Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 12-12-2013, 06:38 AM   #21
Hospitality Officer
 
Andy G's Avatar
 
City: Pittwater
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Sarawana
Vessel Model: IG 36 Quad Cabin
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,557
Bruce seems expensive to me also. As I posted in a previous thread , We got a reconditioned Muir motor for our Lofran winch for $245.00. About 5 years ago though.
__________________
Advertisement

Andy G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2013, 02:15 PM   #22
Guru
 
River Cruiser's Avatar
 
City: UMR MM283
Country: US
Vessel Name: Northern Lights II
Vessel Model: Bayliner 3870
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,226
Muir on the Cougar used two different motors, one had power down & the other you had to unlock the ratchet dog back off the clutch & let it free fall. Mine is the power down type & a good starter repair shop can rebuild it for around $100.00, that was in 2010. Bearings, brushes & clean up the armature, if I remember right it was a Fiat part.
__________________

__________________
Ron on Northern Lights II
I don't like making plans for the day because the word "premeditated" gets thrown around in the courtroom.
River Cruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2013, 01:38 AM   #23
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
The winch came back, the terminal cable bolts of the only possible new motor protruding a full inch below the screw on base-plate. Muir: "gee, we didn`t notice that". Unable to cut into the platform the winch sits on (post right underneath), so made a 1 &1/4" thick wood spacer fitting the winch case footprint, thus both allowing for terminals and providing a vital replacement base-plate, and channeled it to take cables, connected exactly as Muir advised, for up only operation.
Got it all nicely fitted, tried it, operating down not up! Thanks again Muir! Pulled the whole thing off, half set Sika under the timber plate and on top of it, Sika mess everywhere (boat, us, clothes, tools), refitted the cables, modified the cable channels, and refitted it. The Sika which should look nice and smooth, looks anything but, probably fixable.
The good part: fixed and fitted before Xmas, fast as a fast thing on retrieve, the existing winch mounting bolts also secure the wood spacer so no extra cut holes in boat.
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2013, 02:38 AM   #24
Hospitality Officer
 
Andy G's Avatar
 
City: Pittwater
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Sarawana
Vessel Model: IG 36 Quad Cabin
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,557
Sounds like a fun day Bruce. I hate cleaning up after a battle with Sikaflex, especially black Sika.

Still you are up and running in time for Christmas.
Andy G is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-2013, 05:44 AM   #25
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,669
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
Bruce, this possibly not a great time to raise this, but my winch used to be up only, but it was not that hard for a marine sparky to make a mod that allowed power up and down...and I love it. I can do the whole anchoring thing from the helm, up or down, and the down is really good when driving into an anchorage from the flybridge where you do get a good view all round in terms of relationship to other boats, and the depth changes are often visible as well.
'course it would have to come off again to do it...sorry...
__________________
Pete
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 01:55 AM   #26
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter B View Post
Bruce, this possibly not a great time to raise this, but my winch used to be up only, but it was not that hard for a marine sparky to make a mod that allowed power up and down....
'course it would have to come off again to do it...sorry...
AAAGGGHHH!!
Today, to accommodate the extra 30mm pad and washers, we fitted 2 longer 316 bolts ( price pre negotiation at Mr.Stainless $30.80 ea) plus a longer coach screw to one corner, screwed into wet bog filler in a screwhole which was holding nothing. I know I should have epoxied it, or plugged and drilled it but the winch has had enough of my Xmas. It`s not coming off foreseeably; if/when it may not be another Muir Cheetah. But it does run fast!
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 07:02 AM   #27
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceK View Post
Pulled the whole thing off, half set Sika under the timber plate and on top of it, Sika mess everywhere (boat, us, clothes, tools), refitted the cables, modified the cable channels, and refitted it.

You couldn't have just swapped the cables around someplace inside the boat?
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-23-2013, 06:20 PM   #28
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
You couldn't have just swapped the cables around someplace inside the boat?
Rick, I appreciate the thought, I`m no electrician, maybe it`s possible, the motor has 3 terminals-up/down/negative, we swapped the power ones. It`s a basic set up, gravity freefall, powered retrieve via the bow footswitch.
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 02:01 AM   #29
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
Something odd. We briefly ran the winch, just to tighten the chain after reinstalling the anchor on the bow, it was fine. Went out overnight, scored a mooring in Sugarloaf so removed the anchor to give a straight run for the mooring line. Departing, we refitted the anchor, confidently pressed the foot switch, nothing. It had rained heavily overnight, but I think we had the winch well sealed, no sign of water entry.
Today we checked for power at all points from footswitch to winch. We get 13.5v all the way to the 2 cable ends which bolt to the the winch terminals. But bolt them on and test, we get no power reading at all. Monday I`ll take it back to Muir. Although the old motor was reported a total write off, two possible successive motor failures, is there something I`m missing?
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 02:26 AM   #30
TF Site Team
 
Peter B's Avatar
 
City: Brisbane
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Lotus
Vessel Model: Clipper (CHB) 34 Sedan/Europa style
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 6,669
Send a message via Skype™ to Peter B
Unlikely Bruce, but hey - here's your chance while/if it's off again to get that mod done so you have power down as well. If possible I'd also have a switch installed at both helms. Standing there in the dark and wet using a foot switch is just not de rigeur any more. You would NEVER regret having the helm up down option, even if you still like to stand next to it and operate a food switch from time to time in nice conditions. I guarantee you you hardly ever would mind you, because then anchoring is a one person thing, and you can then gently throttle back to lay the chain out and dig it in a bit to set it…not that your Sarca needs much setting…and without needing someone else at the helm…or you running to and fro…
Sorry, but if it does have to come off again - or it you ever get a new one, these points are worth considering.
__________________
Pete
Peter B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 06:18 AM   #31
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceK View Post
... the motor has 3 terminals-up/down/negative ... we checked for power at all points from footswitch to winch. We get 13.5v all the way to the 2 cable ends which bolt to the the winch terminals. But bolt them on and test, we get no power reading at all.
Are you saying you are using a meter and get a voltage reading at the motor terminal end of the positive and negative cables with the cables disconnected from the motor? Is this voltage present even when the foot switch is not closed by stepping on it?

Does the voltage reading drop to zero when the leads are connected to the motor but the foot switch is not closed?

Try placing a 12V light bulb between the terminals on the motor and see if it lights up when the switch is closed. Try the same test with the light bulb between the wires when they are disconnected from the motor.

It really does sound like your foot switch is bad. A digital voltmeter will indicate voltage even when the switch has far too much resistance to conduct any useful amount of current. If you are reading voltage without a foot on the switch, that shows the switch is faulty and is leaking a small amount of current ... probably soaking wet inside with seawater.

As soon as you connect the wires to the motor, the motor presents a low(er) resistance and you get no voltage reading. If you don't get any voltage at the connected terminals with the foot switch closed, it's the switch.

Take a battery and jumper cables to the bow and connect to the motor terminals (wires off - don't touch threaded stud directly, connect to nuts only or you will damage the threads) if it works then, it proves the switch is the culprit.
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2013, 08:06 PM   #32
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
Thanks Peter and Rick for responding. We brought the winch home, just tested it on the car battery, and it runs.
We are testing with a meter. We get power at the cable ends unconnected, but connected, switch operated, nothing. The winch working led us to suspect the switch of failing under load or intermittently too. I don`t think we tested for power, cables connected, switch not operated.
I bent (because of how I thought I`d need to fit it) and unbent the lugs on end of the -cable connecting the winch, it seems too flexible at the lugs so I`ll replace it. If nothing changes I`ll replace the switch. I could not trace the earth cable attachment point, I will try that again.
I will leave wiring it to the helm for now, under pressure to get us mobile for NYE fireworks, we need a functioning winch for anchoring in around 20M of water amongst numerous boats.
__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2013, 03:18 AM   #33
Guru
 
BruceK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,562
We changed the foot switch, and all is good. It is well bedded in Sikaflex. This winch motor runs much faster than the old one, I`m sure we had both motor and switch issues, old age probably in both cases. Thank you all very much for your help, especially RickB with the diagnostic steps. We can now think about the Sydney NYE fireworks.
__________________

__________________
BruceK
Island Gypsy 36 Europa "Doriana"
Sydney Australia
BruceK is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012