Soldering battery terminals

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I'm not sure I'm so passionate on this issue of soldering crimped stranded wire. There are just too many variables for me to have a passionate answer. I have simply observed over the years that jobs I did 20 years ago with non tinned wire and off the shelf standard crimps I got to do again 5 years later. I also found during that period wires that had wicked corrosion 6 or seven feet into the wire in only two seasons on an exposed down rigger cable. I observed those installations and countless of those I inherited. I've certainly seen my share of broken solid and soldered cables too, so I know from empirical,observation that sold terminals can and do fracture over time, not just in theory. I also know from observation that we'll secured cables, soldered or not, and especially those that are sealed, soldered or not, are rarely in bad shape, even as the wire itself has lost its flexibility. So that's what I really pay attention to.

Here is what I do know. Having acquired high quality wire, terminals, crimpers appropriate for the terminals and wire gauges all the way up to 4/0, at no small cost. In the past 15 or so years that I have insisted on good wire, good terminals, adhesive shrink and we'll supported, I've only ever had to redo a connection where something was not perfect to begin with, such as a heat shrink that got nicked or split and I should have done it over right then at the start. Otherwise, I can pretty much forget them.

While there may or may not be benefits to solder a terminal. Depending on the situation, I could see it either way, and have acted on a case by case basis (voltage sensing terminations sometimes get solder), most don't. I just know that the real magic is not in the soldering, it's in the quality of the entire experience. If you pick good quality cable, terminals, tools and technique, the rest just won't matter that much. If you don't, soldered or not soldered won't matter at all, it's going to fail.

In short, the discussion as stated is nothing more than pot stirring, not learning.
 
I'm not sure I'm so passionate on this issue of soldering crimped stranded wire. There are just too many variables for me to have a passionate answer. I have simply observed over the years that jobs I did 20 years ago with non tinned wire and off the shelf standard crimps I got to do again 5 years later. I also found during that period wires that had wicked corrosion 6 or seven feet into the wire in only two seasons on an exposed down rigger cable. I observed those installations and countless of those I inherited. I've certainly seen my share of broken solid and soldered cables too, so I know from empirical,observation that sold terminals can and do fracture over time, not just in theory. I also know from observation that we'll secured cables, soldered or not, and especially those that are sealed, soldered or not, are rarely in bad shape, even as the wire itself has lost its flexibility. So that's what I really pay attention to.

Here is what I do know. Having acquired high quality wire, terminals, crimpers appropriate for the terminals and wire gauges all the way up to 4/0, at no small cost. In the past 15 or so years that I have insisted on good wire, good terminals, adhesive shrink and we'll supported, I've only ever had to redo a connection where something was not perfect to begin with, such as a heat shrink that got nicked or split and I should have done it over right then at the start. Otherwise, I can pretty much forget them.

While there may or may not be benefits to solder a terminal. Depending on the situation, I could see it either way, and have acted on a case by case basis (voltage sensing terminations sometimes get solder), most don't. I just know that the real magic is not in the soldering, it's in the quality of the entire experience. If you pick good quality cable, terminals, tools and technique, the rest just won't matter that much. If you don't, soldered or not soldered won't matter at all, it's going to fail.

In short, the discussion as stated is nothing more than pot stirring, not learning.

Maybe for you...maybe not for many others.
 
............... If you are paranoid about it (or even if you are not for that matter), feel all your terminals and power cables on board when they are under a load on a regular basis. They should never feel warm to the touch. The boat you save may be your own!........

Better yet, buy and use an infrared non contact thermometer to measure the temperature of the connections. You'll find a lot of uses for this tool around the boat if you do your own work.
 
Better yet, buy and use an infrared non contact thermometer to measure the temperature of the connections. You'll find a lot of uses for this tool around the boat if you do your own work.
"
I use one extensively; a "must have" tool IMO. I don't think it is "better" than the hands test and certainly not as easy. A cable or termination should be ambient temperature. Much easier in most cases to run your hand along it than trying to aim an IR thermometer and take a reading. The IR is nice for places you can see but not easily reach, but you need good aim on small cables.

Ghost: I think your post is well put.
 
....... In short, the discussion as stated is nothing more than pot stirring, not learning.

And that's a shame because some folks come here to learn and go away more confused than when they came. I remember a guy who claimed the best way of making electrical splices on a boat was to twist the wires together and then insert them in a wire nut filled with 5200.

It's very hard to know who on a forum knows what he/she is talking about and who doesn't. And I suspect some folks post BS just to fan the flames.
 
Yep...me and Trojan batteries are in cahoots to just post BS and fan the flames...none of the info they provided was useful to anyone...

Trojan must be FOS because a couple of **************** TFers said so.

Well...all I can say is.....:rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
Yep...me and Trojan batteries are in cahoots to just post BS and fan the flames...none of the info they provided was useful to anyone...

Trojan must be FOS because a couple of **************** TFers said so.

Well...all I can say is.....:rofl::rofl::rofl:

If you are saying that you and Trojan consider all crimps to be equal, then yes you are both FOS. A properly crimped connector does not show the heat/resistance in the Trojan picture. I surmise they see mostly hammer and dimple crimps in the golf cart and floor scrubber world which make of the majority of their business. Take a look sometimes at how many if not most of these are wired.
 
Right......:socool:

nothing to be learned here.....

the world's a perfect place in some minds....
 
I have a low threshold of tolerance for politics. It's not what I'm here for in any capacity. Admittedly it's a character weak point. The thick irony being that my own making a quip about it adds to the pot stirring, however well intentioned. I actually think that everyone here has, everyone, has a lot to offer. I just don't think it helps to start debating straw man arguments before anyone has even chimed in, and doing so in straw man fashion just leads to some kind of simplified good/bad conclusion while essentially telling everyone else to not comment if you happen to disagree or want to make things a little less oversimplified.

The value I personally get from everyone, really everyone here, is taking something I had previously thought of as black and white and realizing a new spectrum of choices to be made. Ironically, there are some here that really help to accomplish exactly that if we could just get away from this black and white style debate and bickering.

Anyhow, sorry for adding to the fray, again. I hope this explanation helps in some small way. I really do appreciate everyone's point of view. To quote one of my favorites by the name of Patton. "If everyone is thinking alike, somebody isn't thinking".

I hope you all can accept this apology. I'd appreciate that more than asking anyone to take sides.
 
A couple of observations, nothing more.

1) The Trojan pictures illustrate the heat being moved from the crimp to the plastic to lead interface on the battery. As we know nothing of the test parameters, I am just calling out I noticed this.

2) as far as the hammer type crimper shown, I have found using a drill press vice (as it is light enough to carry aboard) rather than a hammer a sure fire way of assuring a full crimp. Squeeze until you can't squeeze any more.

I have followed Nigel Calder's advice to great satisfaction. I question whether a gas tight crimp could accept any solder into the joint. Heating and stiffening the area adjacent to the crimp makes no sense to me. At least not enough to rework any of my connectors.
 
>I question whether a gas tight crimp could accept any solder into the joint. Heating and stiffening the area adjacent to the crimp makes no sense to me<

Dunking a terminal end in a ladel of molten solder does not melt the tinning on the wire beyond the dunk depth.

Wet rag helps as does being quick.
 
>I question whether a gas tight crimp could accept any solder into the joint. Heating and stiffening the area adjacent to the crimp makes no sense to me<

Dunking a terminal end in a ladel of molten solder does not melt the tinning on the wire beyond the dunk depth.

Wet rag helps as does being quick.

If you are too quick you won't solder anything. The wire and the terminal must be brought up to the temperature needed to melt solder and the solder must be allowed to flow into the joint. The molten solder will also wick up the cable and make it stiff.

Cooling a solder joint too quickly with a wet rag may cause a cold solder joint. You have to wait for the materials to cool below the melting point of the solder before trying to cool the joint artificially.

BTW: Where are you getting this ladle of molten solder?
 
>Where are you getting this ladle of molten solder?<

Dad was a plumber and in his day waste pipes were calked with okum then lead was poured to seal the joint.

The skill was taping the lead (special chisels) to tighten the joint even more with out cracking off the cast iron flange.

If done right the line could flex slightly over the years and not leak.

A cast iron pot was part of the gear , with a burner that would spin on to 20 lb propane tank that had threads to accept the unit , the ladle was part of the full kit.

On a larger job a helper would come in 1/2 hour early to get the lead melting.

Today with a small propane torch the old ladle still melts solder , takes a while tho, so its best to do a bunch of terminal ends at once,

Same deal as using a 5 lb roofing copper to solder smaller terminal ends , with out melting up the tinned wire.

>If you are too quick you won't solder anything. The wire and the terminal must be brought up to the temperature needed to melt solder and the solder must be allowed to flow into the joint.

# of course#

The molten solder will also wick up the cable and make it stiff.<

The wet rag stops the heat from going far up the wire , its purpose.

Cooling a solder joint too quickly with a wet rag may cause a cold solder joint. You have to wait for the materials to cool below the melting point of the solder before trying to cool the joint artificially.

The soldered end is NOT cooled with a wet rag , only the wire after it leaves the terminal gets the protection, from before immersion.
 
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