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Old 07-08-2012, 09:26 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Delfin View Post
For example, this swivel for 5/16" chain has a BL greater than the 5/16" chain. 360 Degree Anchor Swivel | Shackle.

I'm using the Suncor Universal model, for the reason stated earlier, to get the anchor aligned & up over the pulpit. It's a massive hunk of stainless. Breaking strength is something like 15,000#, I'm not sweating it.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:33 PM   #22
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Stayed on topic fine for 5 posts. Then it swiveled all over the place.

I think most skippers use chain primarily to help control catenary. And we established some time ago that the best place for the weight of the chain was about 80 percent of the way from the bow roller to the anchor shank. So ideally one would have a really big short piece of studded chain there and decending sizes of chain to each end or about half way to the bow roller. But ther'e are very few winches that will accommodate a rode made up of several different sizes. So for most boats I'd say about 30 or 40 feet of chain and the rest nylon line to be as close to optimum as possible w a spliced rode. And for those that don't trust the chain to line splice all chain would probably suffice. I would like to find a winch that had a gypsy/wildcat right next to each other to change from line to chain when the chain came up. There is not many but they are out there. I think there is no doubt that a combination rode is best and the real question is how to handle it.
Eric
How about a Kedge? Set your anchor, then slide a kedge down your rode to the desired 80% point. It seems to me it would be the simplest solution. I haven't used one, so in my case it is simply speculation.
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Old 07-08-2012, 09:46 PM   #23
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Eric
How about a Kedge? Set your anchor, then slide a kedge down your rode to the desired 80% point. It seems to me it would be the simplest solution. I haven't used one, so in my case it is simply speculation.
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Did you mean kellet? Kedge is usually the anchor that ungrounds you...

Definitions: If an anchor does not set well or hold well and tends to drag, some people will advise adding an anchor sentinel, angle, chum, buddy, rider, or kellet.
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Old 07-08-2012, 10:24 PM   #24
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Did you mean kellet? Kedge is usually the anchor that ungrounds you...

Definitions: If an anchor does not set well or hold well and tends to drag, some people will advise adding an anchor sentinel, angle, chum, buddy, rider, or kellet.
We acquired a New Zealand made "Anchor Buddy" with our boat. Our CQR anchor is so good (oops,there goes the thread) we`ve never used it,but I understand you slide it down the anchor chain,positioning it about a metre above the sea floor at low tide, it changes the pull on the anchor to be more horizontal and less likely to dislodge. Very important to secure the end of the line you lower it on, before letting it slide down. BruceK
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Old 07-08-2012, 10:37 PM   #25
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Did you mean kellet? Kedge is usually the anchor that ungrounds you...

Definitions: If an anchor does not set well or hold well and tends to drag, some people will advise adding an anchor sentinel, angle, chum, buddy, rider, or kellet.
psneeld
I stand corrected. I did in deed mean kellet. Seems like the best way to achieve optimum angle.
Thanks, Carey
PS-That's what I get for relying on my memory.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:44 AM   #26
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Definitions: If an anchor does not set well or hold well and tends to drag, some people will advise adding an anchor sentinel, angle, chum, buddy, rider, or kellet.

The added weight is useless as the chain becomes bar tight.

It will not reduce shock loads on the anchor in a blow.

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Old 07-09-2012, 06:47 AM   #27
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psneeld
I stand corrected. I did in deed mean kellet. Seems like the best way to achieve optimum angle.
Thanks, Carey
PS-That's what I get for relying on my memory.
Hey..never seen one used or used one myself so it's never in the forefront of my memory either!

The only reason I know the name so well is my sailing buddy who has all the toys has one. He is so proud of it even thogh he never anchors or cruises his 42 foot sailboat. I called it a sentinel when I saw it (from my readings) and he kept calling it a kellet. I wanted to throw it overboard just because he insisted on the stupid name and I knew he would never use it...
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:51 AM   #28
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Definitions: If an anchor does not set well or hold well and tends to drag, some people will advise adding an anchor sentinel, angle, chum, buddy, rider, or kellet.

The added weight is useless as the chain becomes bar tight.

It will not reduce shock loads on the anchor in a blow.

FF
Correct but they have other useful traits for non-storm conditions which most power boaters should be in 99-100 of the time...ESPECIALLY coastal cruisers...
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Old 07-09-2012, 08:59 AM   #29
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........... If one's anchor weighs about the same as the average bag of flour, maybe a swivel isn't needed. If it weighs a bit more, they are helpful in positioning the anchor before bringing it on board. .
OK, so how much does an "average bag of flour" weigh?

My anchor weighs 33 lb. Is that more or less than an average bag of flour?
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Old 07-09-2012, 09:03 AM   #30
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Rope can twist. Chain might twist a bit, but it will straighten out as it passes through the windlass (assuming you have a windlass). If there is any rotary tension on the chain, the anchor will begin spinning to relieve that tension as soon as it disengages from the sea bottom. If necessary, one can pause and let the anshor spin to it's natural position once the anchor clears the water.

At that point, bring it up the rest of the way, secure it, and move on.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:07 PM   #31
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OK, so how much does an "average bag of flour" weigh?

My anchor weighs 33 lb. Is that more or less than an average bag of flour?
According to my girlfriend, your anchor weighs 33 bags of flour.
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:26 PM   #32
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According to my girlfriend, your anchor weighs 33 bags of flour.
That sounds like a henway!
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Old 07-09-2012, 12:32 PM   #33
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That sounds like a henway!
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:22 PM   #34
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Rope can twist. Chain might twist a bit, but it will straighten out as it passes through the windlass (assuming you have a windlass). If there is any rotary tension on the chain, the anchor will begin spinning to relieve that tension as soon as it disengages from the sea bottom. If necessary, one can pause and let the anshor spin to it's natural position once the anchor clears the water.

At that point, bring it up the rest of the way, secure it, and move on.
Wish it were so. Then I wouldn't need a swivel. My 176# anchor with 1/2" G4 doesn't spin to it's natural position once it clears the water. Perhaps it doesn't know what its natural position is, or perhaps it is a pervert. Beats me, but the swivel is helpful, and since it is stronger than the chain I don't worry about it giving way before the bow sheers off. If my anchor weighed 33 pounds, the question of whether to swivel or not to swivel would be moot.
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Old 07-26-2012, 07:31 AM   #35
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300ft of chain plus the weight of the anchor will require a robust windlas.

Great for use in coral areas , or where the water is usually over 50 ft deep and the reduced swing circle is a help.

Before purchasing the chain look in Skeenes to be sure you have the chain locker space , and correct design for the chain to store and run out easily.

Then install a 3/4 HP ,,1 inch deck wash pump to ease scrubbing the smelly mud off the chain , every time its recovered , as its being recovered, a slow process..

5/16 chain is not especially strong , so a set of storm anchors and anchor rodes will need to be aboard.
In a Hurricane area , you will need that gear too.

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Old 07-26-2012, 01:14 PM   #36
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300ft of chain plus the weight of the anchor will require a robust windlas.



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Well,, not really. The ony chain the windlass has to lift is the chain between the pulpit and the bottom. Even if you put out a mile of it, the only chain the windlass is lifting is the section between the boat and the bottom. So the windlass only needs to be strong enough to lift that amount of chain plus the weight of the anchor. Naturally you'd want a safety factor, so you wouldn't size a windlass to be able to lift that weight and no more. And of course the weight will vary with the anchoring depth, so that has to be taken into account.

We carry 200' of all-chain rode (should really be 250-300 feet but when we bought it we didn't know what we know now) but the most chain the windlass has ever had to lift is probably 40-50 feet. The anchor weighs 44 pounds out of the water.
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Old 07-26-2012, 01:34 PM   #37
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I bought a cheap little anchor capstan and the other day wiggled the drum and found it kinda loose. If it was that loose when it was new I think I would have noticed it. It's always worked but has always made an awful racket. The planetary gears probably have something to do w that. I'm about ready to replace it anyway.
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Old 07-27-2012, 08:44 AM   #38
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Well,, not really. The ony chain the windlass has to lift is the chain between the pulpit and the bottom. Even if you put out a mile of it, the only chain the windlass is lifting is the section between the boat and the bottom. So the windlass only needs to be strong enough to lift that amount of chain plus the weight of the anchor. Naturally you'd want a safety factor, so you wouldn't size a windlass to be able to lift that weight and no more. And of course the weight will vary with the anchoring depth, so that has to be taken into account.

We carry 200' of all-chain rode (should really be 250-300 feet but when we bought it we didn't know what we know now) but the most chain the windlass has ever had to lift is probably 40-50 feet. The anchor weighs 44 pounds out of the water.
Assuming of course, that the operator knows to pull the boat over the anchor under power when raising it and not to use the windlass to pull the boat to the anchor.
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Old 07-27-2012, 11:50 AM   #39
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Or to raise some chain with the windlass, then stop the windlass and let the weight of the chain settling back down to the bottom start moving the boat forward, raise some more chain, the boat continues to move forward, and so on until you're over the anchor. This is what we do unless there is suffiicent wind or current to prevent the boat from coasting forward. Then we'll use a bit of power to move the boat forward. But most of the time we simply let the weight of the chain pull us forward as we raise the rode in increments.
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Old 07-27-2012, 12:04 PM   #40
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Or to raise some chain with the windlass, then stop the windlass and let the weight of the chain settling back down to the bottom to start moving the boat forward, raise some more chain, the boat continues to move forward, and so on until you're over the anchor. This is what we do unless there is suffiicent wind or current to prevent the boat from coasting forward. Then we'll use a bit of power to move the boat forward. But most of the time we simply let the weight of the chain pull us forward as we raise the rode in increments.
That's pretty much our approach as well. Plus a bit of thruster to keep the vessel in line. We use a 1/2" snub line about 30 feet long that attaches with a shackle to the chain. We'll bring that on board first and while we're detaching the shackle and coiling the snubber, the boat has generally moved forward sufficiently that it is standing over the anchor, at least in most wind/tide conditions.
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