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Old 11-29-2013, 05:47 AM   #81
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>Breaking one out, lifting and carrying a hundred pounder is also considerable strain on cruiser pulpits.<

Time to find and shoot the designer and fellow that built it undersized, and called the boat a cruiser..

The weight of the boat only counts in a heavy surge that is strong enough to make a chain rode bar tight and give the anchor a shock load.

A rode rider , or switching to a proper sized nylon rode will stop the shock hammering.

For boats that dance from side to side pulling up short on each tack, only a second anchor will stop the veering , and reduce the loads.

As long as the ground tackle can be retrieved in a normal manner, too heavy does not exist.

My only hope is the watch fob folks with a sales brochure that sez >use our 20lb miracle anchor for your Roomaran Maru , 20 ft wide 35 ft tall,< are DOWNWIND every night from my spot.

And the wind doesnt shift!
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Old 11-29-2013, 07:49 AM   #82
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Tap into the Norhavn owners site. You will find a detailed anchor discussion by very experienced 47 owners.
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Old 11-29-2013, 08:36 AM   #83
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Good move. Rocna is a great anchor
Indeed it is but if you read the text carefully you'll see that it falls short on short scope performance. The Supreme and some others do not.

MyHarly we have hundreds of "very experienced" owners and if you were to read our archives you may learn a bit about anchors.
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Old 11-29-2013, 10:07 AM   #84
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Where you really learn about anchors is out using them....
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Old 11-29-2013, 10:48 AM   #85
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Where you really learn about anchors is out using them....

Amen!

In anchors bigger is always better. On a true blue water boat your anchor is a huge part of your insurance policy... and on a cruising boat all chain is the only way to go.. the rode takes a beating and only chain will last.

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Old 11-29-2013, 11:03 AM   #86
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After Christmas, were going pick up one of these mantus anchors, currently we have a 105# CQR. Or should I hold off and spend a little more for an ronca?
I'd be leery of the Mantus for two reasons. First, the shank has a great deal less metal in it than its competitors and is made out of A36 steel, which is up to 3 times weaker than its competitors. Add those together and you have a shank that is likely to let you down. True, Mantus guarantees their shank, but that will be small comfort depending on where and when it bends.

Second, on another thread, the manufacturer did little to gain trust. Regarding the weak shank of their product, they first said they had replaced it with A514 grade steel, then backed off and said they were going to, then when some people's eyes began to get squinty said they already would have made the change if posters on that thread left them alone and stopped badgering them with questions.

The capper was posting a table of engineering calculations meant to show their shank was just fine for the purpose when compared to other's product that was bogus on its face. Rather than answering any questions on how they came up with these numbers, they simply removed the table and pretended it had never been posted. Further, when questions continued they didn't want to answer, they apparently simply asked mods to close the thread as well as subsequent attempts to reopen similar threads. All in all, not very confidence inspiring.

That said, it may be a fine anchor if the limitations of a hoop style hook don't worry you, but I would wait until, or if, they follow through with new metal for the shank. Even then, it will be weaker than the Manson.
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Old 11-29-2013, 06:18 PM   #87
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All I know is from experience. I have anther KK owner swear by a Rocna. Another KK owner with a 52' swear by a Rocna so I bought one and also could not be happier. End of story. My experience tells me I bought the right anchor. It works long or short Rode.
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Old 11-30-2013, 05:46 AM   #88
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Where you really learn about anchors is out using them....

Being towed off the beach as a Learning Experience?

The midnight dance with fenders . a Learning Experience.

Too easy to just remember that in some things ,

SIZE DOES MATTER!
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Old 11-30-2013, 09:15 AM   #89
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Tap into the Norhavn owners site. You will find a detailed anchor discussion by very experienced 47 owners.

OK MyHarley, so in a nutshell what says the site regarding the N47 users?

Hint - some of us may have been on the foredeck of a well traveled N47 or other Ns.
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Old 11-30-2013, 09:22 AM   #90
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Tap into the Norhavn owners site. You will find a detailed anchor discussion by very experienced 47 owners.
Yahoo groups annoy the crap out of me, wish they would just have a regular forum like TF or CF.
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Old 11-30-2013, 11:36 AM   #91
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Many of the 2nd and 3rd generation N owners who have switched to rocnas needed to modify their pulpit rollers and lock down assemblies. All the info you need is archived there. No need to ask the same questions over and over.

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Old 11-30-2013, 11:39 AM   #92
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I've heard the "size matters" and "bigger is better" for ever. Those sayings must have started in the US Because we seem to come out of the womb worshiping the biggest things. Even living in the state w the biggest mountain gives bragging rights.

But w anchors it would seem so obvious that it shouldn't need mentioning however one hears it over and over again. I have two anchors that are over sized (35lbs for my boat (30')) and "bigger is better" no doubt motivated me to some extent but it's clear to me that design is the biggest element of excellent anchor performance. With two anchors the same except one being bigger any fool knows the bigger will hold the boat better. Of course being bigger means it's also heavier and heavy works the same way as bigger. Any anchor that is heavier will deliver better performance all other things being equal. So bigger or heavier is better ... no doubt and needs no discussion.

I hung on a 13lb anchor for a day and a half in a 50 knot gale and experienced no dragging or other performance shortcomings. Mud bottom as that anchor would set in none other. And it's common knowledge the Danforth by Fortress is the highest performance anchor in the world. So it's obvious that design is very important ... more important than big or heavy. I have used 7 or 8 different kinds of anchors and never dragged any of them but I attribute that anchoring success mostly to the fact that I've seldom anchored in windy conditions. So lots of anchoring w a given anchor does not prove it's holding performance but it does say a lot about it's setting abilities. And dependable setting is probably more important than holding capabilities most all of the time.

So any anchor discussion worth reading will be centered around the design of anchors both old and new. The majority of pleasure boaters use one of two anchors that are 50 years old. I think one of mine is 100 years old. But some new anchors have better holding power than most.

Most boats come w one of those two anchors when they are purchased so to get another anchor would cost money and perhaps require pulpit modification. And before they get around to buying new they discover theis old anchor works quite well. Or perhaps in their minds "well enough". The Danforth and Claws are much cheaper and most boaters find them completely satisfactory and refuse to spend the considerable extra money to get a new anchor so they remain on most boats and because of that they are the most common/popular anchors.

We here on TF aren't "average boaters" so more of us get new anchors but still it seems most of us continue to use proven older anchors. Perhaps a poll would be in order .. for primary anchors.
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Old 11-30-2013, 11:40 AM   #93
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Many of the 2nd and 3rd generation N owners who have switched to rocnas needed to modify their pulpit rollers and lock down assemblies. All the info you need is archived there. No need to ask the same questions over and over. Sent from my iPhone
Dont think I need to modify the pulpit, there's a N43 next to us and it's not modified and it has a ronca.
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Old 11-30-2013, 07:41 PM   #94
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The final decision is in, were going with a Ronca 70 that will be coupled with the 400 Ft of 3/8 chain on the boat already.
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:19 PM   #95
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The final decision is in, were going with a Ronca 70 that will be coupled with the 400 Ft of 3/8 chain on the boat already.
Assuming Rocna build issues are behind them, 70 kg sounds about right.
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:21 PM   #96
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Assuming Rocna build issues are behind them, 70 kg sounds about right.
3/8 chain should be fine right?
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:32 PM   #97
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3/8 chain should be fine right?
Alloy or 3B? You may want to swap ends since you're putting on a new anchor, assuming the near bitter end is in good shape.
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:37 PM   #98
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Alloy or 3B? You may want to swap ends since you're putting on a new anchor, assuming the near bitter end is in good shape.
Not sure, the chain looks fine as the boat was basically never used and just sat ( good and bad thing). Our windlass has a pulling weight of 3500LBs which i imagine should be enough.
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:51 PM   #99
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The 3500 should work fine. The anchor chain will have markings on the links, likely saying G4. G4 is the alloy, what you want. If the markings say 3B you may have a problem. Assuming Nordhavn sized the anchor and chain my guess is its G4. If in doubt, call N at Dana Point. They'll know what you have and need.
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Old 11-30-2013, 08:57 PM   #100
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The 3500 should work fine. The anchor chain will have markings on the links, likely saying G4. G4 is the alloy, what you want. If the markings say 3B you may have a problem. Assuming Nordhavn sized the anchor and chain my guess is its G4. If in doubt, call N at Dana Point. They'll know what you have and need.
Were going be at the boat tomorrow, I'll check it out. Thanks for informing me.
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