pulling huge gobs of kelp.
My old anchor was a 'BRUCE'. Partly too small but in kelp bottoms unless I managed to hit exactly where I'd just ripped a big wad out , or someone elses track, it simply couldn't penetrate the stuff.

My Rocna ,so far, has allowed me to anchor in those same spots. Yes, I could see it did not bite immediately but it did and solidly. It is ,of course, larger and heavier than the Bruce. but I suspect it is simply the point digging through.

Just my experience to date.

I'm sure other pointy type anchors will work well also.
C lectric is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 09:59 PM   #25
Guru
 
Dougcole's Avatar
 
City: Carrabelle, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Morgan
Vessel Model: '05 Mainship 40T
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 799
In my experience, the anchor will only penetrate the grass a little way, then it rips out a clump which fouls the anchor and after that it just drags. Luckily, in the Bahamas the water is so clear that you can clearly see the bottom. You find the white spots and drop in them.

Sounds easier than it is though, as sometimes all of the good sand spots in an anchorage can be taken. Also, it can be surprisingly hard to drop an anchor in a small one as the hook "sails" underwater and doesn't sink straight down.
Dougcole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 10:18 PM   #26
Guru
 
boatpoker's Avatar
 
City: Port Credit
Country: Ontario
Vessel Name: DIRT FREE
Vessel Model: Benford Fantail 38
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougcole View Post
Sounds easier than it is though, as sometimes all of the good sand spots in an anchorage can be taken. Also, it can be surprisingly hard to drop an anchor in a small one as the hook "sails" underwater and doesn't sink straight down.
If your hook sails underwater it is either way too small or a Fortress. I can't imagine my 55lb. Rocna knockoff with 1/2" chain sailing anywhere.
__________________
If you can live with the consequences, go for it - wg
Y'am what I y'am an' thats' all that y'am - Popeye
As God is my witness, I thought turkey's could fly. Mr.C
boatpoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 10:24 PM   #27
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,707
My XYZ is supposed to set in weedy and grassy bottoms in it's stock original configuration as shown in the first pic. It even has sawtooth sides to help penetrate. With it's original fluke tip (pic 1) I've only anchored 4 or 5 times. It never set instantly but always set w a minimum of backing and held well.

Before leaving Alaska I made a new fluke tip. Only mild steel was available and no galvavizer so I hit it w an aerosol can of "Cold Galvanizing". The new fluke tip as seen in pic 2 added considerable fluke area fwd and I anticipated better holding at shorter scope ratios. I only anticipated it would set in soft bottoms w it's very wide chisel like fluke. Either I accidentally found soft mud bottoms all the way from Thorne Bay or the chisel tip works on much harder bottoms as the anchor performed flawlessly every time .. about 8 or 9 anchorings.

I plan on making a better tip out of 4140 steel w an inverted "V" shape at the tip. About a 30 degree angle.

But in it's standard configuration it's supposed to handle grass. I've only seen grass once in the PNW so have no grass experience.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	STH71524 copy 3.jpg
Views:	92
Size:	211.7 KB
ID:	27946   Click image for larger version

Name:	DSCF0261 copy.jpg
Views:	82
Size:	197.2 KB
ID:	27947  
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 10:30 PM   #28
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,669
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougcole View Post
Human nature, for sure. I think we can all agree though that all anchors, like all boats are a compromise some are better at certain things and worse at others. I am hoping to get specific input about a specific anchor in a specific set of circumstances. I'm pinning all my hopes on Oliver.
Doug, I have Super Sarca, and the roll bar on it is finer than that of the Manson Supreme or Rocna, but I doubt that would make much difference in the real life situation. Sad to say, thus far, Sarcas are not easy to obtain in your part of the world, however their performance is considered similar to Rocna and Manson, and I can say that it was because I failed to get a CQR to set with about five attempts on a weedy bottom, in an anchorage here in Moreton Bay notorious for weed, that I made the change, and we have set first off and never dragged in that anchorage on a lot of occasions since.
__________________
Pete
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 10:39 PM   #29
Guru
 
N4712's Avatar
 
City: South FL
Country: U.S.A
Vessel Name: Oliver
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 47 Hull# 12
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,613
Just checked out AC, seems there is light grass and good holding so it won't give an accurate outcome, but I'll let you know none the less.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	image-1343353069.jpg
Views:	78
Size:	70.8 KB
ID:	27949  
__________________
Thanks, Oliver
M/V Oliver
Nordhavn 47 Hull #12
N4712 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2014, 11:04 PM   #30
Guru
 
HopCar's Avatar


 
City: Miami Florida
Vessel Name: Possum
Vessel Model: Ellis 28
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,494
Doug, you've been on this forum long enough to know not to mention anchors! What's the matter with you?

(my delta works well in grass, please don't hit me)
HopCar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 01:18 AM   #31
THD
Guru
 
City: Seattle
Country: US
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,142
Hop-you sell anchors. What do you answer when someone comes in and asks what anchor is the best?
THD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 07:09 AM   #32
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,517
In grass you have to have enough WEIGHT to even get to the borrom.

Perhaps a STEEL , rather than aluminum anchor would work better?

Yachtsman or CQR should work fine , as would a real Danforth say 60H.
FF is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 07:11 AM   #33
Guru
 
Dougcole's Avatar
 
City: Carrabelle, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Morgan
Vessel Model: '05 Mainship 40T
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 799
Quote:
Originally Posted by N4712 View Post
Just checked out AC, seems there is light grass and good holding so it won't give an accurate outcome, but I'll let you know none the less.
Hey Oliver,

Light grass and good holding when you first pull in but it gets heavier as you move up into the cove, IIRC. We generally go a little further in than the majority of the pack, there is a bit more northerly protection up in there. We once went way in in the old boat (3'4" draft and prop protection) there is heavy grass up in there.

We also anchored once on the Western side off the beach on a really calm night, it was great.

Doug
Dougcole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 08:42 AM   #34
Guru
 
HopCar's Avatar


 
City: Miami Florida
Vessel Name: Possum
Vessel Model: Ellis 28
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,494
THD, It seems that anchors are a very local thing. There are very few roll bar anchors in my area. The big sport fish boats carry Danforth type, often Fortress, flat on deck. Cruising boats with pulpits have Delta's hanging on them. Who knows what you'll see on sailboats.

I don't stock a roll bar anchor yet. The Rocna sales rep is pushing me to bring them in and she's a pretty lady. The freight charges from Canada to Miami are pretty steep.

Schaeffer Marine, the sail boat rigging manufacture, is the US distributer of the Manson line. I already do business with them so they would be easy to get.

I've never tried a roll bar anchor but I suspect they are not as effective in grass as a non roll bar anchor. Right now I'm really happy with my Delta in grass. Much better than the Danforth it replaced.
HopCar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 08:55 AM   #35
Guru
 
Hendo78's Avatar
 
City: Perth
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: M/V SOLSTICE
Vessel Model: Hendo "Special"
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,275
Quote:
Originally Posted by manyboats View Post
SARCA should be better.

.
X 2 for Super SARCA or go SARCA Excel
__________________
***I use and recommend ANCHOR RIGHT Anchors***
Hendo78 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 09:12 AM   #36
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by THD View Post
Hop-you sell anchors. What do you answer when someone comes in and asks what anchor is the best?
The answer to that would be whatever anchor was in stock.

My Delta has also been good in grass.
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 10:42 AM   #37
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,707
One would think the best anchor to penetrate hard bottoms and grass would be one w a very large percentage of the anchor weight bearing down on the fluke. Claws win the prize there but only penetrate well on soft bottoms as the fluke tips are very blunt as in not sharp. Danforths are somewhat sharp (especially Fortress) but they all try to penetrate at a very shallow angle and w very little weight on the fluke tip. Rocnas and Supremes carry most of their weight well away from the fluke tip .. aft. The roll bars don't help in this regard either. They set on their side so their fairly large shanks don't contribute much to fluke tip pressure from weight either.

Many anchors (like the SARCA) when sitting straight up transfer ALL the weight of the anchor plus much more from the pull on the rode to the fluke tip. And on the SARCA the tip is turned down slightly. The Supreme and Rocnas tip has the tip beveled from underneath helping the tip ride up and over the bottom when right side up. But of course they set on their sides so as long as they do the bevel seems correct. But they won't lay on their sides w/o considerable scope.

Penetration of anchors is IMO dependent basically on;

1. Weight on the tip.
2. Sharpness and shape of the tip.
3. Angle and attitude of the tip as it's presented to the bottom.
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 11:02 AM   #38
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
The answer to that would be whatever anchor was in stock.

My Delta has also been good in grass.
OK, everybody, I have been taken to the wood pile for the comment about Hopcar. I hope Parks knew that it was in jest. Mia Culpa. Believe it or not, but I have actually done business with Parks. I recommend him and Hopkins Carter very highly.
__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 11:04 AM   #39
Senior Member
 
Jbear's Avatar
 
City: Anacortes
Country: US
Vessel Name: Adelante
Vessel Model: Shin Shing, Eagle 35'
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 127
Having grown up on a farm where we routinely plowed the fields I would think the pointy sharp things would get through the grass better. .
I have a Bruce and have found it much more difficult to set in Eel grass but great in the mud. The other day I had a very quick set as I had lost power close to some rocks. The old Danforth grabbed right away and held us tight in the wind.
I see a lot of Rocna's and "claw" styled anchors up here in the PNW.
Jbear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2014, 11:10 AM   #40
Guru
 
Moonstruck's Avatar
 
City: Hailing Port: Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Moonstruck
Vessel Model: Sabre 42 Hardtop Express
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by N4712 View Post
Just checked out AC, seems there is light grass and good holding so it won't give an accurate outcome, but I'll let you know none the less.
Oliver, unless it's blowing a gale, Great Sale Cay will not be a very good anchor test for your Rocna. You will probably be hanging out in the 7-8' of water area. I have never had a problem setting in that area.

What to look out for is where the sand is thin over coral rock. That can be diffucult to set an anchor. You will find some of that close into the cays. Just take your dinghy out to see if the anchor is buried. The water is usually clear enough to see. I have a "lookie box" I use for that.
__________________

__________________
Don on Moonstruck
Sabre 42 Hardtop Express & Blackfin 25 CC
When cruising life is simpler, but on a grander scale (author unknown)
http://moonstruckblog.wordpress.com/
Moonstruck is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012