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Old 04-19-2014, 12:25 AM   #1
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How to build a network on your boat

This subject comes up frequently here on TF.

The typical question are generally

How to get internet on my boat?
How to get alarming or monitoring on my boat?
Todays subject was how to get cameras on my boat?

All of these things point to the need for a dedicated, inexpensive Local Area Network for your boat. You probably have one at home already. Why not have a network for your boat as well?

Your network at home probably uses a Linksys or similar unit that combines a Router and a Ethernet switch, and a Wifi Access point all in one. Your home network typically uses your Cable Company, or your Phone company for a internet connection. Using your home network you can connect to all of the devices in your home. Things like printers, and disk storage, and cameras, and the internet all connect through your home network.

A network for your boat works the exact same way, and can provide the same connections to equipment, and the internet as your home network. The only real difference is that you need a way to connect to the internet.

This is where your cellular company can be your friend. You probably already have a shared family data plan with your cellular company. You can add a device to your family shared data plan for a very nominal expense that will provide a high speed internet connection to your boats network.

I use At&T as my cellular provider. I went into the local AT&T store and a few minutes later I walked out with this little gizmo. It cost $19 to buy it and $10 a month to add it to my shared data plan.



There is a handy USB port on that unit (called a AT&T BEAM) that is meant to plug into a laptop, but I didn't plug mine into a laptop. I plugged it into this little device.




The unit in the photo is made by a company called cradlepoint, and the model is a MBR1200. The current online price for this unit is $249

I plugged the AT&T BEAM into the Cradlepoint MBR1200 and used the handy setup guide to program the Cradlepoint, and viola, I had a network on my boat!

The Cradlepoint MBR1200 serves the same function as the Linksys unit you probably have at home. It is a Router, a Ethernet switch, and a WIFI hot spot all in one.

I even programmed the wifi hot spot as my boats name. .

Now when I go to the boat I just use the wireless hot spot and I've got internet, blazing fast internet anywhere I get a cell signal.

Well, you ask, what did this do for me?

First I added an Apple TV to the network for $99.00. Now I can watch Hulu, or Netflix, or Itunes based movies. Cool!



Then I added a Sensaphone Web600 Alarm system to the boat for $350. Now I have alarm monitoring for high bilge water, power outages, and a host of other things!



The list goes on and on!

I for example added a Cisco IP phone (an extension off of my business phone system), now I can run my business from the boat. (one more step towards full time cruising )

Then I added a wireless printer.

I'm adding cameras next.

The possibilities are endless!

So, My hope is that this post will help remove some of the mystery from boat networks, and how to set them up.
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Old 04-19-2014, 09:52 AM   #2
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Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?
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Old 04-19-2014, 10:17 AM   #3
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Hmmmm. Sounds like something i want on my new boat? Just curious....approx how much does your setup add to your ATT bill? How expensive is a 2 hour movie?
I don't subscribe to extras at home since I retired because we are away from home more than at home so I don't have a comparator.
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Old 04-19-2014, 10:39 AM   #4
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Yes, the key is how much data you will chew up streaming HD movies and the like. Not something I find palatable on a cellular network. A two hour HD movie is about 3.5 - 4 Gigs; standard def around 500 megs+. Even the Sprint and T-Mobile (if they have coverage) "unlimited" plans will start throttling after a certain point.

Most modern computers will form a hot spot without the need for something like a Cradlepoint. That's what we did; we had an iMac on a desk with the cellular USB air card plugged into it and set it up to share via wifi and/or ethernet.

By the way those Sensaphone units are really nice pieces of gear.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:19 AM   #5
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Thank you. You have just saved my day. This is why I spend so much time surfing this forum. This is information that we hardly get for free in a specialized equipment store. By the time you know all this, you have already committed yourself to spend thousands of very rare dollars.
But, then again, a guy like Kevin comes in and demystifies all these issues with a simple and practical wording and we all know what to do.

Thank you again Kevin

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Old 04-19-2014, 11:22 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksanders View Post
This subject comes up frequently here on TF.

The typical question are generally

How to get internet on my boat?
How to get alarming or monitoring on my boat?
Todays subject was how to get cameras on my boat?

All of these things point to the need for a dedicated, inexpensive Local Area Network for your boat. You probably have one at home already. Why not have a network for your boat as well?
Very cool, thank you for the great explanation. I'd like to add cameras to Delfin but wonder whether all the steel will make propagation of the signal troublesome? I guess I'll find out.

Not wanting to highjack the thread, nor is the following any reason not to take advantage of the wonders of advanced electronics, but based on the Nova program "Secrets of the Sun", available streaming on Netflix, we are due for the kind of coronal mass ejection that renders all such technology dead as a doornail for perhaps as long as ten years. Hard to imagine, but it really is only a question of when, not if a CME similar to the one we experienced in 1859 is experienced with the result of no more electronics for a long time, nor a particularly good way to recover them anytime soon.
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Old 04-19-2014, 11:48 AM   #7
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Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?
I think the Cradlepoint units are 12VDC, but that needs to be checked on. It comes with a brick power supply, so I just plugged it in.

I powered the network gear using the inverter. This might sound a bit overboard, but I also added a small UPS to power all that stuff as well. That way if the inverter dies I get an alarm before we loose communication.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:07 PM   #8
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Hmmmm. Sounds like something i want on my new boat? Just curious....approx how much does your setup add to your ATT bill? How expensive is a 2 hour movie?
I don't subscribe to extras at home since I retired because we are away from home more than at home so I don't have a comparator.
I have a shared data plan so I honestly dont track it that closely. Cellular data is not cheap though. I have a 30 gig plan through my business and pay 7.50 per gig, but thats shared between several phones, ipads, and even my home internet (we live in a rural area with slow dsl).

A 2 hour movie is as caltexflanc indicated below between .5 and 3 gig. We use SD on the boat, but I suppose we could use HD as well. We use HD at home and never go over our 30 gig so it works out.

Also as caltexflanc indicated cellular companies might offer unlimited data plans but they start throttling the speeds back at some point. I'd rather get the high speeds and decide how much I want to use and pay for.


Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
Yes, the key is how much data you will chew up streaming HD movies and the like. Not something I find palatable on a cellular network. A two hour HD movie is about 3.5 - 4 Gigs; standard def around 500 megs+. Even the Sprint and T-Mobile (if they have coverage) "unlimited" plans will start throttling after a certain point.

Most modern computers will form a hot spot without the need for something like a Cradlepoint. That's what we did; we had an iMac on a desk with the cellular USB air card plugged into it and set it up to share via wifi and/or ethernet.

By the way those Sensaphone units are really nice pieces of gear.
Yes, you can tether to your cellullar phone (or as you did your MAC) and create a hot spot and buy nothing. The challenge i found with that is that if I actually use my Iphone for a voice call, the data throughput drops dramatically. Then you run into the issue that the phone (or computer) has to be there and be on for the data to work.

Because of those limitations we chose to go with the dedicated MIFI aware router solution. Its not a free solution, but it works all the time. I love the idea that I know that if something happens on my boat while I'm away I get a text and e-mail.

Before that my boats status was a mystery. One time went to the boat and the shorepower breaker was off, my batteries were dead, all my food in the freezer was smelly mush, and if I needed my bilge pumps they would not have worked.

Thats a bad situation, and one I was not going to let happen again.

Just a FYI to everyone...

I am not married to Cradlepoint, or Sensaphone. These are just products I found to work reliably and at a reasonable price. There are other products on the market that will also work, and as technology evolves there will be even more products to choose from.
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Old 04-19-2014, 12:32 PM   #9
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Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?
As mentioned above, find the model that is powered by 12V DC adapter. The one I use is wired to boat's 12V DC.

FWIW, it is Encore ENHWI-3GN3 3G Mobile Broadband Wireless N150 Router & Repeater. It can be used as a wired or wireless router/repeater with your cell based hotspot, or can accept cell based broadband stick and use it to become a cell based hotspot itself. Kind of versatile cheap gadget.

Some more info here ... might be no longer available ... just as an idea:
Amazon.com: Encore ENHWI-3GN3 3G Mobile Broadband Wireless N150 Router & Repeater: Electronics .
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:06 PM   #10
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Kevin...did you have to purchase the 4-20ma transducers from another vendor or can you get them from Sensaphone. Looking at their website I did not see them. Intersted in monitoring the 12 volt and 120 volt systems.

Thanks
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Old 04-19-2014, 02:44 PM   #11
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Great thread, Kevin. I'm on a similar track on my boat, but have not reached the point of having a real vessel network as you have described. Your explanation clarifies some points in my mind and confirms I'm on the right track.

I have a Cradlepoint CTR-35 router onboard. It's available for under $100 and is 12V powered. Mine is hardwired to the boat and connected via ethernet cable to a Rogue Wave Wifi extender to pull in distant free wifi. Often an area restaurant or marina will offer the wifi to customers. I've pulled in free Wifi from almost 4 miles away.

We also have a tablet and two phones that are all Wifi hotspot capable, so if there's no free internet wifi in the area, we can use our 4G/LTE data. Since our marina environment is a bit more weather-friendly, boat monitoring is not a priority for us. Besides, we don't have internet capability when we leave the boat since we take our mobile devices home with us and there's no free Wifi available at my end of the marina.

We have the Netflix App on our devices to watch streaming movies and also have a 110V/12V-powered Roku which we can connect via wifi or ethernet cable. Roku offers a wide variety of content which we have only started to sample. We have only watched one streaming movie at home over 4G to test it out and it worked fine with no buffering and cost about 1GB of data.

I have 2 hard-wired 12V ER cameras that are wired through a camera select switching panel to the HDTV via RCA inputs. Our Wifi or 4G video displays on the HDTV via HDMI.

I need to learn more about the Cradlepoint's networking capabilities to allow input from a wifi capable GoPro camera. I tend to get lost in some of the finer points of router function and setup.
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Old 04-19-2014, 04:46 PM   #12
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Kevin...did you have to purchase the 4-20ma transducers from another vendor or can you get them from Sensaphone. Looking at their website I did not see them. Intersted in monitoring the 12 volt and 120 volt systems.

Thanks
The only 4-20ma sensor I'm running is for the 12v battery. I bought it from omega engineering.

I cheaped out on the sensor for the shore power and the inverter and used 120v relays. They work, but you don't get any more information, just on or off.

I was thinking about converting to 4-20ma for those but haven't been all that excited about it.

The temp sensors I bought from sensaphone, but they are just standard 10k units.
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Old 04-19-2014, 06:45 PM   #13
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Thank you. You have just saved my day. This is why I spend so much time surfing this forum. This is information that we hardly get for free in a specialized equipment store. By the time you know all this, you have already committed yourself to spend thousands of very rare dollars.
But, then again, a guy like Kevin comes in and demystifies all these issues with a simple and practical wording and we all know what to do.

Thank you again Kevin

Portuguese
Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:08 PM   #14
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Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?
Why are you trying to get an Apple Extreme to talk to a mifi? Does the mifi not have enough 802.11 range to reach your computer/phone/tablets?
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:17 PM   #15
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The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.
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Old 04-19-2014, 07:29 PM   #16
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Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?
I have no experience with pepwave. I cruised their web site yesterday briefly. They appear to be a competing company to cradlepoint, globesurfer, etc...

I can tell you that the cradlepoint units can do the same thing. They can choose, prioritize, and even bandwidth share between several internet connections. For example, I have a satellite connection on the boat. If the cellular is within range, it prefers the cellular connection. If the cellular connection is down then it automatically switches over to satellite. You could do the same thing with more than one mifi device as well. Neither the pepwave, nor the cradlepoint have a monopoly on the technology. I could do it with a Cisco solution as well, just more expensive.

Quote:
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The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.
What you need to do to solve this is to tie the mifi into a router, then have all your devices behind the router. That way the MIFI only knows about the router.
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Old 04-19-2014, 08:03 PM   #17
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What you need to do to solve this is to tie the mifi into a router, then have all your devices behind the router. That way the MIFI only knows about the router.
Yes, thanks. Was answering caltexflanc question. Was responding from my phone but it did not use the quote. This is why I was so thrilled to read your thread. Trying to connect an Apple router was a pain and the cradle point or pep wave is a much better setup.

Does the Cradlepoint allow for 2 external mifi or USB connections? Didn't see one that allows for that configuration. Just saw one USB and one ethernet input.
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Old 04-19-2014, 08:23 PM   #18
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Yes, thanks. Was answering caltexflanc question. Was responding from my phone but it did not use the quote. This is why I was so thrilled to read your thread. Trying to connect an Apple router was a pain and the cradle point or pep wave is a much better setup.

Does the Cradlepoint allow for 2 external mifi or USB connections? Didn't see one that allows for that configuration. Just saw one USB and one ethernet input.
The MBR1200 has two USB ports. I haven't tried it though, as I only have one cellular company account, and the satellite makes a great backup.
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Old 04-20-2014, 12:17 PM   #19
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The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.
Ok, got it. Kevin is pointing you down a road that may work well for you. The internet speed of your mifi is the gating factor, the Extreme won't make that any faster.

On our boat, we found the method of simply plugging the USB cellular card into one of the computers and using the network "sharing" function to be more than adequate. We did not have or really need remote monitoring, being liveaboards; even though I was in the business (and still am to a lesser degree) of enabling cellular monitoring solutions, mostly in the energy and agricultural world. That's how I got to see Sensaphone gear in operation.

The iMac sent out a strong enough wifi signal to all parts of the boat. I once hooked up various cellular and non-cellular wireless routers via ethernet (not one of the new Extremes) and didn't see enough improvement to bother adding more complexity. I was in the business so had access to all the various cellular routers and gizmos. I thought the Cradlepoint stuff was as good as anything out there and was generally better thought out and user friendly.

Watching internet TV is not a high priority, we could save that for being at a dock or having a convenient wi fi signal; we had full premium subscription satellite TV which was more than good enough for us. When you get over to the islands, cellular broadband is still a hard to find and very expensive option, a good wifi range expander like the Wirie is more practical, but someday that will change.
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Old 04-20-2014, 01:18 PM   #20
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I already have a Novatel Wireless Mifi2372 that I use to interface my laptop with the enternet from my boat. It is suppose to be able to handle 5 devices. Can I just use the the Mifi to remotley monitor 4 or 5 cameras without using the Cradlepoint? Do I need something like the Cradlepoint to give me more security? Does the Mifi have an IP address that I would be able to access remotely? Would the Mifi have enough range to pick up a camera in the engine room?

As you can tell by my questions this is not my forte.

Thanks
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