Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-29-2019, 12:55 AM   #1
Member
 
City: Maple Bay
Country: Canada
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 5
Simrad vs Furuno

Hi everyone, I'm doing a little research on behalf of my parents regarding their full electronic overhaul on board their 47 sabre. My father and I have boiled it down through various discussions with some industry experts and think either Simrad or Furuno would suit their needs. I'm reaching out to hopefully get some un-biased opinions (on an inherently subjective topic) on which product they should go with. It would be nice to hear from anyone who has installed either units to learn of their regrets, or success stories with either one.

I understand this is a loaded question, although would appreciate the insight!

Products looking to install:
GPS chartplotters (upper and lower helm (likely 12" and 9", respectively), AIS, Radar, autopilot, radios... the works!

Thanks, and happy boating!
__________________
Advertisement

willp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 02:02 AM   #2
TF Site Team
 
Insequent's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Insequent
Vessel Model: Ocean Alexander 50 Mk I
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,283
Back when I didi this I already had some Furuno gear, old stuff but still functional as stand-alone. I ordered Simrad gear at a discount supplier online, who called me and asked if I really wanted Simrad. I asked why, and the answer was 'we are getting a lot of returns' (faults). Now that was 7 years ago, and probably is no longer true. However, in more recent times there have been complaints about Simrad not supporting older models, not sure if they have got their act together on that yet.

My Furuno 12" NN3D charplotter has been good, and I like that the Furuno radar connects to it simply - power and ethernet cable. The NavPilot has been excellent also. My AIS is Comnav, again, faultless, and integrated easily.

But for lower helm I prefer MaxSea (or Nobletec) navigator on a PC. Fully integrates with Furuno (they own 50% of MaxSea). Its really nice having a 24" screen at the helm! If doing it all again I would probably go Furuno BB for master and radar connection, and run PC screens as chartplotters at both upper and lower helms. Only the upper screen would need to be 'special' in terms of brightness and weather resistance, so it is a cost-effective solution.
__________________

__________________
Brian
Insequent is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 04:30 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
danderer's Avatar
 
City: Newark, DE
Country: US
Vessel Name: Sojourner
Vessel Model: 2006 Mainship 34T
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 390
Lots of good observations on TT's site. You might start here: Adventures of Tanglewood: Simrad Wall of Shame

Note the info is a few years old. No idea if things have changed since then.
danderer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 06:29 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Mikala's Avatar
 
City: New Smyrna Beach, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Mikala
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 162
Simrad vs Furuno

Hulltruth electronics forum has a lot of good info. https://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-...nics-forum-19/
Mikala is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 07:23 AM   #5
Veteran Member
 
Vadim's Avatar
 
City: Rockville, MD.
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Libra
Vessel Model: Island Gypsy 36 Trawler
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 83
Quote:
Originally Posted by willp View Post
Hi everyone, I'm doing a little research on behalf of my parents regarding their full electronic overhaul on board their 47 sabre. My father and I have boiled it down through various discussions with some industry experts and think either Simrad or Furuno would suit their needs. I'm reaching out to hopefully get some un-biased opinions (on an inherently subjective topic) on which product they should go with. It would be nice to hear from anyone who has installed either units to learn of their regrets, or success stories with either one.

I understand this is a loaded question, although would appreciate the insight!

Products looking to install:
GPS chartplotters (upper and lower helm (likely 12" and 9", respectively), AIS, Radar, autopilot, radios... the works!

Thanks, and happy boating!
Any reason you are not considering Raymarine? If you need everything I would consider Raymarine first. IMHO.
Vadim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 07:25 AM   #6
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,486
In 2009 we did a major refit. The boat came to us with a mixture of Furuno radar, Furuno "GPS Navigator" (sort of like a plotter but without the chart background), Cetrek greyscale (ugg!) chart plotter, Lowrance fishfinder, President (non-DSC) VHF, and Standard Horozin DSC VHF.

We started with a market survey to identify decent local installers, picked the best three, and then polled those for ideas about a more capable networked system, adding autopilot and AIS, standardizing the radios, and adding some redundancy for depth sensors. At the time, I mentioned I'd prefer a networking solution from (at least mostly) a single manufacturer, and I'd like to be able to keep the radar and existing "GPS Navigator" (for redundancy) if possible. All three installers zoomed in on a Furuno suite.

At the time, Furuno's NAVNet 3D was the greatest thing since sliced bread -- especially compared to the Cetrek's glacial redraw time... and MaxSea's Time Zero seemed a useful laptop counterpart to the plotter, more redundancy.

So we ended up with an all-Furuno system except for ICOM radios. Kept the old radar, kept the "GPS Navigator" (but moved it). Added NN3D plotter on an MFD-12, Autopilot, AIS, fishfinder (not networked) and separate DST sounder. And we run TimeZero on a laptop. Changed to two ICOM radios (so each radio works the same way); Standard Horizon was the other contender, and installer recommended ICOM for that particular year, sounded OK to me.

Even today, it's still a very decent system, can't think of anything more I'd really need.

Can't overlay the old radar output onto the plotter, though. Would have needed a new compatible radar for that and I was already pushing the budget, a lot. I usually prefer a separate radar display anyway, and I didn't want to give up screen real estate (by splitting) on the MFD so that's not a big detraction. OTOH, if I were starting from scratch, I might consider overlaying radar on the plotter and saving some helm space for all the various displays. Same with the fishfinder; at the time I didn't really want to clutter up the plotter... but since then then I've about decided I could live with that in order to arrive at a slightly less cluttered helm. (We only fish during a ~25 day season per year anyway, maybe 10-15 outings, more for shakedown after winter than anything else.)

At the time, networking needed a serious mixture of NMEA0183 and NMEA2000 protocols. Now, that might have migrated more toward NMEA2000, if so, probably a slightly simpler install.

We don't have "touch" screens (I would only abide that if accompanied by hard keys/knobs/buttons anyway) and we don't have any Wifi feeds. We don't have engine displays on the plotter; could do, but with mechanical engines, it'd take new sensors and wire runs (pain in the neck), and real estate on the plotter... We didn't do the Sirius weather sensor, no loss, for me. We didn't do a camera installation, ditto no loss.

If I had it to do over again, I think I'd be very satisfied with a Furuno installation. We've had Raymarine components in in earlier boat; would have been OK with that, maybe, but the installers suggested networking all the Furuno stuff together (and given our legacy equipment) would be easier. Can't speak to Simrad, though; no experience.

I've had to read the Furuno manuals to learn how to work everything. Folks talk about how "intuitive" Garmin systems are... but I'm about as intuitive as a rock, so when I've yutzed around with boat neighbors' Garmin systems, I haven't seen any magic there. They couldn't figure something out on their system "intuitively" and I couldn't either, had to get their manual out to figure out (for them) how to do something. And complex systems usually come with complex operating regimes. IOW, I don't see the Furuno operating instructions as being a factor one way or the other. For me.

Edit: I'll add a comment about Furuno USA support too... Good! I've only had a few questions over the years, but the combination of direct support and forum have been very positive. Most recent example was about replacing the old "GPS Navigator" GP-36 DGPS unit, since the 17 year old monochrome display -- with 9871 NM under its belt -- is losing some pixels. I wondered if the GP-39 WAAS-corrected unit would be a drop-in replacement, overnight answer was yes, all good.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 07:28 AM   #7
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,954
Quote:
Originally Posted by danderer View Post
Lots of good observations on TT's site. You might start here: Adventures of Tanglewood: Simrad Wall of Shame

Note the info is a few years old. No idea if things have changed since then.
The owner of Tanglewood, a TF regular, is one of the brightest marine electronics users out there. He will soon be outfitting a new vessel. His electronic choices and why will be a great read.

For whatever it's worth, my Furuno gear has performed well. My instrument guy stays on this stuff regularly. He prefers Furuno to Simrad. His focus is ease of install, dealer support, legacy support and call backs.
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 08:24 AM   #8
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 19,521
On commercial boats Furuno seems to be winner.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 08:41 AM   #9
Guru
 
Codger2's Avatar
 
City: San Diego
Country: US
Vessel Name: "Sandpiper"
Vessel Model: 2006 42' Ocean Alexander Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vadim View Post
Any reason you are not considering Raymarine? If you need everything I would consider Raymarine first .
__________________
Codger 1941.. Constant pursuit of the ultimate SoCal Cruising boat.
Codger2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 09:36 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Ka_sea_ta's Avatar
 
City: Puget Sound
Country: USA
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 416
A totally unbiased method is to go down to the commercial docks and see what the guys that make their living on the water use... Predominately what I see are Furuno Radars, Depth finders, a computer based nav system, Comnav autopilots, Icom VHFs, and Morad antennas.
Ka_sea_ta is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 04:16 PM   #11
Ted
Guru
 
Ted's Avatar
 
City: Campbell River
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Okisollo
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 631
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka_sea_ta View Post
A totally unbiased method is to go down to the commercial docks and see what the guys that make their living on the water use... Predominately what I see are Furuno Radars, Depth finders, a computer based nav system, Comnav autopilots, Icom VHFs, and Morad antennas.
I'm ex commercial,
Ted is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 05:09 PM   #12
Guru
 
Ken E.'s Avatar
 
City: Bellingham WA
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Hatt Trick
Vessel Model: 45' Hatteras Convertible
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 893
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
The owner of Tanglewood, a TF regular, is one of the brightest marine electronics users out there. He will soon be outfitting a new vessel. His electronic choices and why will be a great read.
I would trust what TT had to say about electronics...I have followed his posts for some time and to me he's a TF authority. The most telling at the link above is the picture of the big box filled with Simrad gear to be returned.

As stated, most all commercial and fish boats in the PNW use Furuno equipment. My setup is all Furuno except for Comnav autopilot and AIS.
__________________
Ken on Hatt Trick
Ken E. is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 05:30 PM   #13
Guru
 
Fletcher500's Avatar
 
City: So-Cal
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Helmsman 4304
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 1,113
I grew up on fishing boats in the 70’ and they all had Furono so I have been biased from a young age and knew I would chose Furono if I ever got the opportunity.

A majority of the long range cruisers and commercial vessels (people who travel much farther than me) have Furono and that includes newer boats as well.

I inherited An older Raymarine and a newer Gen Simrad on the past two boats. Both were fine, and no major complaints.

With the new build last year, I could have chosen anything. Went with Furono and it has worked very well and that includes quite a few overnight runs to the island last Summer when I could “test” it throughout the night.

With that said, I think all of the newer solid state systems by all of the manufacturers are reliable and work well based on the research I did, and poking around other forums. In particular, the forums frequented by sport fisherman who tend to have newer electronics gear.
Fletcher500 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 05:37 PM   #14
Guru
 
Sealife's Avatar
 
City: In transit
Country: From USA
Vessel Name: Sea life
Vessel Model: Krogen 42 #61
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 527
Personal experience: Simrad has crap customer service. Furuno was a delight to work with.
__________________
Scott

www.caribbeansealife.com
Sealife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 06:01 PM   #15
Guru
 
wkearney99's Avatar
 
City: Bethesda, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Solstice
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 47 Eastbay FB
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 949
I've got older Furuno gear on my boat; Navnet3D. Their support is indeed quite good. From what I hear their current models are likewise well-supported.

As for commercial use, yes they're popular in that segment. But bear in mind a commercial operator is going to have a lot of time to get familiar with how to use the gear. This may translate into a steeper learning curve for casual recreational users.

Raymarine and Garmin have had some trouble in recent years, what with various mergers and discontinuations of products. Are those rough times over? I'm not making any bets on that. But Garmin does have a good entry-level ease of use.

Your starting point is radar (and fish-finders/sonar). Because each vendor's system is proprietary. If you want Furuno radar, you're using Furuno chart plotters. Likewise with any other vendor.

As for dual helm stations, I like having the same setup on both. This avoids any mental adjusting when switching stations. Some folks are more adept at this than others but I personally don't like to an added layer of confusion.

But if you want features present on different vendor products and you have helm space (and budget) there's nothing preventing you from installing displays from different vendors. Chart/Radar from Furuno, Charter/Sonar from Simrad with both of them sharing all other sensors (depth, gps, engines, etc).

I should also mention that if you want Sirius satellite weather those modules are also specific to chart plotter brands. These days with smart phones and cell data coverage there's less reason to go with satellite weather. But if you're outside of areas with solid cell data coverage it's something to consider.
__________________
-- Bill Kearney
2005 Eastbay 47 FB - Solstice
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 06:33 PM   #16
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 5,158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sealife View Post
Personal experience: Simrad has crap customer service. Furuno was a delight to work with.
Personally, I don't think the functionality of Furuno is "all that". But their after the sale service/advice, and I mean WAY after the sale, is superb, and has been for a long time. So count me as a customer for life on all the basic gear. About the only places I might go non-Furuno would be Comnav for autopilot and Standard Horizon for VHF, both also have great product and service.
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 06:40 PM   #17
Guru
 
Group9's Avatar
 
City: Bay Saint Louis, Mississippi, (or where the anchor drops)
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 1973 42 Bertram MY
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 719
Go ask your local West Marine which units are getting returned for not working. Ours told me a few months ago that they were getting a whole lot of Go7ís and Go9ís brought back after just a few months. Furunoís rep was good.
__________________
Living life at one quarter speed.
Group9 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 06:54 PM   #18
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,835
Quote:
Originally Posted by danderer View Post
Lots of good observations on TT's site. You might start here: Adventures of Tanglewood: Simrad Wall of Shame

Note the info is a few years old. No idea if things have changed since then.



I've been watching Simrad's updates and I don't think they have fixed ANY of the problems that I had. They did make some improvements in their MARPA performance, but only in new models. The products I had were abandoned by them with respect to support and updates, even though only a few years old.


So had I kept the equipment, I would still have all the same problems today. Ripping it all out was the right thing to do, in hind sight.


I'd also suggest you read CruisersFourum and TheHullTruth, and look at what happened when Simrad issues software updates. I have seem who suites of equipment rendered inoperable, or major components like depth sounders rendered inoperable. This goes on for months while they trickle out fixes.


The latest update rendered their wifi device brain-dead in some B&G systems, requiring that the devices be removed and sent back to Simrad for repair. They pulled the update, and I don't think have re-issued a corrected version.


And here's another clue. Look at which vendor is always selling "factory refurbished" units. Those are customer returns that were repaired, or were "no trouble found". This gives you some critical insight into their overall quality.
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 07:14 PM   #19
Member
 
City: Maple Bay
Country: Canada
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vadim View Post
Any reason you are not considering Raymarine? If you need everything I would consider Raymarine first. IMHO.
Thanks for the question- like I said I was sort of doing this on behalf my father. We went to the Vancouver boat show, and spoke to some of the vendors (who are are furiously competing with each other), and got the sense that Raymarine was not at robust as some of the competitors. It seemed as though Raymarine lacked in other areas such as tech support, longevity, and overall hardiness. From these experiences, and chatting to other people in the field, his gut was leading him away from Raymarine. In my OP I touched on the subjectivity of this topic, which what I have just described is a perfect example of such.
Thanks a lot!
willp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-29-2019, 07:27 PM   #20
Member
 
City: Maple Bay
Country: Canada
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ka_sea_ta View Post
A totally unbiased method is to go down to the commercial docks and see what the guys that make their living on the water use... Predominately what I see are Furuno Radars, Depth finders, a computer based nav system, Comnav autopilots, Icom VHFs, and Morad antennas.
I would agree, most commercial vessels are outfitted with Furuno. For a seasonal boater on a 1998 47' Sabre, don't you think full retrofit with Furuno is overkill? At least that was my initial reaction when he told me he was considering Furuno, so curious to hear what others thought..

Thanks to everyone who has posted. Quite overwhelming how considerate and generous everyone is with their wealth of knowledge and time to share their thoughts with me and the community.
__________________

willp is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
electronics, furuno, navigation, radar, simrad

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:20 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012