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Old 07-25-2015, 11:25 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
I don't exceed cell-phone use of 40 minutes a month!


Microwave ovens were the result of radars melting a scientist's chocolate bars in his pocket.


So, I'm microwave shy!
Get one of those aluminum foil hats and all will be good..also keep the alien's from reading your thoughts!



Hollywood
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Old 07-25-2015, 11:34 AM   #22
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Old 07-25-2015, 04:35 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
The radiation (or lack thereof) issue aside, it seems like someone's mission was to mount the radar in the place it would be least effective, get in the way the most, get drenched in salt water, inhibit visibility from the helm, and as a result make the owner look just plain dumb. Will be interesting to see how long it stays there.
Thank You!!!

That is exactly what I was going to post!
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Old 07-29-2015, 10:35 AM   #24
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Durability test on the ability of the electronics and drive mechanize to survive extreme pounding. The worse place on a boat for mounting fragile stuff.

The safety of the unit is fine as has been stated.


Looks stupid.
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Old 07-29-2015, 12:25 PM   #25
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Sea Ray or Bayliner?
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Old 07-29-2015, 03:07 PM   #26
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I took this photo yesterday of an Endeavour 40 Sky Lounge Cat. The original location of the radar was probably OK, considering it was recommended that a 16 degree down angle forward must be unobstructed. But then came the roof top A/C and Sat TV dome. Duh?
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Old 07-29-2015, 03:56 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by hollywood8118 View Post
Get one of those aluminum foil hats and all will be good..also keep the alien's from reading your thoughts!



Hollywood
Be prepared! Thinking some eye holes might be helpful...:-)
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Old 07-29-2015, 04:05 PM   #28
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Larry--- It's hard to tell in the photo but if the radar antenna is a wee bit higher than the top of the satellite dome and the air conditioner there shouldn't be any problems.
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Old 07-29-2015, 06:07 PM   #29
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The satellite dome is plastic and about the top third empty. We had a similar juxtaposition on the Hatteras (see avatar) without issue. But yeah, putting a spacer on the radar in the picture looks like it would have been a good idea from that angle, given the AC.
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Old 07-29-2015, 09:58 PM   #30
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Someone went to a lot of trouble to make that mount. There does seem to be a bizarre logic applied, like the owner said, go to West Marine and build me a radar mount today with whatever they have in stock.. The down-angle is adjustable with those antenna ratchet mounts. Curious to know why they shaped the starboard base the way they did!!!
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Old 07-29-2015, 11:03 PM   #31
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If I ever see this guy I'll tell him there's a lot of curious guys on TF w some questions.
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Old 07-30-2015, 01:43 PM   #32
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Looks wobbly.
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Old 07-30-2015, 01:56 PM   #33
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You guys have it all wrong. The purpose of mounting a radar in the bow pulpit is so they can use it to see if the anchor has dug in well.
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Old 07-30-2015, 05:48 PM   #34
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It's definitely designed to keep anybody from anchoring near them. I'll bet it works too.
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Old 07-30-2015, 06:00 PM   #35
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You guys have it all wrong.

Probably right.


If Eric manages to get the old boy to sign up and respond to this thread we may all have a new way to mount radomes.
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Old 08-03-2015, 10:34 PM   #36
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Mark,

This is an 'apples to oranges' comparison of completely different technology.

A 3G Broadband FMCW (Frequency Modulated Continuous Wave) radar radiates just 0.165 Watts Calculated Average Power. That's about 1/10 the 1.6 watts maximum allowed in the US.

In contrast, a small, Garmin GMR18HD 4KW radar radiates 2.235 Watts Calculated Average Power, about 13.5 times that of the 3G Broadband radar.

The Garmin's average effect is only 2.235 Watts, and that's only if you hug the radome, or about 50% more than your mobile phone (1.6 watts maximum in the US). The radiation is not cumulative. It is microwave radiation, same as from your microwave oven and quite similar to that of your mobile phone, although slightly different frequency. You will pick up more radiation speaking in your mobile phone, sitting too close to an old TV, standing within 3 feet of the microwave or spending a day in the sun than you will from standing next to a 4 kW radar.

It's just not the same thing.
Larry,
You are not quite right about the 4kw radar. Although the average power is indeed just a few watts, the peak power is 4 kw. That has the capability to damage cells. An analogy might be that you can stand in the rain all day with no damage but the same amount of water falling in a bucket all at once would probably kill you. Also microwave ovens go to great lengths to keep radiation inside the oven by elaborate sealing and gasketing of the door. They are generally about 600 watts and in the same frequency range as radar. Standing in the sun brings up the issue of ionizing versus non-ionizing radiation. Radar is non-ionizing and the jury is still out on just what damage it can do to people but most choose to play it safe where high powers are concerned.

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Old 08-04-2015, 12:01 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No Mast View Post
You guys have it all wrong. The purpose of mounting a radar in the bow pulpit is so they can use it to see if the anchor has dug in well.
ok so now that is logical
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Old 08-04-2015, 02:21 AM   #38
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Larry,
You are not quite right about the 4kw radar. Although the average power is indeed just a few watts, the peak power is 4 kw. That has the capability to damage cells. An analogy might be that you can stand in the rain all day with no damage but the same amount of water falling in a bucket all at once would probably kill you. Also microwave ovens go to great lengths to keep radiation inside the oven by elaborate sealing and gasketing of the door. They are generally about 600 watts and in the same frequency range as radar. Standing in the sun brings up the issue of ionizing versus non-ionizing radiation. Radar is non-ionizing and the jury is still out on just what damage it can do to people but most choose to play it safe where high powers are concerned.

Paul
Paul,

That is not my understanding of how RF radiation from radar affects humans. Everything I have ever read or learned in school says that Maximum Average Power is what we are exposed to when we are in near an operating radar.

There is a well written piece entitled "Hazardous to Your Health?" printed in Power & Motoryacht Magazine addresses the current thinking on marine radar safety. I believe it mirrors my original observations.

The World Health Organization published "Electromagnetic fields and public health: Radars and Human Health Fact sheet N226" which discusses how RF as it relates to public health. It addresses Marine Radar among other sources of RF radiation.

I believe consumer microwave ovens operate at 2.45 GHz and between 600 and 1,100 Watts. The Garmin GMR18 operates at 9.41 GHz with 4,000 Watts of Peak Power but Maximum Average Power of only 2.3 watts. Here is a link to Garmin's FCC Application for the GMR18 Radar where these specifications can be confirmed.

The manufacturers rhetoric is more dismissive of the dangers than it should be yet, every manufacturers instructions contain warnings that advise users to minimize direct exposure to the emissions.

I personally 'choose to play it safe' as you mentioned.
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Old 08-04-2015, 07:17 AM   #39
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From my factory training as a field tech from Raymarine, Furuno, and Simrad.....

The answers about radiation exposure were all the same...don't be stupid..but none will harm you.

The 4 kw , unless you can get it to be on and non pulsing and non rotating (a rare combination)..... the dosage is for only a fraction of the time....

Much like a microwave on defrost or ultra low power setting where the microwaves are only generated in very small bursts.

If that radar is set up with a dead zome where the rest of the boat is like in many of these installs that are body level...there is even less radiation as it would only be scatter back.

You are probably getting more radiation from the sportfish that comes back to his slip with his 25kw bird finding radar still on to look cool.
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Old 08-04-2015, 11:25 AM   #40
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The owner of the marine elecronics shop where we have purchased all the electronics for both our US boats told me that the only way one could be in danger from the radiation from a typical recreational boat radar like a Furuno would be to hold one's head against the radome of an operating radome for a week.
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