Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 02-26-2014, 11:18 AM   #41
Guru
 
skipperdude's Avatar
 
City: Whittier AK
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Apache II
Vessel Model: 1974 Donald Jones
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,147
I have seen the claw or Bruce anchors with the rode attached up near the fluks to that little hole. With the rode fastened to the end of the anchor using plastic wire ties. So the chain runs along the top of the shank. I suppose if you are really snagged the wire ties break and you are able to lift the anchor by the fluke end rather than the actual shank end part of the anchor. Kind of hard to explain without pictures.

I have never tried it but it looks like it could really work.

SD
Attached Images
 
__________________
Advertisement

__________________
If you can't repair it maybe it shouldn't be on the boat
skipperdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 11:30 AM   #42
Veteran Member
 
Jim Gandee's Avatar
 
City: Los Angeles
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Fire Escape
Vessel Model: Bayliner 3888
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 80
Good info on anchor retrieval method, I'll file that one! In only ten feet though, I'd don my mask and fins and just dive for it.
__________________

Jim Gandee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 11:38 AM   #43
Veteran Member
 
Jim Gandee's Avatar
 
City: Los Angeles
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Fire Escape
Vessel Model: Bayliner 3888
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 80
Alaskan,
That motorized anchor bouy looks very interesting. The only drawback that I can see is the line is only 80lb monofilament. I doubt that'd be strong enough for a trip line. The gadget is solar powered and includes an automatic nightlight. Pretty cool!
Jim Gandee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 12:38 PM   #44
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,707
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipperdude View Post
I have seen the claw or Bruce anchors with the rode attached up near the fluks to that little hole. With the rode fastened to the end of the anchor using plastic wire ties. So the chain runs along the top of the shank. I suppose if you are really snagged the wire ties break and you are able to lift the anchor by the fluke end rather than the actual shank end part of the anchor. Kind of hard to explain without pictures.

I have never tried it but it looks like it could really work.

SD
Dude,
I've seen that done a lot in SE. I'm not a fan.

The attach point is not nearly as strong as the proper end of the fluke. The trip line anchor point on a Claw is very a small appendage compared to the customary rode end and most likely would be pulled sideways if/when the ties break. That would make it even more vulnerable. A proper sized shackle may not fit in the trip line hole on some brands, most brands, or even all brands. A smaller shackle is another weak link. One of the important features of the Claw anchor (I think) is it's robustness. I use mine as a rock anchor.

What size of plastic ties to use? Too weak and the ties break while setting the anchor and of course then it won't set. Or break while anchored. Not good. Too strong and there's few problems (other than the weak attach point) but the anchor may become more stuck or entangled in the tree, rocks or whatever on the bottom before the ties break and you start to do your extraction. Not much downside if the ties are really strong but they can still break when you don't want them to and then the anchor will pull out and perhaps make you part of an "event".

Like I said it's very common in SE AK but as I see it Claws are so cheap (you can get a 44# for less than $150 at WM) I'm inclined to use the anchor as it was intended. And if I had (I don't) a Manson Ray (the only expensive Claw) I'd use a trip line or go risky. I think the Ray's are considerably cheaper than they were though.
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 12:48 PM   #45
Guru
 
skipperdude's Avatar
 
City: Whittier AK
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Apache II
Vessel Model: 1974 Donald Jones
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,147
I see your points. Perhaps just a stout trip line attached to a bouy with it tied to the end by the fluke.
If you can't pull it by the shank end it could be tripped.

Or Pull upon the anchor to 0 scope cleat it off and let the wave action pull it free. This has work for me.

SD
__________________
If you can't repair it maybe it shouldn't be on the boat
skipperdude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 01:35 PM   #46
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,360
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipperdude View Post
Or Pull upon the anchor to 0 scope cleat it off and let the wave action pull it free. This has work for me.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 01:55 PM   #47
Guru
 
HiDHo's Avatar
 
City: Scottsboro, Al.
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hi-D-Ho
Vessel Model: 1987 Krogen Manatee
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 734
We cruise and anchor on the Tennessee river using all chain and a 45 lb CQR so we always use a trip line and buoy and adjust the length of the trip line based on the depth of the anchorage. When TVA clear cut prior to building the system of lock and dams they left the stumps and these will definitely snag your anchor and are found in the best anchorages.
HiDHo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 01:56 PM   #48
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Gandee View Post
Alaskan,
That motorized anchor bouy looks very interesting. The only drawback that I can see is the line is only 80lb monofilament. I doubt that'd be strong enough for a trip line. The gadget is solar powered and includes an automatic nightlight. Pretty cool!

All it does is float, so 80lb should be more than enough. When you let your anchor down, it just releases line and has this neat lights on it for night. Then when you pull your anchor a little motor rolls in the line and parks on top of your anchor.
__________________
1988 M/Y Camargue Yacht Fisher
Alaskan Sea-Duction
MMSI: 338131469
Blog: http://alaskanseaduction.blogspot.com/
Alaskan Sea-Duction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 03:55 PM   #49
Guru
 
City: North Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipperdude View Post
I have seen the claw or Bruce anchors with the rode attached up near the fluks to that little hole. With the rode fastened to the end of the anchor using plastic wire ties. So the chain runs along the top of the shank. I suppose if you are really snagged the wire ties break and you are able to lift the anchor by the fluke end rather than the actual shank end part of the anchor. Kind of hard to explain without pictures.

I have never tried it but it looks like it could really work.

SD
That's fine in the daytime if you stay on the boat. Not so good for sleeping or leaving the boat because the ties can break and the anchor will dislodge on its own.
rwidman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 06:16 PM   #50
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,561
Quote:
Originally Posted by manyboats View Post
Peter,
Looks like we don't need those slotted shank anchors. Just a loop of chain and some basic can do. I actually block off the slot w a bolt up near the rode end on my Manson. I don't use the hole for the non-slot option as I feel the small increase in throat angle is or may be worth having for better short scope work. Probably sets better w the hole and slightly smaller throat angle. I'd be tempted to use the open slot w a SARCA though. More stable design I think.
Interesting. The Super Sarca comes with a heavy bolt fitted to the slot, you can keep it, remove it (as I did) or fix it where you like along the slot. Can`t see the point in recovery lines if the slot provides for recovery.
Sarca say fit a ss shackle (not provided) to attach the chain rode, pin in the slot. I made sure to get a good Ronstan (non Chinese) shackle, with a rating.
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 06:39 PM   #51
Guru
 
Nomad Willy's Avatar
 
City: Concrete Washington State
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,707
BruceK,
SS shackles are for yachties. Galvanized are best for electrolysis concerns unless you have SS anchor chain and anchor. And Gal is stronger I'm quite sure.

Really .... so Rex gives those that don't trust his design a bolt. I'd trust the SARCA in my sleep.

But re the slot and recovery I think the trip line is better "positioned" to pull the anchor out. On many or most anchors the shackle hole for the trip line puts the line in a better position to extract the anchor backwards. Ideally the trip line attach point should be basically as low and far aft as practical. The Rocna's set up fairly well for this. But I could be wrong. Maybe the attach point should be higher and further fwd????
__________________
Eric

North Western Washington State USA
Nomad Willy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 07:10 PM   #52
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,561
Quote:
Originally Posted by manyboats View Post
BruceK,
SS shackles are for yachties. Galvanized are best for electrolysis concerns unless you have SS anchor chain and anchor. And Gal is stronger I'm quite sure.

Really .... so Rex gives those that don't trust his design a bolt. I'd trust the SARCA in my sleep.
I do trust the Sarca in my sleep, have to. Anchor, swivel, rode, are gal.
I`d rather Sarca included the shackle than the bolt.Sarca back the anchor but I think not a 3rd party made shackle, the bolt is less critical. Rex was clear on a ss shackle, maybe for hardness/ non wearing, as the pin slides along the slot. So far so good, easy keeping an eye on the connections.
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 07:15 PM   #53
TF Site Team
 
dimer2's Avatar
 
City: Houston
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Baobab
Vessel Model: Bayliner 4788
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,193
I am no chemist but practical sailor says...

"Mixing and matching stainless steel and galvanized mild steel chain, shackles, and anchors is interesting from a galvanic corrosion point of view. It’s true that stainless steel becomes less noble when submerged, but the zinc galvanizing will be the least noble metal in the mix, and in salt water, its rate of electrolytic disappearance may be slightly increased."
__________________
No one who achieves success does so without acknowledging the help of others.
dimer2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2014, 08:56 PM   #54
Guru
 
High Wire's Avatar
 
City: Cape May, NJ and Englewood, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Irish Lady
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,598
Quote:
Originally Posted by FF View Post
There is a nice anchorage near the USCG station at Cape May NJ.

The fun is the USCG has been dumping scrap probably for decades ,in the bay.
Hey now! Don't be burning my flounder spots!
FWIW, there is lots of junk there from the many dredges that anchor between the base docks and inlet each year.
High Wire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2014, 06:06 AM   #55
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,515
FWIW, there is lots of junk there from the many dredges that anchor between the base docks and inlet each year.

And most of it is big and heavy , so its an anchor trip line or a visit to Worst Marine .
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2014, 06:07 AM   #56
Member
 
dodo's Avatar
 
City: Vienna
Country: Austria
Vessel Name: DODO
Vessel Model: Selene 40
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 17
OK, before it becomes a new anchor thread, here is the European solution of an anchor-buoy:
Selbstaufrollende Ankerboje

Expensive, comes from Switzerland, but with a reasonable retriev line...

Karl
dodo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2014, 06:49 AM   #57
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,669
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
Quote:
Originally Posted by dimer2 View Post
I am no chemist but practical sailor says...

"Mixing and matching stainless steel and galvanized mild steel chain, shackles, and anchors is interesting from a galvanic corrosion point of view. Itís true that stainless steel becomes less noble when submerged, but the zinc galvanizing will be the least noble metal in the mix, and in salt water, its rate of electrolytic disappearance may be slightly increased."
Take it from me, personal experience 10 yrs now - backed up by many others, including Rex of Anchorright, makers of Sarca, in practice, mixing stainless and galv in the final attachment to the anchor is a non-issue. Most of the time they are out of water and dry, so unless you were swinging on the hook 24/7 x 365, I doubt you would ever see any galvanic activity.
The stainless shackle is because with galv on galv there is too much friction for reliable tripping using the slot when needed, hence giving the lie to any real concern of it tripping by accident when not wanted.
However, Rex has advised me that the really large anchor sizes, i.e. above about #8, this is not an issue because of the weight and extra forces involved, so galv shackle can be used. Must be correct shape and size of course, and definitely with pin/bolt through the slot.
__________________
Pete
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2014, 07:03 AM   #58
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,515
I would never worry about a galv shackle on a SS anchor ,

for me the fear of SS welding , doing what welded SS does crevace corrosion , and the anchor falling to pieces under a load would be more of a concern.

BUT yes SS does look great dockside.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2014, 02:01 PM   #59
Guru
 
River Cruiser's Avatar
 
City: UMR MM283
Country: US
Vessel Name: Northern Lights II
Vessel Model: Bayliner 3870
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,226
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
I'll tell you an anchor retrival method that worked for me, several years ago we were anchored at Rabbit Island just east of New Orleans. We had spent the night on the hook in about 10' of water. The "hook" was a virgin 45 # Delta on 5/16" chain. When we got ready to leave it was hooked solid on what I believe was a piece of an abandoned oil rig, those who have been by Rabbit Is. will know the rusting hulk I am talking about. For about 45 min. I tried pulling from every angle and could not get it to budge. I was going for the hacksaw when I remembered a suggestion fellow list member Charles from Patterson La. had given me years ago. Onboard I had a piece of 1/4" chain about 2' long, with it I made a loop around the anchor chain just outside of the bow roller with a shackle and fastened it to the end of a piece of 1/2" dock line. With the windlass I pulled the boat up tight so the anchor chain was vertical and lowered the loop down to the anchor, the chain, and anchor shank, being vertical let the loop slip down over the anchor shank. Then I loosened a good bit of anchor chain and keeping the 1/2" dock line fairly tight I drove the boat forward and the anchor came free right away. So I was able to save the brand new Delta and continue without too much delay. It worked for me then, I haven't had to use it since, maybe someone else can benefit, Thanks you again Charles!! P. S. Boatpoker: if you read this Jon & Candace on Isle of Skye spent the night at anchor with us that night we travelled eastward together till Ft Myers
This is the method I've planned to use if ever needed, so far we haven't snagged anything yet. The only thing I may do different is use the 17' center console we tow to pull it out. I'am happy to read that someone else has used this method with success, I have 300' chain rode and really don't want to donate any to the water gods.
__________________
Ron on Northern Lights II
I don't like making plans for the day because the word "premeditated" gets thrown around in the courtroom.
River Cruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2014, 02:16 AM   #60
TF Site Team
 
FlyWright's Avatar
 
City: California Delta and SF Bay
Country: Sacramento, CA, USA (boat in Vallejo)
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,170
Quote:
Originally Posted by skipperdude View Post
I have seen the claw or Bruce anchors with the rode attached up near the fluks to that little hole. With the rode fastened to the end of the anchor using plastic wire ties. So the chain runs along the top of the shank. I suppose if you are really snagged the wire ties break and you are able to lift the anchor by the fluke end rather than the actual shank end part of the anchor. Kind of hard to explain without pictures.

I have never tried it but it looks like it could really work.

SD
They sell an Anchor Saver that performs similarly.

__________________

__________________
Al

Custom Google Trawler Forum Search
FlyWright is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012