As someone pointed out, this unit uses separate antennas for VHF and AIS. Based on that information (you can see the two antenna connections in the photo), this unit will meet your needs.
Standard Horizon GX-6500 AIS Class B, Etc Radio
- Thread starter dw8928
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As someone pointed out, this unit uses separate antennas for VHF and AIS. Based on that information (you can see the two antenna connections in the photo), this unit will meet your needs.
IRENE
Guru
Availability Update - Not Good
I received the following today:
"I have just received an e-mail from Standard Horizon. They have moved delivery of the GX6500 AIS radio out until mid June." Kudos to West Marine for asking if we wish to wait on Standard Horizon, or go in a different direction.
I am disappointed in Standard Horizon for the lack of transparency with availability dates...November, March, April, and now mid June. I would have been happier with them advertising their product as "unknown availability" or "concept" instead of the repeated kicking of the can down the road. Failure, Standard Horizon.
We are otherwise ready to proceed with our electronics upgrade, and we will reevaluate options over this three-day weekend on the water. Perhaps a black-box VHF to replace the failing unit we have (same mounting holes in our little boat) with an independent AIS transceiver...
Advice/guidance appreciated.
I received the following today:
"I have just received an e-mail from Standard Horizon. They have moved delivery of the GX6500 AIS radio out until mid June." Kudos to West Marine for asking if we wish to wait on Standard Horizon, or go in a different direction.
I am disappointed in Standard Horizon for the lack of transparency with availability dates...November, March, April, and now mid June. I would have been happier with them advertising their product as "unknown availability" or "concept" instead of the repeated kicking of the can down the road. Failure, Standard Horizon.
We are otherwise ready to proceed with our electronics upgrade, and we will reevaluate options over this three-day weekend on the water. Perhaps a black-box VHF to replace the failing unit we have (same mounting holes in our little boat) with an independent AIS transceiver...
Advice/guidance appreciated.
OP
OP
dw8928
Senior Member
I intend to wait. That is only 60 more days and maybe it will be sooner.
I haven't gotten this email yet though.
I haven't gotten this email yet though.
Agreed and sorry i think my post was not very clear. Someone earlier in the thread seemed to be looking for more information on the antenna issue before they made a purchase decision so I was just expressing support for the concept of going with two separate antennas, regardless of what AIS system you buy.
Also on the topic of whether an AIS is a "transponder": This is an interesting topic when you dig into it because some of the USCG docs talk about the ability of a coastal station to "poll" a boat in order to get your AIS to respond with message 19 extended position report. Message 15 is known as a base station interrogation.
I have some history working with aircraft transponders so when i started looking into AIS for boats (and being an engineer) of course i had to know everything
I even emailed some of the suppliers; some will tell you that yes their system is designed to reply to message 15. the guy at SH kind of said;"well since we don't have the unit in yet, i cannot tell you definitively if this model will reply to a base station".
Personally i have the luxury of time since we're still in the boat shopping phase so i will keep investigating. Also, this is likely way more detail than the average trawler captain needs to know, but i think its fun to learn about. Again being an engineer (there's no cure for this) I'll be one of those guys that has to know this detail before I make a purchase, Ha!
psneeld
Guru
Equivalent to saying your computer shouldn't be able to play Pandora (internet radio) while you browse the internet.
Those days are long gone.
If AIS was user dependent for noral operations....maybe .....as radio control faces usually leave a lot to be desired.
Those days are long gone.
If AIS was user dependent for noral operations....maybe .....as radio control faces usually leave a lot to be desired.
That's funny. A recent thread had people arguing that a combination inverter/charger was better than separate units.
There was a thread on another forum arguing that installing an AIS receive unit only was "selfish" because you know where the other boats are but they don't know where you are. Another thread claimed transmitting class B was a waste of money because commercial ships would just tune class B out.
As is the case nearly every time, what works for one may not work for another and what one thinks he needs may not be needed by the other.
Pgitug
Guru
To have one piece of electronic equipment perform multiple tasks is convenient and usually cheaper. Makes everybody feel like they are getting so much out of just a few pieces of electronics.
UNTIL that one unit, that does three or four navigational functions fails, always at the wrong time, while you are going across NYC harbor in the fog. That's when you start wishing you did not put all of your safety functions in one little basket. But who am I kidding. Marine electronics never fail.
psneeld
Guru
To have one piece of electronic equipment perform multiple tasks is convenient and usually cheaper. Makes everybody feel like they are getting so much out of just a few pieces of electronics.
UNTIL that one unit, that does three or four navigational functions fails, always at the wrong time, while you are going across NYC harbor in the fog. That's when you start wishing you did not put all of your safety functions in one little basket. But who am I kidding. Marine electronics never fail.
They rarely fail any more...and usually only a part of the equipment, not the whole unit.
The stand alone AIS is just as likely to fail as any other unit.
You don't even need AIS receive let alone transmit.
It's better to have it in a multi function device than not.
Fog is a reasonably predictable event, avoid busy areas if you feel you need AIS to be there.
Etc...etc....etc..
mfreeman_1998
Member
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The manufacturer could be experiencing some design/technical problems. When you co-locate transmitters and receivers it is a real challenge to achieve necessary electrical isolation. That's to say pesky signals are radiated inside the unit and sneak in to places where they can result in havoc. Give them time to sort out those issues if that's the case.
Pgitug
Guru
It comes down to risk level and your wallet.
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psneeld
Guru
I pretty much showed it doesn't.
Redundancy is the solution, whether the first or second unit is in a radio is irrelavent.
What is totally scary in my mind...is this unreasonable surge that this new technology is all that valuable in a boating arena where most targets aren't broadcasting anyway...unless on a western river or you are silly enough to operate in shipping or ferry areas more than you have to.
So having a second unit instead of a 3rd PLB or epirb to me is equally debateable in safety terms.
Redundancy is the solution, whether the first or second unit is in a radio is irrelavent.
What is totally scary in my mind...is this unreasonable surge that this new technology is all that valuable in a boating arena where most targets aren't broadcasting anyway...unless on a western river or you are silly enough to operate in shipping or ferry areas more than you have to.
So having a second unit instead of a 3rd PLB or epirb to me is equally debateable in safety terms.
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Pgitug
Guru
There are four kinds of people.
The ones that buy the latest and greatest. These folks are eager to learn new technologies and be on the cutting edge.
The second group enjoys new technology but waits to buy into it until it is proven to work and provide the advertised benefits.
The third group is like the second group but they are waiting for the price to drop and buy in when the sales begin.
Then there's the fourth group. They are very happy with their Loran and are not yet convinced that GPS based systems are not just a fad.
The different personalities is what makes the world interesting.
The ones that buy the latest and greatest. These folks are eager to learn new technologies and be on the cutting edge.
The second group enjoys new technology but waits to buy into it until it is proven to work and provide the advertised benefits.
The third group is like the second group but they are waiting for the price to drop and buy in when the sales begin.
Then there's the fourth group. They are very happy with their Loran and are not yet convinced that GPS based systems are not just a fad.
The different personalities is what makes the world interesting.
dhays
Guru
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I have an AIS receiver and would like an AIS transceiver. No I don't need it, but I have been in a couple of situations where it would be helpful.
I used to be in Pg's first group. Now I have drifted down to the third group.
I used to be in Pg's first group. Now I have drifted down to the third group.
OP
OP
dw8928
Senior Member
With all the electronics that have GPS in them as well as water resistant phones - I think this GX6500 and an epirb would pretty much guarantee a rescue. You'll have a GPS in this radio, your phone, and your MFD. Add a remote handset to the GX6500 (which supports 4 I think) or just a standalone handheld VHF
Even the sailors on the ship that was attacked by Moby Dick survived on an island and they had none of this.
I think the big issue is having an insulated lifesuit - because you are going te be found.
Even the sailors on the ship that was attacked by Moby Dick survived on an island and they had none of this.
I think the big issue is having an insulated lifesuit - because you are going te be found.
psneeld
Guru
I think AIS has its usefullness.
I was just stating that having it built into another electronic device was no better or worse than having iit a stand alone box.
Like many electronics on a boat...if your safety really is being determined by just one of those electronic systems...it should be a redundant system whether stand alone or not.
In my mind, electronics just back you up.....whether safety or navigation. You should never be that lost or unsafe without them.
I was just stating that having it built into another electronic device was no better or worse than having iit a stand alone box.
Like many electronics on a boat...if your safety really is being determined by just one of those electronic systems...it should be a redundant system whether stand alone or not.
In my mind, electronics just back you up.....whether safety or navigation. You should never be that lost or unsafe without them.
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To me, the main advantage of AIS (and having it connected to your MFD) is that you will get a warning if you and another boat are on a collision course. Yes, you can make a guess in good visibility but the AIS provides a better "guess". And it will provide you the names of other vessels in case you want/need to call them on the VHF. Knowing the name is better than hailing "the big ship heading up the river near the ICW crossing."
The key for each of us is, how often do we find ourselves needing to know these things? If you don't normally boat in busy harbors or shipping lanes, AIS may just be a toy. If you do, it could be an important safety device.
Next year, my hope is to cruise to NYC and see the Statue of Liberty. From what I've read, the NY harbor can be a busy place with commercial shipping and high speed ferries. This looks like a good place to have AIS available.
As for transmitting ability, I doubt many of the commercial ships and ferries are going to change course or speed because of my little boat so it's not so important.
The key for each of us is, how often do we find ourselves needing to know these things? If you don't normally boat in busy harbors or shipping lanes, AIS may just be a toy. If you do, it could be an important safety device.
Next year, my hope is to cruise to NYC and see the Statue of Liberty. From what I've read, the NY harbor can be a busy place with commercial shipping and high speed ferries. This looks like a good place to have AIS available.
As for transmitting ability, I doubt many of the commercial ships and ferries are going to change course or speed because of my little boat so it's not so important.
psneeld
Guru
Have AIS receive on my boat and full AIS on commercial boats I have run...
Never needed it to avoid collision...eye balls and radar plenty....
Useful but not necessary even in NY harbor. Almost all vessels can avoid traffic, even in high traffic areas by studying charts.
Never needed it to avoid collision...eye balls and radar plenty....
Useful but not necessary even in NY harbor. Almost all vessels can avoid traffic, even in high traffic areas by studying charts.
Pgitug
Guru
I agree with the advantages you listed.
AIS allows you to call the vessel by name. That is a huge advantage. Whether in a busy harbor or out in an open bay. How can you ask someone their intentions if you don't know their name? A VHF radio transmits over 20 miles. Who are you talking to?
You will love NY Harbor. Been through their eight times. Really an Iconic, neat place. The fast ferries you don't have to worry about, they go around you. The big orange Statin Island Ferries are up to you to keep clear of.
Enjoy a safe journey.
OP
OP
dw8928
Senior Member
Think I've found the fly in the ointment with this GX6500. If you buy a new boat and document with Coast Guard, the USCG delay is about 2 months.
To buy this radio, West Marine needs to pre-register the AIS with the USCG. Meaning you have to wait for the USCG to get back to you. Assuming they find no problems with the docs and cause a delay.
To buy this radio, West Marine needs to pre-register the AIS with the USCG. Meaning you have to wait for the USCG to get back to you. Assuming they find no problems with the docs and cause a delay.
twistedtree
Guru
What info is needed that you are waiting on the CG for? If t's the official boat number, you could just register the AIS with the boat's HIN instead.
BTW! It will be fast if you get your new boat docs back in 2 months.
BTW! It will be fast if you get your new boat docs back in 2 months.
OP
OP
dw8928
Senior Member
As far as I can tell, I need either the state of USCG registration # to get an MMSI#?
twistedtree
Guru
I'll bet you could give your HIN. Also, the CG will often tell you the assigned number even if they haven't finished the whole process.
OP
OP
dw8928
Senior Member
Well, whadya know - you were correct! I registered the MMSI.
Thanks. It's next year if things go as planned.
Can you tell us how you were able to program your boat's information into this model, if it interfaces well with your chart plotter or other devices, and how do you like it so far...?
it looks like it cost less than a boat-buck
Also: the specs say it has a built-in GPS antenna. this could be sensitive to installation location in order to get good reception, did you have any trouble finding a good location where the GPS reception is strong...?
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