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Old 06-06-2017, 07:40 AM   #1
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Sounder Data from Furuno DFF1 to Simrad NSE?

I posted this on Panbo last week a received with no takers...

My apologies if this topic has been covered. Although I am doubtful about the cross compatibility I have to ask the question. I am running TimeZero Pro in the PH with the DFF1 providing depth/temp info with no issues. On the flybridge I have a Simrad NSE8 currently with no good source of depth information (my old Data International Offshore sounder is slowing giving up the ghost).

I am trying to find away of utilizing the depth information from the DFF1 for the NSE. Is there anyway to do this without installing a parallel sounder/transducer for just the flybridge?

Thanks for your time!

Dave Geer
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Old 06-06-2017, 08:07 AM   #2
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Two questions. Are you using a Hub 101 for data transfer among the Furuno gear or simply plugging into the back of the TZ unit? Secondly, what does the TZ network schematic show for using current Furuno setup for feeding depth information to satellite displays, such as an RD 30?

Using the ubiquitous RD30 may be your best route. I've had great difficulty in the past trying to use Furuno data linked to older Simrad or Raymarine gear.
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Old 06-06-2017, 08:15 AM   #3
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The DDF1 Sounder is plugged into a network switch (Cradlepoint AER3100) as is the workstation running the TZ Pro application. Unfortunately it seems that Furuno only allows Navnet to NMEA 2000 translation through one of their MFD units which would mean a full replacement of the Simrad NSE on the flybridge - very expensive and not practical. Am I correct?
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Old 06-06-2017, 09:08 AM   #4
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Have you asked Furuno?
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:02 AM   #5
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As of this point - no. It seems like the simple way to an answer but sometimes the difference between an answer on a support line and the innovation of others in the field is significant. But I take your point and will probably make the call. A little afraid of what I am going to here for an answer. :-)

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Old 06-06-2017, 10:15 AM   #6
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How about using a Furuno display to output the depth as part of a NMEA string?

You could even use NMEA 0183. Yes its old fashioned but it would work.

Granted, my gear is older being Navnet VX1 I believe but I know the displays can be programmed to output whatever you want on the NMEA 0183 port.
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Old 06-06-2017, 07:22 PM   #7
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TZ Pro will have to send out depth and temp via either N2K or 0183. The NSE8 can definitely receive depth and temp via N2K, and I'm 90% sure it has an 0183 input as well so that should be possible too.

What I don't know is whether TZ Pro can send out such data, whether is can do N2K, 01830, or both, and what hardware interfaces are supported to get the data out and onto N2K or 0183.

Reading through the TZ pro manual is probably a good starting point, and from there you might need to call MaxSea.
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Old 06-08-2017, 07:54 AM   #8
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That is one call I did make - TZ Pro will not translate what I need to N2k or 0183 at this time... Unfortunately...

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Old 06-08-2017, 07:57 AM   #9
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Am I nuts to be considering the Windows Remote Desktop app for the ipad to take to the flybridge? I know it's a bandaid but until I can get the old Data Marine unit serviced it seems like an option - untested at this point..

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Old 06-08-2017, 01:09 PM   #10
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Yes, remote desktop could work.

The issue with the DFF is that it sends all it's sounding info over ethernet in a Furuno proprietary format, so only a Fununo device can interpret it. That means an MFD or one of the TZ software packages.

To get numeric depth and temp on some other device, you need the data in a standard format, either N2K or 0183. I'm quite sure the Furuno MFDs can do that, but apparently the TZ software cannot.

An inexpensive alternative may be to install a stand-along N2K depth/temp tranducer. Airmar makes them. It would get the data in a standard format that can be displayed my many different devices, and provide a backup depth sounder. The down side is that a haul out would be required to install.
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Old 06-08-2017, 06:21 PM   #11
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It looks like TZ-PRO allows configuration of serial ports to send out the NMEA0183 data needed for depth.

If TZ-PRO is receiving the data from the DFF1 then it should have the data to send out the DPT sentence when selected in the com port configuration setup. The sentence list shows the DPT is available to select.

If you are using a laptop you'll likely have to get a USB to Serial RS232 adapter to install as a com port and then make up the cable to connect to your other device, all this assumes your other device can receive RS232 Serial NMEA 0183.
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Old 06-08-2017, 09:29 PM   #12
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Keep in mind that NMEA 0183 uses RS-422, not RS-232. Connecting the two is hit or miss, with no assurance it will work.
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Old 06-09-2017, 09:05 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twistedtree View Post
Keep in mind that NMEA 0183 uses RS-422, not RS-232. Connecting the two is hit or miss, with no assurance it will work.
Yes, according to the standard it should be RS-422 but there are many variants including RS-232. I'm speaking from a FURUNO NAVNET (1) background that provides connections for both protocols.

The best choice is to convert USB from the Computer to whatever protocol the listening device is capable of receiving be it RS-422 or RS-232.

Looking at the SIMRAD NSE8 you are correct it would need RS-422. Looks like Digikey sells a nice USB to RS422 for $35.

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Old 06-13-2017, 02:51 PM   #14
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Great info TG ! I will mock it up and see where it goes. I think the Simrad system is tied together via N2K - Simnet however. I do have an Actisense NGT-1 USB Gateway I can try...

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Old 06-13-2017, 02:56 PM   #15
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BTW - Although it is not ideal, the remote desktop app on my iphone did work. Problem is the display brightness and some latency. I set the primary nav computer in the pilot house up for the sounder window in TZ Pro and with RD was able to see the output on the flybridge. If I could find a 1000 nit tablet that didn't cost an arm and a leg, it would work well....

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Old 06-13-2017, 04:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TG View Post
Yes, according to the standard it should be RS-422 but there are many variants including RS-232. I'm speaking from a FURUNO NAVNET (1) background that provides connections for both protocols.



The best choice is to convert USB from the Computer to whatever protocol the listening device is capable of receiving be it RS-422 or RS-232.



Looking at the SIMRAD NSE8 you are correct it would need RS-422. Looks like Digikey sells a nice USB to RS422 for $35.




That's a great value for RS-422. They are usually much more expensive.

The first revision of NMEA 0183 was rs232, but some time ago switched to Rs422 for better noise immunity. I think it was V1.5 that was first to rs422. Not sure of the date, and poor internet out here on the water so can't research. I know for certain that the Simrad in question is rs422.

And I agree that even today some new products include both. My real goal was to caution against connecting rs232 and rs422 devices as so many people do. It may seem to work fine, but I have seen links that appear to work, but when you look at received data a large percentage of the messages are scrambled. Fortunately checksum fails and they get rejected, but I know thats not how I'd want my navigation system working.
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