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Old 01-03-2015, 02:00 PM   #21
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Shheez...between the Taras wreck and now Ed's storm anchor thread, you anchor guys are giving me the willies. My plan has been as MyTraveler, 145# Forfjord with 400' all chain through a hause, bridled (30') to massive bollards with a large loop in 50' of water. Low profile 30 tons.
Will I end up on the beach in 50 knot winds?
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Old 01-03-2015, 02:34 PM   #22
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Shheez...between the Taras wreck and now Ed's storm anchor thread, you anchor guys are giving me the willies. My plan has been as MyTraveler, 145# Forfjord with 400' all chain through a hause, bridled (30') to massive bollards with a large loop in 50' of water. Low profile 30 tons.
Will I end up on the beach in 50 knot winds?
150 knots, maybe.
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Old 01-03-2015, 04:09 PM   #23
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Delfin,
Did you consider the anchor?
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Old 01-03-2015, 04:27 PM   #24
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My best storm anchor is an enclosed berth in an extremely well protected marina.

My second best is a Fortress FX-17 if I'm not prudent enough to be safely tucked away when things get sporty on the water.

Musings of a dedicated fair weather boater.
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Old 01-03-2015, 05:31 PM   #25
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MYTravler,
How many tons of boat per pound of anchor is that w the Bruce?
100,000 pound boat (per scales last time she was hauled), so a little less than 1/2 ton per pound of anchor. I believe it is considered slightly oversized, but not dramatically so.
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Old 01-03-2015, 05:37 PM   #26
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Fifty knots? I thought you guys were talking about real winds.
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Old 01-03-2015, 05:45 PM   #27
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Delfin,
Did you consider the anchor?
145# is a bit dainty for a Fjorford, but at 400# of boat per pound of anchor any deficiencies in design seem like they would be mitigated.
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Old 01-03-2015, 07:20 PM   #28
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MYTraveler,
Interesting .. that's equivalant to 18lbs for my boat and that is what I have been anchoring w for some time. I have a Claw now that's almost twice that.
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Old 01-03-2015, 07:35 PM   #29
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40 knots and over, we would rely on the forecast getting it wrong - it is after all a forecast with no guarantees. Forecasts might get bits of the detail wrong but usually there is sufficient time to find somewhere 'nearby' with sufficient protection such that the 70 knot or 40 knot forecast is actually only 35 knot or 20 knot. 40 knots and over - we would not rely on one anchor, no matter how perfect - they only need to move (set more deeply) 6". catch on a bit of submerged waterlogged wood and they will drag (maybe forever). Any anchor with an oyster shell, bit of seaweed or whatever embedded on the toe is a recipe to drag.

We would be looking for trees or rocks, and we have made a 40nm passage when 70 knots were forecast (to find the trees). We would then get as close to shore as tide allowed, tie to the trees or rocks and lay 2 anchors in a 'V'. One of the anchors, provided the seabed is appropriate (so most of them), would be an Excel the other a Fortress. We would have an alloy Spade (which would be on the foredeck) and an alloy Excel (on the transom) both ready. I have heard of people who, in the absence of trees, have buried their anchor(s) in the beach but cannot comment on the practice. If we had a bigger vessel we might have another Fortress as lugging big steel anchors around is unrealistic and in the overall - those extra anchors are not expensive. Each of our anchors is the recommended size as a main anchor for our yacht. We probably appear to carry a lot - but when you are 200nm from the nearest chandler (and everything deployed) you can wish you carried more

We carry sufficient 'rope' to tie to shore, have strops made up with hose pipe protection for trees and short lengths of chain to loop round rock. We carry a main rode on the windlass, all chain, and have a second rode chain and nylon. We could cobble together another 70m from mooring lines if necessary. All our spare cordage and rode is carried and neatly coiled in milk crates.

Part of the secret is having the kit, the second is getting 'there' early enough to use it all. It might seem onerous - but what else are you doing (except making bread) and if its that bad you are going to be there a while - so you may as well be comfortable.
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Old 01-03-2015, 09:20 PM   #30
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'Been my experience that it is as important to be able to get your ground tackle up as it is to get it down. If you do drag or uncomfortably drift how the heck are you going to reorient that triple or double or tandem setup? And if you use all chain rode, you're gonna need snubbers and keepers that will need to be dealt with...and like someone mentioned - in a real blow you'll be wearing a hooded slicker with the hood pulled tight around everything but the swim goggles you'll need to keep your eyes open against the driving rain. And OH!, don't forget that in that type of weather you'll only occasionally have one hand to work with because you'll need to hang on to something for dear life.

OK, but I know my triple rig will hold me in anything so none of that pertains to me. Well, I thought so too, until a tangled mess of not so firmly anchored boats started drifting down on me.

In a big blow/seas, your chain will likely be testing the limits of the snubber if the snubber is sized properly, otherwise you'll be worried about the snubber exploding or jerking the cleat or windlass off the front of your boat. How are you going to manage dealing with that through swim goggles with an occasional free hand?

Big single anchor, lotta nylon scope with extra heavy nylon spliced on the bitter end of the rode for chafe protection...from my experience anyway.
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Old 01-03-2015, 09:21 PM   #31
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In a real strong blow the wind picks up the water out of the ocean and sends it sideways. Sort of like smoke coming across the water or in Alaska like a ground blizzard. If it gets bad enough all you can do is hang on or maybe start your engine. At Douglas harbor across from Juneau Alaska they have clocked 150 MPH winds, (Taku winds). In the Philippines last year we had a typhoon come thru with winds stronger than 150 mph. Like I said before you better have your ducks in a row before the wind hits as you don't really get a second chance. I have personally been in winds over 100 knots twice, both times I was on land in Alaska.
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:01 PM   #32
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I've written it down, steer clear of Alaska!
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:09 PM   #33
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I also like to stay away from other boats in a good blow. Sometimes it's not what you do, it's what others do that can hurt. Lots of big boats don't have proper ground tackle or know how to use it.
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Old 01-03-2015, 10:18 PM   #34
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I also like to stay away from other boats in a good blow. Sometimes it's not what you do, it's what others do that can hurt. Lots of big boats don't have proper ground tackle or know how to use it.
+1

I'd have thought this was a positive for Alaska, less boats?

But I'd not limit your comments to big boats - any boats. Many people rely on one, perfect, anchor - they can be quite scary.
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Old 01-04-2015, 01:01 AM   #35
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Djbangi wrote….

"But I'd not limit your comments to big boats - any boats. Many people rely on one, perfect, anchor - they can be quite scary."

Ok, ok, I give up, I confess. Even though my primary anchor is a Super Sarca, I do have one rather large Danforth in the lazaret, with extra chain and rope road. Never had to dig it out yet and use it, but it's there ok..?
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Old 01-04-2015, 01:15 AM   #36
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Nothing like being honest and baring the soul.


As an aside, a propos nothing, - is it a real Danforth (from Danforth) a copy from someone reputable (like Manson? say ,I do not know if they even make them) or just a 'copy'?
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Old 01-04-2015, 01:36 AM   #37
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I've written it down, steer clear of Alaska!
Why when there are large areas of protected waters in southeastern Alaska?

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Old 01-04-2015, 01:56 AM   #38
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Mark,

I would need to go to NW Alaska first, before I could enjoy the SE.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:46 AM   #39
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Why when there are large areas of protected waters in southeastern Alaska?

Mark...that photo reminds me of where I live, and while it may be 'protected' from open ocean wind and waves it can get pretty squirrely with steep, close waves that refract around islands and headlands as well as rebound off steep shorelines resulting in four or more wave sets stacking up into pyramids with exploding tops. Winds also flip 180 degrees from inflow to outflow, and over 20 foot tides also tend to spice things up.
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Old 01-04-2015, 06:32 AM   #40
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Some food for thought on using one anchor. In hurricane Opal I watched 120MPH winds go down to nothing clock 180 degrees when the eye went over, and go back up to 100 in less than 5 minutes. 4 of that was dead calm. When the wind started from the other direction it did not start in just went from nothing to full force. This is when many of the boats broke loose. Not sure how a single large anchor would hold in this case. Our anchoring was done before the hurricane, then leave the boat and come back after and hope to not have to pick up the pieces. Fortunately never had to on the boat. With our motor yacht we have arrange to pull it if a hurricane comes.
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