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Old 03-04-2016, 06:37 PM   #21
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Mako, what did you decide, in a recess or not?

Do you have a picture or drawing that shows the design of the winch and the anchor?
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Old 03-05-2016, 12:39 AM   #22
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Hello Hong Kong.

I won't be creating a "pocket" for the anchor to sit in the hawser hole, but honestly I have not decided yet whether to mount flush (to port, not starboard) or just to mount centerline on a bow roller. Both have advantages and disadvantages especially when I start thinking long term and flexibility. I don't have the latest design drawings with me but below are two of my older drafts that I was using to take dimensions off of. I will be installing a 1 meter long leader of 1" stud-link, and I prefer that it not touch the captive reel winch. The drum will be full of nylon rode and 3/8" HT.
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Old 03-05-2016, 02:11 AM   #23
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If you decide on the side anchor - is there a best angle or best place for the hawse pipe to allow the anchor shank to just drops out of the pipe, or is the location and angle of the pipe based on the shape of the bow and anchor dimensions?

Is there an easy way to use an anchor bridle on the side anchor?
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Old 03-05-2016, 02:55 AM   #24
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I'm not a designer so I can't answer exactly, but to my logic the hawsehole should be at an angle of about 35 degrees to the hull plating, so they fit snug, and so that the flukes don't bang around in seas. But I will leave the final design details to my naval architect.

I was wondering the same thing about the bridle/snubber line. I seriously doubt it would be practical to use one if all-chain, although if one were preparing for a storm then it could be deployed. The problem is that it would inhibit quick retrieval in case you need to reset the anchor. At this time I'm planning on using a nylon rode however. Am leaning towards the bow roller although it certainly doesn't look as cool
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Old 03-05-2016, 05:51 AM   #25
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When I bought my 1973 Grand banks 50 (28 tons) it came with a ca. 60 kg. Navy anchor mounted on the bow roller. It was quite difficult to raise as the bow roller was not articulated. One had to "help" the anchor on to the pulpit by swinging it with a rope looped around a fluke while bringing the chain in with the windlass.

I believe adding an articulated bow roller would have solved the raising problem and also make the launching more smooth.

But, the bigger problem was the anchor would often drag, even in moderate winds. The first summer, in Croatia, it dragged at least three times. By the end I had no confidence whatsoever in the anchor.

So the following summer I replaced it with a 40 kg. Rocna which sets quickly and solidly and hasn't dragged.

Having said this, with the PO the boat was skippered by a professional who used the Navy anchor for 20 years or so and liked it a lot. In fact when I replaced it I gave it to him to use in a boat he was building.

The flukes on the HHP Stockless anchor do seem a lot more business-like than the ones on my old Navy anchor, sharper and wider, so probably much better at digging and holding.
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Old 03-05-2016, 06:03 AM   #26
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Halcyon

Thanks for the feedback on the articulated roller. I will need to look into that further, but I think a lot has to do with the angle that the anchor rests in. For my design it will have a slight down angle so it might not be an issue, but definitely needs looking into.

BTW, there's no doubt that the Rocna is an excellent anchor and that's one reason why I might pursue the roller so that I could always switch anchor types in the future, if desired. However, from what I've experienced with the Navy anchor, it is really inferior and only works as deadweight. The AC-14 that my shipyard is providing actually does a good job of digging in. It's included as base in the price of my build so I'm going to see how it works.

Thanks.
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Old 03-05-2016, 07:08 AM   #27
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I think a Danforth 90H would pull into the anchor well , and would be totally suitable for your boat.
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Old 03-06-2016, 06:22 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makobuilders View Post
My shipbuilder is providing this anchor style, proposing a 60kg weight for my 15 meter (50 ft) 60 ton trawler. Offhand I feel this is too light for a stockless, but does anyone have experience with this style of anchor?
Personally, I would still seriously consider the Sarca Excel or even a Super with roll bar.
For your size of boat, and using an articulated roller assembly, as someone else mentioned, you would have a superb all-round performer either way.

The suggested size for your vessel is as follows...
SARCA Excel No 15, L = 27.0 - 29.0, and tonnage = 42 - 57 Ton = 88kg anchor.

Actually your vessel is quite heavy for a 15m or 50' boat, as their recommendations for a 15m vessel is actually only a Excel #7, which is only 36kg, (80lb), because most boats of that length are only about 20-24 tons, so I presume your boat is steel.

The Excel #15 is usually good for a boat about 28m, or ~ 100 feet.

Actually, call me biased, because I have used one for 12 years, but I would go for the Super Sarca # 13....

Super SARCA Anchor No 13, i.e. 74kg or ~ 163lb, for boats 30.0 - 36.0 m = up to 120ft, and weight of 42-60 Tons. Agricultural looking I grant you, but boy they work.

If they can anchor this sucker...boat in pic top right...it'd anchor yours I suspect...
Super SARCA Anchor - anchorright.com.au

Actually, even for a boat of your weight 60ton, the #13 is probably overkill, and the #11 @ 60kg would probably do fine.
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Old 03-06-2016, 08:51 AM   #29
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Xlantic, Mako,
Here are some pics of anchors that identify the Navy anchor and two others that I've seen a lot of.

Pic #1 and 2 are standard stockless anchors.
Pic #3 is a Navy anchor. Notice the unique fluke shape. I think pic #4 is a Navy also. Looks like the flukes match the Navy profile and notice also the vertical "ears" at the base of the anchor that I think are also a feature on the Navy anchor.
Pics three and four are of my Dreadnought anchor very similar to the Halls ship anchor.
Xlantic I think your old anchor was a Halls.
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Old 03-06-2016, 09:26 AM   #30
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Xlantic I think your old anchor was a Halls.
Yes, it does look like a Halls more than a Navy.

Speaking of of old fashioned anchor designs, my boat also came with a Fisherman anchor which i occasionally use in rocky bottoms.
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Old 03-06-2016, 09:41 AM   #31
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Speaking of of old fashioned anchor designs, my boat also came with a Fisherman anchor which i occasionally use in rocky bottoms.
Always read that fishermen were good for kelp and rocks but never heard of anyone actually using one. So you actually do use it and like it for that purpose? Now that you have the Rocna have there been occasions where the magical roll-bar anchor needed to be switched out to the old school one?
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Old 03-06-2016, 11:49 AM   #32
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Always read that fishermen were good for kelp and rocks but never heard of anyone actually using one. So you actually do use it and like it for that purpose? Now that you have the Rocna have there been occasions where the magical roll-bar anchor needed to be switched out to the old school one?
Actually, in the one season I've had the Rocna I have not had a need to use the Fisherman as the Rocna has always set quickly and decisively. My previous "Halls" anchor was particularly bad in the smooth, flat rock bottoms occasionally found in Croatia and that is when I would use the Fisherman in the bow and two stern lines to shore to keep from swinging to prevent fouling the Fisherman in case the wind shifted.

In unavoidable heavy weeds I would also consider using the Fisherman but I would remain concerned about the anchor chain fouling on the unburied fluke in case of a wind shift.
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Old 03-06-2016, 11:55 AM   #33
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How often have you experienced the chain fouling the fisherman during tide changes or wind shifts? Is it guaranteed to happen every time you anchor, or just a risk?

I'd be interested to see some of those great underwater videos from this forum but with a fisherman anchor.
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:04 PM   #34
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How often have you experienced the chain fouling the fisherman during tide changes or wind shifts? Is it guaranteed to happen every time you anchor, or just a risk?
None that I am certain. The only time I had it drag was in a squall and 180º wind shift but it could have dragged simply because it did not reset.

I have not used it enough to know what the odds are of it fouling in a wind shift but I know i would not sleep well if I was using the Fisherman and no lines to shores.

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I'd be interested to see some of those great underwater videos from this forum but with a fisherman anchor.
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:12 PM   #35
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With those nice sharp tips on the Excel, Rocna and similar anchors I would imagine that they all penetrate kelp or grab onto a rock edge relatively well. Probably no reason to keep a fisherman unless you own it (like you do) or want to decorate your lawn with it.

What is the displacement of that giant Grand Banks of yours?
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:19 PM   #36
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With those nice sharp tips on the Excel, Rocna and similar anchors I would imagine that they all penetrate kelp or grab onto a rock edge relatively well.
I would agree. I always wanted one, though, and will try it out to learn more about what it can do in weeds and rocks. Maybe I will try to video it in action this summer!

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What is the displacement of that giant Grand Banks of yours?
28 tons.
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:25 PM   #37
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If you have your heart set on a stockless anchor, there's a new SHHP option;

First stockless SHHP anchor
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:26 PM   #38
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Beautiful boat. You say she's 1973, so is that a wood hull or did yours transition to fiberglass?
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:30 PM   #39
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Beautiful boat. You say she's 1973, so is that a wood hull or did yours transition to fiberglass?
Wood, the GB50s like the Alaskans, did not transition from the Hong Kong plant to Singapore and from wood to fiberglass. There were later 52s and even 58s made in fibreglass, though.
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Old 03-06-2016, 12:33 PM   #40
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If you have your heart set on a stockless anchor, there's a new SHHP option;

First stockless SHHP anchor
Hi Murray. I remember you brought that up in another thread. I contacted the company and was quoted 1400 euro for a 62kg unit (sized per ABS for my boat). That's about the same price as the 55kg Rocna.

Assuming the performance is similar between the two then the difference would be whether the preference is for a bow roller mount or a hawsepipe mount.
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