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Old 04-24-2014, 01:42 PM   #41
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The Bahamian moor was probably developed when most of us were in diapers....or certainly way before.

Sure if the rodes tangle it's a mess...even a bigger mess if you let your boat sink overnight...it is NOT an anchor fore and aft in the strictest sense. Plus...it's not really a long term anchoring technique...but for awhile, if monitored can be fine.

I just can't believe some responses and total lack of thinking just how smart some of the rest of us are.

Any anchoring situation requires oversight..and hopefully if using a Bahamian moor..you have the foresight to know in 24 hours how and when you are going to swing. If in doubt...either don't do it or monitor the rodes carefully.

It was developed for specific reasons, not for just any old situation....however it can be adapted it you are smart enough.
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Old 04-24-2014, 05:02 PM   #42
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Folks that have a problem with a Bahama moore need to refine the technique a bit.

On our boat the fwd anchor is deployed as normal.60CQR , 60H Danforth or 60 Bruce.

The stern anchor , usually a Danforth 20H is simply lowered from the stern.

The anchor 3/8 or 7/16 line is walked coiled fwd to the bow.

A tug on the aft line will set the anchor , depending on the water depth scope is paid out and the line secured on the bow.

The stern line scope is either tossed in the water or laid on the fwd deck to go over as needed.

In the AM on departure it takes zero effort to coil the line , pass the coil over or under the larger line and thats it.

In a narrow river its usually 12+ hours so you are on the bow anchor that was set first.

The stern line is walked aft and coiled as you go and the 20H is simply hand pulled as the stern is once again over it so its a simple yank to upset. A sailboat sheet winch P&S is the next upgrade


Should the wind have shifted 180 deg the stern anchor line (now bow line )is simply uncoiled some more until you are over the bow , and the windlass hauls it into its chocks.

The windlass is now used (mine is hyd) OR the boat motored over the old stern anchor till straight up and snubbed.

Way will break out the anchor , which can now be carried with its line aft for the next night.
Even in more open conditions when the 35H is used its no big deal to carry aft and stow.

The stern anchor is a nice emergency brake , we deploy it when waiting for the rare bridge (air height under 12FT) to open on time.

For an extreme wind abeam with the set deployed simply adding scope fore and aft works well , and a bonus is they will hold the boat head to the high wind with no dodging.

Cant get better than THAT!
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Old 04-24-2014, 06:33 PM   #43
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FF,
I'm trying to get my head around this. How do you "toss scope"?

What are you doing on the bow w the stern anchor line? Why don't you make the stern rode fast at the stern?

Sounds like you're drifting aft on current to pull the light stern anchor.

If the current changed you'd need to put the stern anchor line on a floating ball, go fwd and weigh the bow anchor as usual and go back for the stern anchor on the ball.

I'd like to know what you're talking about. Am I even close?
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Old 04-24-2014, 06:37 PM   #44
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FF,
I'm trying to get my head around this. How do you "toss scope"?

What are you doing on the bow w the stern anchor line? Why don't you make the stern rode fast at the stern?

Sounds like you're drifting aft on current to pull the light stern anchor.

If the current changed you'd need to put the stern anchor line on a floating ball, go fwd and weigh the bow anchor as usual and go back for the stern anchor on the ball.

I'd like to know what you're talking about. Am I even close?
Because then it wouldn't be a Bahamian Moor...it would be a stern anchor....
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Old 04-24-2014, 07:14 PM   #45
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Folks that have a problem with a Bahama moore need to refine the technique a bit.
You lost me at hand setting an anchor then hoping the stern anchor sets itself properly when the tide shifts, leaving line coiled on deck to, hopefully, pay out on it's own and using 3/8 or 7/16 line for anchor line. But I guess that system may work on a small boat.

The reality is Bahamian moors are rarely used or needed. And if there are other boats anchored near you and they are not moored the same way as you, it could make for a long night with lots of shouting.

Of course now that I think about it what you describe is not really what is though of as a Bahamian moor. In a Bahamian moor as I've known it, both anchors are set and the boat is set almost equally between them so that when the tide shifts the boat changes position very little between the two anchors. Hence, the boat is moored in place.

In your example, at least the way I read it, your boat is going to drift quite a ways before coming tight on the stern anchor. And then drift back a ways again, if you stay long enough for the tide to change back, before coming tight on the bow anchor again.

That is not what I would call a Bahamian moor.

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Old 04-24-2014, 08:12 PM   #46
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Any anchoring situation requires oversight..and hopefully if using a Bahamian moor..you have the foresight to know in 24 hours how and when you are going to swing. If in doubt...either don't do it or monitor the rodes carefully.
I'd say monitoring is about your only choice. Because even Carnac the Magnificent is not going to be able to tell you exactly how your boat is going to swing potentially multiple times in 24 hours after you've anchored.
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Old 04-24-2014, 08:28 PM   #47
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I'd say monitoring is about your only choice. Because even Carnac the Magnificent is not going to be able to tell you exactly how your boat is going to swing potentially multiple times in 24 hours after you've anchored.
I'm no Carnak but I know which way the tide runs and much of the time the way the wind blows...so...yes I have a pretty good predictor of which way I'll swing..not always but much of the time...

The Bahamian moor was desveloped for a reason...do you know what it was for without Chapman's or Wikipedia?

And who says they aren't used much???..we have has a few on here say they use them when appropriate.
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Old 04-24-2014, 08:46 PM   #48
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The idea here is to share your perspective and knowledge and not necessarily attempt to drive everyone else to your point of view.

Your points have been made now let's get over it and move on.
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Old 04-24-2014, 09:11 PM   #49
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The Bahamian moor was desveloped for a reason...do you know what it was for without Chapman's or Wikipedia?

And who says they aren't used much???..we have has a few on here say they use them when appropriate.
Why yes, I was fully aware of what it is and what it's used for without having to Google it. I've even used it once or twice myself.

I did not say they were not used at all. And I stand by my statement that it is not used that often. I think I can count on two hands (OK maybe I'd need to use a toe or two) the number of boats I've seen anchored that way in the last 40 years or so of boating. Even in the Bahamas.

If done right and any other close by boats are using it, it can be a useful technique in some specific situations.
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Old 04-25-2014, 06:37 AM   #50
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>You lost me at hand setting an anchor then hoping the stern anchor sets itself properly when the tide shifts,<

We have had great luck, if the stern anchor is firm with a hand pull it does not need 100HP and a 2000lb tug to set any better.

What amazes me is anchoring in the AICW where the stream chosen for O nite is perhaps 100 ft wide the boat (50ft) turns with the tide and has never (that we could hear or observe) touched either bank.

Even with a 45 ft tri that was 24 ft wide , it has never been a problem.

Yes a true Bahama moore would stretch the stern anchor further out than just the length of the boat , but inshore in 10 or 15 ft of water the boats 50 ft plus 20-50 ft more line keeps the boat in basically one place.

Far better in the crowded NE than 100ft of line 50 ft of boat and a 300ft clear circle requirement.
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Old 05-19-2014, 12:52 AM   #51
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Sounds like the rope portion of the equation was not properly maintained. Old, frayed or salt water soaked never allowed to dry out. I believe that is the issue. I replace mine every couple of years. If the rope is very stiff. I soak is fresh water and rinse. then allow to air dry before storing in the anchor locker. After a few years I replace the rope and chain. New is now main anchor old is back up.
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Old 05-19-2014, 02:38 AM   #52
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I have a new 600' 5/8" line at West waiting for pickup, along with a 22 lb Rocna for a secondary. It will stow much more nicely than the Danforth below decks. No reason for not going all chain? How about too small a boat for that much weight in the bow? I hadn't thought of having to cut away my anchor line either, though the currents many places would make that a concern. I am still on the hard in Homer, cutlass bearing done and rudder and shoe back in place. Hoping to launch by the end of the week! See you in the Sound in July ksanders:-)
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Old 05-19-2014, 07:13 AM   #53
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I have a new 600' 5/8" line at West waiting for pickup, along with a 22 lb Rocna for a secondary.

Hopefully the 5/8 line is for a far larger anchor than a 22 pounder.

The joy of nylon is its ability to stretch and lower shock loads , which requires about 10% to 15% of the ropes breaking rating to begin to stretch.

5/8 for a 60+ pound anchor , fine , for 22 lbs it might as well be a steel wire .
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Old 05-19-2014, 09:25 AM   #54
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FF says re 5/8" nylon line "for 22 lbs it might as well be a steel wire".

Grab a 40' length (or even 20-30) tie off one end and the lean back and pull on it. It's like a big bungee. Lots of stretch. At least that's my experience.

I have 5/8' nylon Brait (type of weave) line and usually anchor w 18 to 22lb anchors. Unlike chain the low weight of nylon line permits one to use larger than needed. Many skippers using chain, especially all chain use smaller chain because of the expense and weight. I think a boat's performance is more adversely effected by chain weight in the bow than most but I've said that before.
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Old 05-19-2014, 10:57 AM   #55
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I've got 240 feet of rusty 3/8" chain. I could replace it with nylon but I would need a whole more of it as nylon needs more scope than chain and the chain locker is full up now.
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Old 05-19-2014, 11:10 AM   #56
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I have a new 600' 5/8" line at West waiting for pickup, along with a 22 lb Rocna for a secondary.

Hopefully the 5/8 line is for a far larger anchor than a 22 pounder.

The joy of nylon is its ability to stretch and lower shock loads , which requires about 10% to 15% of the ropes breaking rating to begin to stretch.

5/8 for a 60+ pound anchor , fine , for 22 lbs it might as well be a steel wire .
When you pull your anchor by hand, the added thickness of the 5/8" rode lessens the wear and tear on your hands. I like to anchor in places that don't test my system, so I am little concerned with stretch, just swing. I am almost always alone in my anchorage, and my primary anchor is a 33 lb Rocna, the 22 is for my stern line (400' 5/8" nylon with chain and snap hook for shore ties). The joys of nylon include your ability to store it, pull it by hand, splice it yourself, and it doesn't rust in the box. Steel wire doesn't handle well...
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Old 05-19-2014, 01:48 PM   #57
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Doug,
I agree 5/8ths is easier to handle.
If I had your two anchors I'd make the 22 my primary and keep the big mamma for gales over 50 knots or short scope anchoring in very small anchorages.

However my last new idea was a 33lb main on a short (150') chain rode hooked to a standard winch. And use my present 435' nylon rode and for me gale proof anchor (XYZ) for the hard blows.

In Alaska I like your 600' rode and when your engine quits you may wish you had double that. If PWS is anything like some places in SE (500' deep (50' from the rock face (shore)) you'll be better off w a very long Rode.

Where do you store your 33 R when underway?

How much chain do you hand pull w that 33R? Every time I've pulled my 35lb anchor I've thought it (although very doable) too much to do regularly.
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Old 05-20-2014, 07:18 AM   #58
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>I agree 5/8ths is easier to handle.<

, but few pull the anchor by HAND.

Makes little difference to the drum of the windlass if 3/8 or 3/4 is wrapped , and little difference to your hand if all you are doing is tailing the line.
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Old 05-21-2014, 02:08 AM   #59
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I use 20' of 5/16 Hi test on my primary and 25' of 1/4" on the stern line. I would use a lot more if I had a windlass, but I am truly pulling it "by hand". I get over the top and do a straight lift, sometimes wrapping it off for a moment or two. I used to shoe a lot of horses, still shoe a few. What doesn't kill you makes you strong! The anchor is on the roller, spare in the stern on top of the stern rode. I do try to anchor only once a day, I think the coffee helps get it up...
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Old 02-08-2015, 05:06 AM   #60
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Continue to observe the rope/chain vs all chain differences in dragging among the cruisers. (I ignore the frequent dragging by the charterers.) Rodney Bay St. Lucia normally has 15kt winds. A couple of days this week 30kts was sustained for hours.

Three cruisers dragged. Two of the cruisers had chain/rope rodes. In both cases the rope separated. One of the boats had only 40 feet of chain. Captain didn't want to weigh down the bow. That boat was saved from the rocks by a local fisherman with a 75 hp outboard after a couple of dinghies failed to tow the boat.

The other rope separation occurred at the bow roller. Boat saved by bringing another anchor and rode.

The all chain rode dragging was captain error. First time anchoring this season and the captain misremembered his color codes for the amount of chain he had out. He is a regular so he was anchored in our pack and was saved when a couple of us saw his boat was moving. He cleared Bay Pelican by 30 feet.

Accepting my memory is not what it use to be I have a small plastic sign with my color code on it.
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