Garmin vs Simrad

[ranger58sb]

Chris

Actually what pissed my dad off was they wouldn't allow him to delete the heater, it was an option early but changed over time. He lived in southeast Florida and only drove short distances, my mom's car had the options that were always breaking.

Ah.. the good, ol' days.

Well, maybe not so much, depending on local climate.

And all those nifty things cars do now, that they couldn't do before. Even if things do break, sometimes...

-Chris

 

[BandB]

Here's the order I'd rate for my personal use.

For offshore cruising, Transas. It's used by shippers and commercial vessels heavily and also by many of the ports along the way. Overkill for coastal cruising so on to the rest.

Furuno. We are huge Furuno fans with no problems. We also have Maxsea using Furuno equipment for everything else. Maxsea is very simple and straightforward. We use Furuno as a backup even when not as our primary. Can't say enough positive about it. And for those just looking for charting, don't overlook Maxsea. Integrated out of the box with Furuno.

Garmin. Didn't think we'd like it. On coastal cruising would still choose Furuno, but on inland waterways the Garmin charts are superior to anything else we've seen. Have had no problems with Garmin. The obsolescence issues don't really bother me as I expect that. On the boat we have Garmin, we have everything from their radar to autopilot to sonar.

Raymarine. I used Raymarine first in school while I was using Furuno on our boat. Never liked the Raymarine as well, but that may just have been comfort level. However, used Raymarine on testing Sea Ray L Series boats and it was ok, still didn't thrill me. But my number one reservation on Raymarine was a lot of systems delivered with problems on Sea Ray L Series. Many had to have components replaced. They shipped before it was tested adequately and ready. Of course I blame this on Sea Ray too in installing brand new offerings. Raymarine did respond with quick changes and sending new equipment right out.

Simrad. Have used Simrad autopilots but never their systems otherwise. The choices we had on the Sunseeker were Garmin, Raymarine and Simrad, as those are the three the factory installs. I liked the functionality of Simrad and they were pushing it heavily. We tested one boat with it. However, the more I researched, more people I talked to, the more concerned I got about their customer service. After having been spoiled by years of Furuno and Transas, I would find what many have encountered intolerable. So, no.

On a one to five scale:

Transas for offshore 5, for coastal, overkill 3
Furuno 5
Maxsea with Furuno 5
Garmin 4 but for inland 5
Raymarine 3
Simrad 1-If your customer service is poor, then I don't care beyond that.

Now, also understand that while I have a lot of experience, in the universe of equipment, none of us are more than a blip of experience. Just anecdotal. And, no real concrete evidence of how the universe of boaters feel. I rate Raymarine mediocre, yet due to relationships with builders like Sea Ray, they have a tremendous number of happy users.

 

[Bigsfish]

I guess we like what we are use to unless we have had problems with a product and then it's a POS. A friend of mine installed Furuno in his new East Bay. He loves it I don't care for it, not intuitive to me.

 

[BandB]

I guess we like what we are use to unless we have had problems with a product and then it's a POS. A friend of mine installed Furuno in his new East Bay. He loves it I don't care for it, not intuitive to me.

We learned on Furuno. That's what our first coastal boat had. So, then everything else we tried and learned fed off that. It's odd how that happens, but you automatically think "oh I see...on the Furuno you do this to get that, but it works this way." You really only have to learn the differences and they're minor. The one you learned first may seem more intuitive. After a while of using several brands they all start to blend together.

 

[psneeld]

Yeah..well..... used all manufacturers and most models over the yeas except the last few.

Listing one above another seems still to be personal experience and preference versus any real factual info.

Generalities may be leaning towards some truth...but by the time one can feel good about them...all the manufacturers have changed things......

 

[Bigsfish]

BandB

"After a while of using several brands they all ....."

That's fine for some but I don't have enough brain cells to remember all that stuff.

 

[psneeld]

BandB

"After a while of using several brands they all ....."

That's fine for some but I don't have enough brain cells to remember all that stuff.

Don't fret Irv...unless you are a delivery captain who doesnt carry his own nav package or run lots of different boats...all you need to be comfy with is your own nav suite.

I could use but often use less than 1/10 of what nav suites offer....big deal....it still is 10X more than when I had to navigate when it really counted.

 

[Seevee]

Wow, a lot of good replies....

Twistedtree,
What an interest read on your blog, you really got into details and that info is valuable, thanks. The think that bothers me the most is the lack of response with Simrad. In talking with them over the past few months, they admit that CS has had a lot to be desired and they have taken great strides to correct it, but there's an argument to wait for proof. I find Raymarine similar and Flir says they've solved their issues. We'll see.

Now you scare me about hooking anything to NMEA 2000....

====
BandB,

You're spot on about CS... it it ain't there the product is not worth a dime. And while the promises from Simrad seem to point toward better service, I'm a bit nervous about their promise. Garmin is looking good, again.

 

[BandB]

BandB

"After a while of using several brands they all ....."

That's fine for some but I don't have enough brain cells to remember all that stuff.

There's another difference too. They're all computer systems. I grew up using computers all the time. I used them every day of my career. I can't recall the last day I wasn't on some type of computer including tablets, at some point. So, they're an integral part of my normal life.

Meanwhile, engines are totally foreign to me. I never have even changed oil in a car. Know a little about boat engines but mainly to identify things and no more about fuel filters. So, I have no comfort in an area most of you are skilled.

 

[psneeld]

It's not that, it is just usung the different manufactures' products and sering how the software works....

And they have all changed, better for the most part than when I would work boat shows for a marine electronics dealers and could show every major brand, down to the depths of software in my sleep.

Each had its own pattern, and Garmin came along and was definitely the most user friendly.

Now I am not so sure.....and till you work one for hours they all can be daunting, more than just the basics will require time put in.

 

[Bigsfish]

Scott. - I took my first Pwer Squadron class in the mid 60s, yes Chapman was a god back then.

BandB. - I don't understand computers at all, early in school while still an accounting major we were finally allowed to bring battery calculators to class, since I grew up on a desk calculator this was a real eye opener, they weighed about five pounds then. Progress? Sure, but I can always count on my fingers.

 

[JDCAVE]

Be aware that "Yacht Simrad" is not the same company as "Scientific Simrad". The latter makes very fine, high end equipment. From all accounts, especially TT's, the "recreational Simrad" is not up to reasonable specifications. The scientific stuff is the gold standard, and used by many agencies.

I've got a nice helm station with separate displays and none of it is Simrad. If I want to look at the radar, I look at the radar. If I want to look at the plotters I look at that. Same with the depth sounder. I have no interest looking at everything on one screen. It's just information overload.

 

[klee wyck]

Furuno black box core on Klee Wyck includes 4'radar array and plotter surrounded by a hodge podge of other brands of pilot, AIS, sounder, etc.
It's ok.
Just finishing installing a whole new suite on the boat we imported last Summer and it will be virtually all Simrad despite reading the critiques here many, many times.
Only one thing is for sure and that is that almost any brand I would have installed would have had greater capability than the captain that will be using it. I am sure this will serve me fine. After the demos, I am most excited about the Halo 4 radar array/display. It seemed superior to what I am currently using in terms of what I can pick out.

 

[danderer]

Have you tried getting Raymarine "legacy gear" like an E-120 plotter to connect to one of their new radomes? Or perhaps get an E-120 power supply board replaced recently?

Haven't tried to connect, but I had my 10-year-old E-80 repaired by them last year. Not cheap but they did it.

Here is their stated policy:

Raymarine will continue, where practicable, to manufacture spare parts for up to 5 years after the date of the last manufacture of the product and will continue to repair product, should spares remain available, for up to 10 years after date of last manufacture.

Please note that we will not hold any spares in our factory repair facility for products over 10 years old and that no products more than 10 years old will be accepted for repair at our factory repair workshop.

 

[Bigsfish]

A lot of wiggle room in those statements.

 

[Gordon J]

I have had both raymarine and Garmin. I have been left waiting literally for days trying to contact customer support. Customer support answered all questions evening a seven year-old system. Took no longer than five minutes to get answers.

Map data all comes from same sources so I dont get preference for one manufacturer o over another.

Gordon

 

[twistedtree]

Raymarine will continue, where practicable, to manufacture spare parts for up to 5 years after the date of the last manufacture of the product and will continue to repair product, should spares remain available, for up to 10 years after date of last manufacture.





Please note that we will not hold any spares in our factory repair facility for products over 10 years old and that no products more than 10 years old will be accepted for repair at our factory repair workshop.

Here is their stated policy:

I actually think that's a reasonable policy, and commend Raymarine for having it publicly available.

Having been a manufacturer required to provide and fulfill such a policy, I can tell you that it's quite difficult to do, and requires more than a little guess work. The hardest part is that once you stop building a product, it becomes difficult to impossible to get parts. Even during active production, parts will often go end of life and you will have to make a last time buy. So you need to forecast how many more units you expect to build, plus how many spares you want to support the 5 year commitment, and the 10 year goal. And you don't want to overbuy because you are just throwing money away. And sometimes the parts you are buying are very expensive. No manufacturer wants to buy parts sooner than they are actually needed, let alone expensive parts, let alone based on shaky forecasts, let along based on unknown failure rates and repair requirements. And for repair, you ate typically swapping out whole modules, not parts. So your spares are things like screens, circuit boards, power supplies, etc., all of which is expensive stuff.

So companies that make a service commitment have their work cut out for them, and you can start to see why consumer product companies make no such commitment and just push you to buy something new. After all, that's the most cost effective for the company - repairs only to the extent they have parts, and in a perfect world once they ship the last built unit, they have no more parts. And it enhances revenue to sell new product vs repair old. But of course it's all at the expense of the customer. For cheap products we accept it, but for an expensive electronics suite, it's really pushing the tolerance of buyers, and why so many people favor Furuno.

 

[Dan Cahn]

Simrad

We purchased a Simrad NSS 12 with 4G radar this year. We have had no trouble and would recommend it. Admittedly I have no experience with competing products.

Dan