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Old 08-19-2014, 01:14 PM   #21
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Greetings,
I seem to recall some sort of speed limit sign posted around Rio Barcelona (a largish canal in Ft. Lauderdale, FL just north and a bit east of the Los Olas bridge over the ICW). Something to do with manatees and the times water skiing was allowed. How the manatees knew when they could or couldn't water ski was always a mystery to me.
Along the same lines, how does the manatee know where the channel is?

I like the compromise....manatees are safe in most of the waters they enjoy yet man gets a little leeway too....
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Old 08-19-2014, 01:26 PM   #22
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Many manatees have a difficult time maintaining 25mph for any prolonged period of time anyway, so they stay outside the channel.
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Old 08-19-2014, 01:56 PM   #23
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Old 08-19-2014, 02:24 PM   #24
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Many manatees have a difficult time maintaining 25mph for any prolonged period of time anyway, so they stay outside the channel.
The issue is, do they throw a wake?
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Old 08-19-2014, 04:01 PM   #25
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What's a wake? Any displacement of water? A displacement that displeases someone? Anything that rocks your dock? Who's definition of courtesy are we using here?
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Old 08-19-2014, 04:43 PM   #26
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I was headed down the gulf ICW west of Pensacola, but had not made it to Mobile as of then. Wind gusting pretty strong and whitecaps on the water. We were passing a marina on the far side of the channel at a slower speed that the wake, if any, wasn't making it to the marina, when this yahoo "wake police" came blasting out of the marina over to us bitching about our wake. Oblivious to the wake he just created.
Apparently there are good wakes and bad wakes, Good is when the wake police make it, bad is when you make a wake that doesn't reach the marina before it's swallowed up by the whitecaps.
When we came back through, we maintained the same speed we had going, and no one said anything. So yeah, it depends on who is ruffled by the wake if it's a wake or not. Skiers love big wakes BTW.
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Old 08-19-2014, 04:56 PM   #27
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The Florida Wildlife website lists the following under boat speed limits:
Any vessel operating in a speed zone posted as “Idle Speed – No Wake” must operate at the minimum speed that will maintain steerageway.
Any vessel operating in a speed zone posted as “Slow Down – Minimum Wake” must operate fully off plane and completely settled in water. The vessel’s wake must not be excessive nor create a hazard to other vessels.
However, the determination is up to the officer and there are many officers with differing opinions
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Old 08-19-2014, 04:59 PM   #28
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I was headed down the gulf ICW west of Pensacola, but had not made it to Mobile as of then. Wind gusting pretty strong and whitecaps on the water. We were passing a marina on the far side of the channel at a slower speed that the wake, if any, wasn't making it to the marina, when this yahoo "wake police" came blasting out of the marina over to us bitching about our wake. Oblivious to the wake he just created.
Apparently there are good wakes and bad wakes, Good is when the wake police make it, bad is when you make a wake that doesn't reach the marina before it's swallowed up by the whitecaps.
When we came back through, we maintained the same speed we had going, and no one said anything. So yeah, it depends on who is ruffled by the wake if it's a wake or not. Skiers love big wakes BTW.
That happened to me once when I first got my current boat. I called the DNR later and got the scoop, then called the marina. They denied anyone did that even though we saw the jerk race out of the dry stack building and jump in the boat.

If I could go back in time I would have videotaped the whole event.
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Old 08-20-2014, 12:34 PM   #29
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What's a wake? Any displacement of water? A displacement that displeases someone? Anything that rocks your dock? Who's definition of courtesy are we using here?
The oft-repeated saying "you are responsible for your wake" is actually over-simplified.

By federal (and most state) law, you ARE responsible for ANY negligent action on your part. Throwing a wake that you know, or should know, would cause injury or property damage, COULD be considered negligence in court.

Just creating a wake - any ripple or line in the water behind you, is not by itself against the law.

In federally controlled (navigable) waters, the Coast Guard has given the local municipalities broad discretion in establishing no-wake zones. Still, they have to be approved by the appropriate authorities and permitted with the CG. In many areas the CG budget does not support strict enforcement of this, so non-permitted aids (signs and buoys) are common. But still illegal.

If you violate an illegal sign, I wonder how the courts will resolve that.

For me, I'll just stick with courtesy and common sense and hope that I don't become the test case.
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Old 08-20-2014, 01:14 PM   #30
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The Florida Wildlife website lists the following under boat speed limits:
Any vessel operating in a speed zone posted as “Idle Speed – No Wake” must operate at the minimum speed that will maintain steerageway.
Any vessel operating in a speed zone posted as “Slow Down – Minimum Wake” must operate fully off plane and completely settled in water. The vessel’s wake must not be excessive nor create a hazard to other vessels.
However, the determination is up to the officer and there are many officers with differing opinions
It least FL is fairly consistent. What I dont get is in the river to the City of Ft. Myers. Slow Speed, Minimum Wake Manatee zone in the deep channel but 25 MPH zone in the shallows where the manatees hang out.
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Old 08-20-2014, 01:21 PM   #31
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It least FL is fairly consistent. What I dont get is in the river to the City of Ft. Myers. Slow Speed, Minimum Wake Manatee zone in the deep channel but 25 MPH zone in the shallows where the manatees hang out.
t
What's hard to read on those signs are the dates that the limit is effective. Something like Nov 15 to Feb 15. That is especially true up around the power plant.
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:17 PM   #32
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No Wake Signs

If you obeyed everyone's no wake sign you wouldn't get anywhere in a day.

We observe all official signs and of course slow down for fishermen in small craft when appropriate.

The ones I don't like are the fishermen that sit in the middle of a channel in a 20+ foot boat and expect you to go by super slow, I had a guy that was mad at the world the other day on Lake Michigan who yelled at me to stay in the middle of the lake and not 2 miles form shore where we were.
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Old 08-27-2014, 04:32 PM   #33
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Quote:
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It least FL is fairly consistent. What I dont get is in the river to the City of Ft. Myers. Slow Speed, Minimum Wake Manatee zone in the deep channel but 25 MPH zone in the shallows where the manatees hang out.
From my Aphorisms file:

Manatees reside in the nicer, more populated areas. Generally the more upscale and pricey the real estate, the more manatees, requiring more signs and "no wake" zones. Pat Culotta.
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Old 08-27-2014, 05:45 PM   #34
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LIke everything to do with boating, I believe it boils down to common sense and personal responsibility.

I think Ron expressed it very well when he asked what difference it makes if of one's wake is going to damage sometthing belonging to the waterfront "McMansion" or the fisherman in a cheap aluminum skiff?

Whether a no wake sign is official, home-made, or not even there, it shouldn't make any difference to how one operates their boat. They should have the intelligence and common sense to figure out what effect the passage of their boat is going to have on the people and property around it and operate their boat accordingly.

To put one's own schedule and convenience ahead of respect for the people, property,and environment around them is, to me, the very definition of an irresponsible and unintelligent boater.
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Old 08-27-2014, 06:25 PM   #35
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To let people run the world, in defiance of state law, by the means of a piece of plywood and spray paint can, ....well to me means that's the COMPLETE DEFINITION of irresponsible and unintelligent. They have to expect the "regular" not the regulars have to expect the "irregular".

These people buy land long after many generations of laws have been passed supporting the ICW and when they feel because THEY have the money to buy up intracoastal property...they now have the ability to make a boating highway a bicycle path for boaters...well I have little sympathy for the few and I say few because most obey the law and buy lifts...but a few think THEY can control the actions of legislators and thousands of boaters.

It's not about rich and poor...it's about I AM RICH and I'LL BUY MY WISHES ANY WAY I CAN...despite the laws and disregard for the "existing boating community".

Not everyone is out for a holiday on their boat...there's plenty of "business" going on that requires expedience without the hassel of a few "SELF SERVING" I can do whatever I like types.
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:36 PM   #36
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To my way of thinking, the presence of a sign is irrelevant. When the person bought the land and what they do with it is irrelevant. What one thinks of the person that owns the land is irrelvant. It doesn't matter who was "there first." There was no law preventing the person from buying and developing the land in the way that they did, so one's own opnion about what they did or didn't do is also irrlevalt.

The only thing that's relevant is the effect the passage of one's boat will have on the people or property around it. If the desired operation of the boat is potentially damaging or dangerous, then don't operate the boat that way.

If the land owner was smart and put up bulkheads and whatnot in anticipation of what the boat wakes might do, great. But if the land owner wasn't that smart, that doesn't give one the right to deliberately damage his stuff.

As I said earlier, it's called common sense and responsibility. It continues to amaze me how many so-called experienced boaters don't have either one of them.
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:38 PM   #37
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From my Aphorisms file:

Manatees reside in the nicer, more populated areas. Generally the more upscale and pricey the real estate, the more manatees, requiring more signs and "no wake" zones. Pat Culotta.
Seems all bridges are manatees zones too. Never seen one around ours in Englewood but I guess they do pass thru eventually.
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:45 PM   #38
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To my way of thinking, the presence of a sign is irrelevant. When the person bought the land and what they do with it is irrelevant. What one thinks of the person that owns the land is irrelvant. It doesn't matter who was "there first." There was no law preventing the person from buying and developing the land in the way that they did, so one's own opnion about what they did or didn't do is also irrlevalt.

The only thing that's relevant is the effect the passage of one's boat will have on the people or property around it. If the desired operation of the boat is potentially damaging or dangerous, then don't operate the boat that way.

If the land owner was smart and put up bulkheads and whatnot in anticipation of what the boat wakes might do, great. But if the land owner wasn't that smart, that doesn't give one the right to deliberately damage his stuff.

As I said earlier, it's called common sense and responsibility. It continues to amaze me how many so-called experienced boaters don't have either one of them.
Easy to say if you don't do the ditch with regularity.

The ditch is like a superhighway for boats...

While responsibility and courtesy shouldn't be abandoned...there are laws keeping pedestrians, bikers, horses and slow pokes off of interstates that have minimum speeds and motorized mandatory.

Even the states have recognized the need to have reason rule on the ICW and prevent people from putting up those signs that aren't approved...THE STATES recognize the selfishness of people to come along and alter the lifestyle of tens of thousands and equally as many commercial operations.

While limiting takeoff profiles in certain airspace is important...there are places where that's just impractical and people moving into places under those departures have to recognize they are doing so consciously. Should we close every airport because of one noise complaint around them?

No and to make a several thousand mile boat highway no-wake the whole distance is just as bad...especially when the government spends a fortune on keeping parts of it open just for commercial traffic...just crazy....
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:50 PM   #39
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aphormism file

Quote:
Originally Posted by janice142 View Post
From my Aphorisms file:

Manatees reside in the nicer, more populated areas. Generally the more upscale and pricey the real estate, the more manatees, requiring more signs and "no wake" zones. Pat Culotta.
======

Janice,
We were apprised of your post and Pat, THE WIFE, is most appreciative that you saved that and more importantly REMEMBERED. That was quite a few years ago.

CCC and THE WIFE
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Old 08-27-2014, 08:54 PM   #40
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What's the wake behavior of commercial boaters in that waterway/ditch?
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